HMV - What a horrible experience!

I find the prices of cd's and dvd's in my local HMV are much higher in the shop, than on their web-site.
It's like they want us to shop from them on line.

...Hmmm, buy on line from home and safe fuel traveling costs too! : )

nymph

It's not often I get to the racks as the shit music they play usually drives me out. If I do manage to actually look for some thing the number of albums is poor and the prices are ridiculously high.

So we love music and hate high street music shops

quote:

So we love music and hate high street music shops

Some music and some music shops maybe?

Never noticed if Fopp even plays music in their shops,if they do it's certainly not as intrusive as HMV's offerings.

went into the oxford street hmv store last week which is massive and tend to agree with you all....walked in couldnt find anything in music that interested me but would have had a field day if i was after dvds or games ! so spun around walked out and went straight on the pc to get everything i wanted cheaper, quicker, easier.....thats why these stores will go to the wall! and deservedly so.

I agree with all the above. However, I heard on the radio recently that HMV have reported much improved results, so they probably think they are doing a good job. Ironic really.

That will be financial results from selling PS3's, IPODS, DVD's, T shirts, posters, books, magazines but not from Music from the store outlets.

I understand the overheads are less on line but the stores should paint a better picture!

Well this morning i resumed to buying on line, a very relaxing experience and one that will continue fro a long time to come.

URBAN

KK

KK,

don't forget to check out the bargain cd's on playdot!

i've purchased lots of superb music cd's off playdot for 2.99
... and that includes p+p too ; )

nymph

I didn't used to mind paying OTT prices in HMV when they carried a good back catalogue and you could more or less guarantee finding what you wanted.

Those days are long gone and it appears there's a rush by High Street retailers to ditch CD in any meaningful form. Borders, for example, have been busy running down their stock for a good six months now.

I suspect the bricks and morter CD retail business is pretty much finished, in favour of the online model, whether you want physical discs or downloads.

God you miserable bunch of misanthropes its like the Naim equivalent of Grumpy Old Men.

HMV Oxford st has a fantastic selection of music especially Classical and Jazz but if you want more independently minded shops and I posted about them enough go to Sister Ray, Rough Trade, Phonica, Tape & Record exhange, Sounds Of The Universe, Revival Records etc etc... and prices will be more everyone is just used to the silly low prices on line and cannot anyone understand why running a big store in any major city might have more overheads thus higher prices.


YOU HAVE A CHOICE USE THEM OR LOSE THEM



Dean..

I must admit i prefer zavis .tel

I go into HMV in the High Street, Worcester, and whilst it certainly does not have the serene ambiance of my favourite independent record shop - The Outback in Church Street, Hereford - it does not strike me as the desert being described by some here.

Okay, they stock no classical music [and The Outback stocks only classical and Jazz], but I do buy films on DVD in there. Yesterday I got them to keep The Pink Panther set with Peter Sellars for me. The staff are pleasant, and if not too rushed often very willing to help find something or order it.

They seem to do a lot of trade, and so I suppose they must be doing something right. The music is less loud in the films section.

George

quote:

Originally posted by naim_nymph:
KK,

don't forget to check out the bargain cd's on playdot!

i've purchased lots of superb music cd's off playdot for 2.99
... and that includes p+p too ; )

nymph

Hi nymph,
Have a look here:-

http://hmv.com/hmvweb/navigate.do?&pPageID=3267

Regards

Chris

Ii shopped in hmv in Kingston this week for the first time in four years. Having read so much doom and gloom about music shopping in the uk I was pleasantly surprised at the choice and some prices were very good. I was able to buy a lot of good jazz releases.

No complaints from me.

Thanks for the heads-up Chris, I may have to raid the piggy bank now! : )

I completely agree with KeanoKing, that is exactly my experience of HMV, and Virgin (or whatever it has been rebranded as).

I also know that these shops were part of a cartel that kept CD prices artificially high before the internet allowed open competition.

I am saddened to hear that HMV is making a profit, I hoped that they would die out as web sales took over.

I love shops like Sister Ray and some of the other independents, sadly no good ones left here in Leeds (Jumbo is awful), but I suspect they will lose out as the web takes over.

