Music Which Hasn't Aged Well

Disagree.

Having said that, I can't get "See me....feel me...touch me...heal me" out of my head.

Paul McCartney solo

A very subjective topic, as some music retains a memory of a certain time. Some music feels great when it comes out, or is part of a a movement but loses its relevance quickly.

Most music from the 70's doesn't date for me, but music from the 90's often does. I do not like much music from the 80's, so 90's music came as a great relief to me, but some of it now was probably liked for not being 80's music rather than on its own terms. I got into music in the late 70's so those three decades are a broad point of reference to me.

90's albums that have surprised me by dating:
LT Bukem - 'Logical Progression' (1-3), without the newness of the rhythm, the progamming and production sounds mushy.

Radiohead - 'OK Computer', Thom Yorke's voice just grates on me now, but the surprising thing is the songs sound a little formulaic ten years on. 'Kid A' kind of made a jump of inventiveness that puts 'OK Computer' and 'The Bends' in a different light.

Massive Attack - 'Protection', the title track is still enjoyable, if difficult to listen to on a good hi-fi with that huge wash of undefined bass, but the rest of it seems to offer little these days.

From the 80's the whole neo-prog movement (Marillion, IQ, Twelfth Night, etc.) sounds like bands of fans copying music from the previous decade, rather than musicians exploring what came naturally to them.

In contrast these albums are timeless and will never date for me:
Led Zeppelin - 'Physical Graffiti'
Pink Floyd -'Wish You Were Here'
Orbital - 'In Sides'
Underworld - 'Dubnobasswitmyheadman'
Pearl Jam -'Vs'
Joni Mitchell -'Hejira'
Miles Davis -'Kind of Blue'

Some albums are very much of their time, ie. not timeless, but date well as a representation of that time:
Van Der Graaf Generator -'Pawn Hearts'
Yes - 'Close to the Edge'
Tangerine Dream - 'Rubycon'
Mike Oldfield - 'Tubular Bells'
Japan -'Quiet Life' and 'Tin Drum'

I really don't know about David Bowie and Kraftwerk, their music seemed ahead of its time, so now it is obviously from the past, it seem to avoid the question. Maybe they are timeless in that case. I suspect Smiths fans may find them the same.

All very subjective, and I am quite sure others will have the opposite reaction to some, if not all of these albums.

I have a couple of versions of Jennifer Warnes Famous Blue Raincoat and I think the songs stand-up and vocals too, but the musical arrangments sound like the worst of the jazz-synth scare of the 80s.... Whenever I listen to it I always think it's a real shame she didn't go for a stripped down approach and it stands in marked contrast to the versions the great man sang on his recent tour - mainly because of the choice of instruments and the arrangments.

A great pity....

A lot of Prog...
Robert Fripp, commenting during re-mastering the Krim back catalogue, said of "Prince Rupert Awakes" that "Rupert should have stayed in bed that day". I must concur... It, and stuff like it, doesn't age because of the particular style, particularly, but because the creators were over-reaching their creative powers but weren't in a position to see that at the time. Kudos for trying to push the boundaries, but pushing boundaries like "Discipline" did worked much better than "Lizard". Only with hindsight can both artists and audience see that "new" isn't necessarily "good".

Thinking on it more, actually a very big slice of pop. These days we generally hear vintage stuff that has aged well, but look through a chart list of bygone years and most of it has either been forgotten or is pretty cringe-worthy fare.

Pete.

quote:

Originally posted by JamieL_v2:
Massive Attack - 'Protection', the title track is still enjoyable, if difficult to listen to on a good hi-fi with that huge wash of undefined bass, but the rest of it seems to offer little these days.

Interesting - I always used to say the same in that every system I've had previous to getting a "decent" setup from here has been that the bassline on "Protection" (the track, not the album) was horribly mushy but on my office setup (NaimNet NNP01 + Allaes) or on my home setup (252/SC/300/NBL) it actually sounds controlled and even - dare I say it - punchy ... I find I can actually listen to that album happily now after years of hating it for having that mushy bassline.

Anyway - my nomination for music that hasn't aged well:

Paul Hardcastle - Zero One

...and...

