Please excuse me but I'm ready for the lynch mob. . . Its my Mana Q.

I would order one Sound Frame or a Mini Table and try it out on top of your existing stand or just on the floor to see what the Mana effect does to your system and if you like it.
I have my CDS I on a Mini Table on top of my Apollo rack and it works great.

Ciao!

Willem

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So, calling Mr Pig, pd and all the Mana avangelists, what would be your first Mana step with my system (about 600UKP to spend at first).

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I would definitely go source first. The biggest single improvement will come from getting your LP12 onto a Mana table. IMHO LP12s just don't work right off Mana!

You say you have 600 quid to fling at your system: I would probably get a Mana three tier rack and a Reference Top. I would put the CDX and the 82 on the shelves, and the LP12 on the Referenced Top shelf. This will maximise the performance of your source components and preamp, which are the most sensitive to placement. It would also give you the opportunity to keep the components with large power supplies away from these key components using your old rack.

Cleaning up the sound at the speakers as you plan may just point out that the front end is not delivering the goods as much as it could.

Tony.

I have a small system in my dining room comprising CD3.5+hicap/32.5+hicap/140 all mounted on a sound org 5 tier rack.

Last year I plonked a Mana sound frame on top of the racking with the CD3.5 mounted on the sound frame.

The improvement in performance was noticable and well worth the cost of the Mana. So I did what you are thinking about and I would go ahead if I were you.

The only downside is the appearance

Regards

Mick

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The only downside is the appearance

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Obviously bare in mind whilst reading this that Mick's idea of cutting edge style is a pink knitted tea cosy and matching toilet roll cover set.

I remain astonished that Mick actually likes the appearance of Naim kit, in which form is dictated by function in exactly the same way as with Mana. Mana is simple and very discrete until massive numbers of additional levels are added. It also has the smallest footprint of any other stand I have come across (it looks about 8 to 10 inches narrower than the Fraim).

Tony.

The Naim look is classic....we both agree there.

Mana looks like industrial shelfing.

Regards

Mick

PS...I allow the wife to put wooly cosies on the loo rolls because it looks ok. But if she did it to the Hifi......ex wife.

The difference (if you compare dims given by both companies) is a shade over 5 inches.

Why not hear the fraim before committing to the mana? -I think it's in the shops very soon. I am surprised that people are assuming that the fraim will not bring the same benefits to a turntable as to a naim cd player ( who has heard a sondek on a fraim?). The mana brings benefits to cd and vinyl, I would strongly imagine the fraim benefits both also.

B4 audition, which could change everything, I have instinctive reasons for wanting Mana not Fraim:

1. Mana is cheaper
1a. Mana make Mana, Naim do not make Fraim; they design Fraim and have it made by someone else = another margin to incorporate.
1b. Mana sell Mana; Naim dealers will sell Fraim and need their 30%.
1c. Naim have taken about 10k of my money - its time someone else had a turn

2. Mana is upgradable - ad infinitum it seems (I have a 12 foot ceiling and a pair of steps).

Q. Has anyonde listened to LP12 on Fraim? - The question's been asked at least 10 times by now.

Q. Has anyone put Mana on top of Base01 or vice versa?

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I want Mana so I called Damien expecting the advice to start with Reference Tables for sources. Instead he advised a rack but I explained that I'd just bought Base.

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If you got a GREAT deal on the BASE, then you should be able to unload it and recover your costs or make a profit. So buying the Mana rack should be no problem. OTOH, if you like what the BASE does, you may not like what the Mana does - they are very different. And I wouldn't suggest combining the two.

From what I read, you:

(1) don't care how the rack looks,
(2) like the idea of stacking to the ceiling, and
(3) are a bit nutty - you bought a BASE rack whilst you were shopping for a Mana rack.

All in all, I belive this makes you the perfect candidate to buy and be happy with a Mana rack.

- GregB

Insert Witty Signature Line Here

Seriously, I like what Base does as far as it goes - it seems neutral - doesn't push forward, pull back etc. Does that mean I can't like/have Mana too?

Seriously, I like what Base does as far as it goes - it seems neutral - doesn't push forward, pull back etc. Does that mean I can't like/have Mana too?

I may not be as mad as I seem since I bought Base cheap for amps/PSs and then rang Damien about Mana for sources - it surprised me that he first wanted me to buy a rack since from what I've read sources benefit most from Mana. Naturally, I was doubly surprised that his next gambit was to support the speakers.

I bought the Base rack because I had 7 shelves already and did not wish to waste them - I don't mind spending money but I'm not keen on chucking out stuff. I don't think I'd get much selling the Base bits.

But I want Mana!

if you have made up your mind about Mana, then fine, it is a good system especially as you are unconcerned about appearance.

Have you considered Hutter.

Decoupled base on spikes =£151
3 shelves @ £133.33 =£400

Total =£551 inc delivery

This set up would be able to accomodate 3 black boxes plus your LP12 and will be within budget. Naim used to use this system at the HifI shows prior to the introduction of their own stand.

The sonic quality is excellent and the appearance is good. It comes in a choice of wood finishes, it is not MDF. Less of a dust trap than Mana.

Before spending this sort of money, its best to hear both systems. Mana is more in your face and would probably appeal to the more brashful listener whilst Hutter is more soft and musical and appeals to the more refined audiophile.