In the end, with the web, I now prefer to buy direct from the artist if at all possible, if it costs a little more no problem, the money is going to someone I care about.

Jamie

To wish any decent company to fail is utterly deplorable. Many people work for an honest wage in such companies, and to wish their employer out of business speaks of an unworldly and beastly attitude concerning people no better or worse then you or me.

I hope you will take back that extremely callous, if possibly careless, remark.

George

Dear George,

i don't think Jamie really means it like that or wants it in for the employees of HMV, from what i know of him he's too kind hearted for that sort of carry on.
You've also got to consider that HMV have a thriving web-site that may be making the money to help keep their shops open...
This year i've purchased a couple of classical cd's from the HMV shop and after getting back home on my computer have seen the same cd's on the HMV web-site for a few pounds less with free p+p.
If anyone's got it in for the HMV shop employee's it's the HMV directors themselves promoting the same products on their on line service at far less cost.

It also costs me £3 in fuel to travel to my nearest HMV shop plus a couple of quid for parking... it ain't worth the hassle!

That's my excuse anyway ; )

nymph

Our local Zavvi in Northampton does seem to be making an effort. They have in-store performances by local artists lined up and have a section for local bands material. They are also apparently planning to re-introduce some vinyl (although this has yet to materialise).

The two members of staff I have dealt with recently have been very helpful, knowledgeable and enthusiastic. One of them also made an excellent music recommendation.

I also agree. HMV in Oxford street is too crowded,difficult to stop and browse as being constantly bumped by other shoppers. As soon as you walk in you want to leave, the music is to loud like constantly at an acid party. Then I saw their website. What a relief. I bought a DVD 'Troy' for my son for £3.

quote:

Originally posted by GFFJ:
To wish any decent company to fail is utterly deplorable. Many people work for an honest wage in such companies, and to wish their employer out of business speaks of an unworldly and beastly attitude concerning people no better or worse then you or me.

I hope you will take back that extremely callous, if possibly careless, remark.

George

Sorry Geoege, I did not mean to cause offense.

However, I do not consider HMV a 'decent' company as they were part of a cartel that ripped off those who love music, film, and the arts in general.

I would not wish anyone to lose their job, but I hope those wishing to work with music can find better employers to work for.

I remember a similar situation a few years ago when EMI (I think) paid off Mariah Carey $40 million to release her form the contract they had with her, this lead to job losses, and she was signed by some other company. I would certainly not wish to be tarred with the same brush as her.

Dear Jamie,

The old price structure for CDs was an odd thing, and somehow the majors [EMI, Sony/BMG, RCA and Universal] actually did control the retail price of CDs, so much so that they could advertise the price of their releases in the Gramophone Magazine!

That HMV record shops [not actually part of the HMV Recordings which is the largest EMI classical record label owned in the UK] sold according to this price arrangement does not in my view single them out for particular criticism. It would be a bit like blaming Waterstones [for example] for selling books within the price structure of the Net price arrangements, which allow for the price of the book to be printed on it, rather than set by the retailer.

I do agree that the arrival of such budget labels in the CD market as Naxos, has largely put paid to the old pricing arrangement, and I welcome this. Really the old pricing structures remain in a vestigial sense that there are still designations for budget, mid and full priced. But the boundaries have become blurred, and sometime you can find a so-called full priced issue at more or less budget price on occasion.

On the issue of "online" pricing versus off the shelf "in retailer" selling. I can definitely say the HMV are not unique in selling in shops at a premium compared to what the same issue can be obtained for off the net.

Testament issues are one or two pounds more expensive from a retailer than off their own online shop. There is a good reason for this. It cuts out a complete layer of storage, picking, and stock control, let alone employing staff to man two lots of despatch and billing etc. I like my favourite independent record shop, but it is twenty-five miles from Worcester. That amounts to virtually ten pounds worth of petrol just to get there nowadays, so obviously my visits are all too rare in recent times, whereas I have started to use the online method for reasons of cost and even possibility.