The Frank Chickens - Best Of Frank Chickens



Phil

They seemed like a good idea at the time, but the Sex Pistols sound very dated to me - I think they were the X-Factor of '77. The Tony Wilson bands also seem to suffer the same fate - not the type of thing I'd spin on my turntable these days. I also think things like hip-hop and rap sound very very dated, but perhaps that is because I just don't like that kind of thing - they just remind me of the 80s and Thatcher.

I disagree with the statements about progressive rock and feel the best of it is virtually timeless. As a rock album Eldorado has never been bettered and is probably the record I've played more than other. I'm stunned that any sensitive man or woman would not treasure this ELO masterwork.

I guess, we'll all have prejudices and likes and dislikes, but I'm still of the opinion that ELP created some the best albums ever and that their debut, Tarkus, Pictures, Trilogy, Brain Salad Surgery and Works sound as good now as when they first hit the shops.

So it is all opinion and no definitive answer to this question. So to add to the controversy, I think Frank Sinatra, Dean Martin, Ella Fitzgerald and Des O'Connor all sound very dated (Dik-A-Dum-Dum excepted, of course). I'd sooner listen to Dean Friedman.

anything by Peter Gabriel , just to upset a few. I think his years with Genesis were crap Collins bought life into the group( i now await knife in back). His SO album was okish. Then he started going down hill. So Sorry hes not that good.

quote:

Originally posted by ray davis:
i now await knife in back

quote:

Originally posted by Lontano:

quote:

Originally posted by ray davis:
i now await knife in back

thanks mate.......shoud i keep looking over my shoulder ...

quote:

Originally posted by ray davis:
thanks mate.......shoud i keep looking over my shoulder ...

no need for that. it's a view and one thing I do agree with you on was Collins did a lot of good for Genesis up until Duke.

By the way The Knife from that album Trespass pictured above has some real big fans round here.

cheers mate, I have always liked Phil Collins so i am biased. I know a lot of people just cant handle Gabriel Leaving Genesis. But i do not think they would have been that successful if he had stayed.

quote:

Originally posted by ray davis:
But i do not think they would have been that successful if he had stayed.

guess we'll never know but I would agree with that - my fave period of genesis (by a whisker) was early collins trick of the tail, w&w, seconds out but i also totally love the gabriel era and think his solo music is still fab.

You guys are having a laugh, aren't you?

Funnily enough - Hendrix.

During the time of his career - 1967-70 - he was basically God in the UK (sorry Eric). Groundbreaking too as the first black artist to be adopted as one of us by a generation of horrid white Britishers. In contrast, the Doors had a handful of hits and weren't played much after The Soft Parade album... and Morrison's death was almost disregarded as I remember.

Contrast with now, when the Doors (along with the Velvets) are international icons, with new young fans everywhere it seems, while the Hendrix albums, though loved by my generation for nostalgia value, seem to me horribly dated.

Cue brickbats....

quote:

Originally posted by Andy1912:
I have a couple of versions of Jennifer Warnes Famous Blue Raincoat and I think the songs stand-up and vocals too, but the musical arrangments sound like the worst of the jazz-synth scare of the 80s.... Whenever I listen to it I always think it's a real shame she didn't go for a stripped down approach and it stands in marked contrast to the versions the great man sang on his recent tour - mainly because of the choice of instruments and the arrangments.

A great pity....

Always felt the same way about that album.

quote:

Originally posted by Salmon Dave:
Funnily enough - Hendrix.

During the time of his career - 1967-70 - he was basically God in the UK (sorry Eric). Groundbreaking too as the first black artist to be adopted as one of us by a generation of horrid white Britishers. In contrast, the Doors had a handful of hits and weren't played much after The Soft Parade album... and Morrison's death was almost disregarded as I remember.

Contrast with now, when the Doors (along with the Velvets) are international icons, with new young fans everywhere it seems, while the Hendrix albums, though loved by my generation for nostalgia value, seem to me horribly dated.

Cue brickbats....

I listened to Patti Smith's Easter last night, well tried to and I found it appalling. Apart from Because The Night the rest of it was trite, shrill and, frankly puerile.

steve

quote:

Originally posted by Paper Plane:
I listened to Patti Smith's Easter last night, well tried to and I found it appalling. Apart from Because The Night the rest of it was trite, shrill and, frankly puerile.

steve

With you on this. I haven't been able to get into it at all.

quote:

Originally posted by Salmon Dave:
Funnily enough - Hendrix.

