Gyrodec question

I had a Gyro/QC (I now have an Orbe)......An SME IV or V is an excellent match. I also found the Ortophon MC25FL (about £220) to work very well....I now use a Lyra Helikon

Best wishes
Laurie S

I have a Gyro with RB600 arm which is an RB300 with better bearings and cabling for about £400 and works well. My next choice would be up to SME IV or V if funds permitted. Most arms work well on the Gyro as far as I'm aware but make sure you obtain the correct arm mounting plate for the arm you use from Michell because they are designed to weigh a specific amount to ensure the subchassis remains in balance.

I've used AT OC9 and Dynavector DV17D2 in mine and have been pleased with both but if I had the cash I'd get a Lyra.

I don't think you'll find the Gyro a downgrade from the LP12. They are both fine decks but in my opinion the Gyro is more dynamic and more neutral than the LP12 so I chose it in preference. In a famous comparison between Oracle, LP12, Gyro and mastertape the Gyro was considered closest to the tape.

Hope this helps,

Jonathan

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The main reason for this is I have terrible problems with footfall vibration with my current TT - LP12/Akito/Sumiko BP with new Lingo - and want to see if the Gyro will be any better in this regard without sacrificing (too much) sound quality (too much).

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I’ve owned a fair few decks in my time and have always found non-suspended ones far less prone to footfall than bouncy ones. By the nature of the Gyros subchassis it may well be better in this area than the LP12, but I would be surprised if it were as stable as say the suspension-less P9 or Nottingham Analogue. The LP12 is great at absorbing up and down movement – I can give mine a good hard bounce whilst its playing and it won’t jump, but a slight front to back movement and it looses it.

Have you tried different locations within the room? The corners of a room are often more stable, as are alcoves. It’s a shame to downgrade a great turntable to an average one just to stop footfall (that should wind up the Gyro owners, now to run away…).

Tony.

Although I've only had it a fews days, the Gyro appears a lot more resistant to footfall vibration than the LP12. Also, on first listening it appears clearer and 'louder' I think because it doesn't have the slightly woolly mid-bass colouration of the Linn either.

Once I've got used to it, I'll check on the OriginLive mods and possibly the VC PSU upgrade.

BTW, the cart is an ADC ZLM. Any feedback on this; good/average/rubbish?

Another question - the bearing oil reservoir needs a top up; what oil is used? (I know SevenOaks stocks Gyros and probably know but I can't stand the arrogant b*****ds!

Steve C 01

Welcome to the Gyro club! It's nice a few more people can appreciate the merits of a deck which is more neutral and dynamic than an LP12.

The oil in a Gyro is Mobil 1 Fully Synthetic motor oil - the factory will send you some in a small bottle if you phone up which makes applying it to the bearing rather easier than doing it with a Halfords can! Details at www.michell-engineering.co.uk

In addition the factory offer excellent servicing and tune ups/restorations and love doing them according to the engineer I spoke to when I was there.

Have fun,

Jonathan

As along-term Gyrodec owner and one who has used a variety of arms on the deck, I'd say the SME IV or V are the best match. The Gyro brings out the best in the arm and vice versa. The SME can sound a bit bass heavy on other decks and it's weight can upset T/Ts like the LP12 etc..

The OL RB250/300 are also good for those on a budget and I've heard good things about decks fitted with the VPI arm.

Fitting a QC PSU is a no-brainer but IMO the best upgrade for the Gyro is the "Plus" package of Orbe platter and dampening material for the sub-platter. You lose the pretty gold weights, though.....

Hi there,

As a long-time Gyro owner, I can certainly vouch for the DC motor. I went from the AC motor with QC power supply to the DC motor with the standard transformer (not even the VC) and it was noticeably better, particularly in the timing department, which now shows up the LP12 for the wobbly mess it is - both sonically and physically (there you go Tony:). One day I'll buy a VC to max it out.

As to arms, I prefer the SME IV to the SME V which simply sounds over-engineered to me on the Gyro, though it seems to work in the Orbe (odd that). An alternative which I found very good indeed was the Wilson benesch ACT0.5. This is a unipivot arm, and it's recognisably so sonically since it has a very fluid presentation. The SME gives more slam and weight than the Wb, but I think I would choose the Wb for its more fluid cohesive presentation. Michell can make the appropriate armboard for these. I haven't heard the Morch arms which really look the business.