_________

I was quite saddened to read of your wish to see any business, and one that is not better or worse in the moral sense than most others in the business, fail, because this would disrupt the livelihoods of that company’s employees.

For the kind of money that can be earned in retail, like for those involved in food production, this is basically as low as the law allows, and I can definitely tell you that potential employees, do not turn down a job offer based on some high minded principle that they would prefer to work for an "honest" independent, and turn down a "dishonest" multi-branch retailer's offer.

The truth is the retail price is likely to marginally higher again at a small independent shop.

That is what stuck in my craw. Please do not take it personally, but I do suspect that many more of than may have realised it yet, may be very grateful to still have our own jobs in perhaps twelve months to two years. I think we should wish everyone the best of luck keeping their own jobs, and bare in mind how difficult it really is when employment stops.

I know. I have been there. Sorry for being such an old grump, but this hit a nerve with me.

ATB from George

I get most of my music online but like a browse around a proper shop. Got a few cds today at good prices at Zavvi, good sale now at the Bluewater store.

Very good points George.

The market for classical music is a little different to rock and pop. The classical department at places like the HMV superstore in Oxford street is largely manned by very different people to those in the popular sections of many of their shops, very knowledgeable and helpful.

The same is true for jazz, and probably other specialist sections.

I do find the experience of KeanoKing to be very true of the branches like the Leeds, browsing through shelves for CDs was something I enjoyed a lot in the past, but no longer as the atmosphere in the shop is unpleasant.

With popular music, whilst shops like HMV were selling albums at £13-16, small shops like the now defunct 'Mr CD' were selling the same releases for £8-10 a few hundred yards away in the centre of London. The pricing of some releases may have been set by the labels, but not all, and shops like HMV did make considerable profits at the expense of their customers.

Another practice used by shops such as HMV is to have 'sale or return' displays of releases the record companies are heavily promoting. When you walk into a HMV store and see a rack of several hundred copies of say a 'Kylie' album, the store has not had to pay for these as an independent one would, but only pays for those sold. This is the same practice as is used to sell newspapers and pornographic magazines, and skews the market towards a number artists who are often chosen for their market-ability rather than their contribution to culture.

My objection to HMV is to the practices of the management, sadly this can not be divorced from the jobs of those who work under them.

I do not wish any individual to lose their job, but I would hope that as business models change that those with a love of music can find more rewarding places to work than I suspect is the case at HMV, etc. As you quite rightly say, with the current worsening economic situation, to have any job is something to value.

There are many individuals I would wish no disrespect to, but whenever I buy products I make decisions that if followed by others of similar views will inevitably have impact on jobs - Fair Trade foods, not buying the produce of certain countries whose regimes I strongly disapprove of, avoiding retailers whose shareholders vote to continue cruelty to animals, and also retailers who have in the past profited unfairly at the expense of their customers.

As you say many have no choice who they can get work with, hopefully if there is more support for those companies with greater respect for both the artists and customers, more jobs will be created there. I am being naive and idealistic.

As an aside one of my real pet hates is the term 'Human Resource Management' which is a way of taking the word 'person' out of 'personnel' so that those making decisions about other people's lives can do so without being reminded of how their decisions affect others.

Thanks for the discussion, Jamie

Dear Jamie,

I agree that as purchasers, we should buy from good outlets [in every sense], and avoid those who, especially, trade in a shocking way.

Your point about HR is entirely true. It indicates that the workers no more significamt than the bags of flour they lug about. To be thrown away if found not completely perfect, used and moved on from with another batch.

I worked in one such place for twelve years, and at one take-over was made redundant, but offered a new position under the new owner at less money [at the time a cut from £4.80 to £4.30 in 1995].

I kept my employment, under the new terms. Eventually I walked, after far too long, and since then it has been very hard to find "permanent" gainful employment, and the periods of unemplyment between "agency" short posts have been a source of significant problems. I have a happy job now, though yet wait to see if it is actually permanent.

I think many employers of low paid staff are rather like the move from calling personel, to human resources! I do not think it naive to hope that by patronising better retailers [and buying better products], things can improve, but many people don't care.

"I am alright, Jack," is definitely alive and kicking in Britain today ...

ATB from George