During the time of his career - 1967-70 - he was basically God in the UK (sorry Eric). Groundbreaking too as the first black artist to be adopted as one of us by a generation of horrid white Britishers. In contrast, the Doors had a handful of hits and weren't played much after The Soft Parade album... and Morrison's death was almost disregarded as I remember.

Contrast with now, when the Doors (along with the Velvets) are international icons, with new young fans everywhere it seems, while the Hendrix albums, though loved by my generation for nostalgia value, seem to me horribly dated.

Cue brickbats....

No brickbats, just a different opinion. The Doors for me were an irrelevance in their day, even more so now. Can't understand why you think they're international icons while Hendrix is a nostalgia trip. Have you read the papers or listened to the radio in recent months?

I like Hendrix, the Doors and the Velvets, but think they were all of their time - not that it matters as I can still enjoy them - though they lack the timeless quality of Sandy's Fairport Convention or Incredible String Band or Nick Drake or Sir Ray Davies. Perhaps because the second group were more focused on the quality of the songs whilst the first were more focused on the quality of performance.

It's amazing how we all have our individual perceptions isn't it? For me the Kinks are forever locked in 60s London. Superb but that's where they are. Fairports were pleasant but I couldn't listen to them without thinking of the whiney voiced Aran clad finger in the ear folkies my mates used to drag me to see. I enjoyed them then and still do, occasionally, but I'm always thinking of those early 70s folk pubs in Glasgow. Apart from a couple of songs the Doors were nothing to me. When I hear them now I think my mum would have liked them.

Hendrix however I found almost impenetrable in my early teens but he was so cool it wasn't the done thing to say that. I get him much more now but it's often still hard work. He's still a work in progress for me.

quote:

Originally posted by ROTF:

I disagree with the statements about progressive rock and feel the best of it is virtually timeless.

I said "a lot", and that doesn't take in the best, of course...

quote:

As a rock album Eldorado has never been bettered and is probably the record I've played more than other. I'm stunned that any sensitive man or woman would not treasure this ELO masterwork.

The first album I ever bought! I don't think as much of it as you seem to, but I think it's good and still stands up. On the other hand...

quote:

Tarkus, Pictures, Trilogy, Brain Salad Surgery and Works sound as good now as when they first hit the shops.

Well, they are as good today as they were then, but that's still not any good...

I don't think it's any secret that a lot of the artists involved have admitted some stuff wasn't actually up to much. Pink Floyd aren't that complimentary about the likes of Atom Heart Mother and the solo bits of Ummagumma, Fripp's comment about Prince Rupert Awakes isn't the only negative thing any Crims have had to say about bits of their back catalogue, Rick Wakeman has derided Tales From Topographic Oceans, and so on. But there's still plenty of their back catalogue they'll stand by and say it was good, and I'd agree. If you like ELP murdering Mussorgsky nobody can stop you, but if messers Gilmour and Waters say the following of Atom Heart Mother:

"(Atom Heart Mother) was a good idea but it was dreadful. I listened to that album recently: God, it's shit, possibly our lowest point artistically. Atom Heart Mother sounds like we didn’t have any idea between us, but we became much more prolific after it.”
- David Gilmour - Mojo Magazine - October 2001

"I think Atom Heart Mother was a good thing to have attempted, but I don't really think the attempt comes off that well,"
- David Gilmour - Rolling Stone - November 2001

'I wouldn't dream of performing anything that embarrassed me. If somebody said to me now: "Right...here's a million pounds, go out and play 'Atom Heart Mother'", I'd say: "You must be fucking joking...I'm not playing that rubbish!". 'Cos then I really would be embarrassed.'
- Roger Waters — interviewed by Richard Skinner - BBC Radio One - originally broadcast: Saturday 9 June 1984

then I think there may same indication to its ardent fans that it's not aged as well as Dark Side of the Moon. It is all subjective, but then so are the relative merits of Dollar and Beethoven. You can't prove the latter better more than former, but I think you can demonstrate it to be more musically significant, and the same goes for badly aged back-catalogue.

Pete.