As to cartridges, Dynavector 17D2, XX2 or Te Kaitora would be my first choices since I love their dramatic and powerful presentation. However, the Ortofon MC25FL and KontrapunktB are good options too. I recently heard the Lyra Lydian B for the first time in ages and although I still think it has a relatively harsh treble, there's no denying its immediacy and pace - good value for money methinks. Oh - John Michell uses a Koetsu Red Signature and that used to sound fabulous (if a little lean) on his Gyro (now Orbe).

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

[QUOTE]Originally posted by Jonathan Gorse:
In a famous comparison between Oracle, LP12, Gyro and mastertape the Gyro was considered closest to the tape.

Which one was considered closest to music.

syd

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Originally posted by AndyR:

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Which one was considered closest to music.

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So one of the turntables was magically able to add back "musical" things that weren't on the master tapes was it.....??

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And why not? If I remember rightly this comparison took place about 15 years ago in HI FI ANSWERS and the concensus was that the Gyro was closest to the master tape but that it wasn't necessarily the most enjoyable to listen to. I can't remember all the participants or even if Iv'e got the Magazine right. Often systems that go for the closest they can to the master tapes (in my listening experience) sound clinical. Who wants to hear all the joins and drop ins made by the producer and editor. Other systems which I have enjoyed over the years seem to get closer to real live music of any type. The music comes across as more coherent. Whether or not this is added or subtracted to the master tape doesn't really matter to me. The experience of listening to live music is what I seek from my system.

Yours in Music

Syd

Syd,

The comparison I was talking about was an article I saw on the web involving a dealer and a studio engineer in California - will try and find the link. I wasn't aware of it being published in Hi-Fi answers but you may be right.

It's interesting that you are suggesting a sound which is coloured and musical is closest to a live performance. I'd suggest that the closest to live would be the same deck that was closest to a master tape ie the most neutral.

Anyway - what the heck does it matter as long as you enjoy your LP12 and I enjoy my Gyro!

Happy listening,

Jonathan

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Originally posted by AndyR:
So one of the turntables was magically able to add back "musical" things that weren't on the master tapes was it.....??

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Andy,

I don't know how much difference there is between reel-to-reel decks, but in theory a record produced with very low losses from the best tape deck might be better than the same reproduced on a very poor tape deck.

Admittedly, this seems an unlikely setup for a hifi magazine feature.

cheers, Martin

Hi Martin and all:

There was a discussion recently on the Analogue Addicts list which questioned the validity of the 'closest to the mastertape' exercise. The premise for the argument is that the music on the mastertape has itself, already been through microphones, preamps, mixing board etc. (not to mention the vagaries of the playback system) and is therefore not fit as an ideal for which to aim.

Having experience recording some stuff for BBC local radio in my younger day, I agree with the proposal.

Best Regards,
Mark Dunn

Simon

Sorry it took so long to answer.

Although there might be some run-in time, your description is indicative of poor setup. Ensure that the plinth is horizontal. Then check the subchassis is both horizontal and lies just above the little (wool?) discsat the base of the legs. Tap the spindle until the subchassis is bouncing. It should bounce straight up and down and it should make no sound. Any sound will probably be made by the subchassis rubbing or hitting the motor unit. Move that until there is no sound. The oscillation of the subchassis shouldn't last long (say 30 seconds).

Ensure that the belt is fitting nicely in one of the grooves on the platter and preferably as horizontally as possible so choose the closest groove. Also make sure the belt doesn't hit any of the pillars and that the pillars are set into the subchassis. They should be a slip fit but they should have no play when seated.

This could just be a mismatch. I don't know the OL 250 at all well. Generally I feel the RB series of arms are less than a good match but there is nothing out there that I can recommend for sensible money (i.e < £600). Also, I'm not a fan of the AT OC9, preferring things like the MC25FL from Ortofon. AT's tend to sound mechanical to me.

That said, you may just not like the presentation of the deck!

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

AndrewR wrote:

>The thing is that the master tape is a control, a constant between the decks and surely getting something that sounds as close as possible to
this original (however flawed it may be) is still a noble pursuit.<

Fair point. The contention on the AA list was that 'philosophically' (not really the right word) speaking, we can never do a truly valid comparison in this fashion because the original performance is always changed by the recording process. This extends to the cutting lathe too, I suppose.

We could cut down the problems by using a direct-to-disc approach at the recording stage. Now where's Thelma Houston...?

Best Regards,
Mark DunnM