I think you cannot go wrong with either Mana, Hutter, Ash Design or Naim Fraim.

Regards

Mick

I spent thousands of dollars on Mana, even though many told me it was the wrong path--Believe me when I say its NOT worth the trouble. Racks should be seen and not heard--I cannot stress this enough..

I was wondering when the famous forum postman would enter my arena - A few nasty words about Mana from Mick and - presto!

Chris

PS: I have a web site now...its still in Beta testing, but you can check it out: www.spotshooter.com

Welcome back......thats the nice bit over with.

Vuk...Mana is very much in your face...thats its appeal, even Piggy would agree with that. Mind you he can't listen much until he gets his cost a fortune eleven year old knackered out 250 back.

I was very kindly invited to another forum members house to see and hear Hutter first hand. Both Sue (the wife) and I were most impressed by its sonic presentation. The appearance was a welcome bonus.

On this basis we decided to purchase Hutter for the lounge and possibly mana for the dining room.

I am currently sourcing Dealers in Europe for the best deal and expect to place a firm order next week.

I may lend you my Leica once you have mastered the art of photography, Leica encourages a more intimate style of photography due to its complex and timely operation and you are not getting the relevant experience on that gismo that you use.

Although its good to see you back, may I suggest you pop over to the other forum which is going through a quiet patch following various threats and black magic cursing by two prominent members.

Regards

Mick....a devotee of music as it should be heard and not some artificially hyped up blurb.

On reflection your snaps aren't too bad, perhaps better than mine. One of my last masterpieces was taking a shot only to find a telegraph pole coming out of the subjects head.

You are not having the M6....however I could be persuaded to swap it for your 52.......interested.

Regards

Mick

Good to see you back on the forum. Mick & Sue came round to our home after the Bristol show for a spot of supper & some music. I had fairly recently changed from Mana to Hutter & Mick was interested to hear how it sounded.

As I only use a humble 32.5 & Mick has an 82 I thought that it would be difficult to present something that Mick would enjoy as much as his home system. After a couple of 'adjusting to new system' tracks I felt that Mick & Sue enjoyed what was playing.

From my own experience I find that Hutter is much better than Mana at portraying the whole musical picture, better flow & cohesion etc.

Early music is a genre that I enjoy & I have quite a few albums. I can honestly say that, try as I have, I can't understand this edgy violin thing.

I found that Hutter is seamless & unforced throughout the audio spectrum, not giving any undue prominence to any instrument or frequency band. YMMV, as I understand it did during your trip to our shores.

If you like I would be happy to be a totally impartial judge for your photographic tussle. BTW I think your Ansell Adams'esque shot is fabulous.

Best wishes,

Bob

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Early music is a genre that I enjoy & I have quite a few albums.

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ah, interesting. i am a fan of "early music" too -- i have, literally, a few albums. quite a few jodi savall if this can be so classified. one or two gothic voices, etc.

i can assure you that you know a lot more than i do as i dont know that much about classical (my home base is jazz, but hey, its all music). i would therefore be interested in some recommendations from you.

enjoy

ken

Vuk, email me about the P9 - I'm inbetween turntables and contemplating defecting to a P9 (although I may end up with a new LP12 if the P9 fails to impress, although I will give it its chance). Email is tc@mt-roots.com

Good tidings to y'all, I'm off to sober up with a (glass) bottle of Irn Bru and some sounds...

John TC

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As I only use a humble 32.5 & Mick has an 82

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I think the 32.5 is much closer to an 82 than most admit

[URL=http://naim-audio.infopop.net/1/Open Topic/s/67019385/a/ga/ul/2261903812/Froggle_with_32.5JPG]32.5 with Froggle[/URL]

See Sproggle

I have a 82 in my first system and a 32.5 in the second so comparison is easy.

The 32.5 is a total bargin, it costs peanuts and sounds good. Even with a 32.5/140 set up, your system beats 95% of the other stuff on the planet.

However, the 82 is well ahead but cost a lot more. Going from 32.5 to 82 was my best ever upgrade.

Regards

Mick

My interest in medieval music started in 1975 when I worked in a record store in Bristol. A girl whom I worked & had a bit of a thing with played bassoon for a few orchestras ( apparently bassoonist's are thin on the ground & in much demand ).

She got me into medieval music & the band Gryphon. I was 18 & although my roots were in R&B, rock, blues, Zappa etc. I was also into jazz & medieval music!

All my albums were bought at that time so are exclusively vinyl. I've just had a lot of fun going through them. They are on some fairly obscure labels, Oryx, Pye 'collectors' series some on Turnabout. Turnabout were always quite cheap & specialized in this sort of stuff. A lot of the music I have is from various parts of the world, France, The Imperial Court, Ireland etc.

The one I selected as a good introduction to this stuff is Medieval Music performed by the Jaye Consort with Gerald English singing tenor. It is on Pye & the cat # GSGC14092.

A great translation of a French lyric on this album is "I sing of a comely lass who has captured my heart. If only that cuckold of a husband would get his arms broken, I might find more favour with her"

I do find my delight in this genre slightly marred my the TV Blackadder series ( glorious piss takes I grant you ), a bit like the beautiful tune Greensleeves has been ruined for me by the ice cream trade & more recently telephone 'hold'modes.

Enjoy,

Bob.