CD5/Nait5 at audition

I'm new to this forum in that I registered. It was a great thread to read, and actually the first one since I came back to the forum after I purchased my Naim system.

I was amazed by the problems with the performance of the CD/Amp combo. Why? Well, when I got my gear, I knew that it would take some time to really get going, but guess what. I placed it in the Fraim, and really, it was great from day one, and getting better by the day. The Fraim really does something good to the system. I love it. It is so much better than the Cyrus system I was used to...

There's one thing I'd like to comment on, and that's when I compare vinyl against CD. I recently got the Gyro SE, and started playing my records that I also have on CD, and wondered whether there is a substitute for vinyl - I mean, the CD 5 is great, but, well, vinyl is at times - and many times - even greater! It gets you into the music even more than the CD5 does. At times I'd rate the CD as "clean" when compared to vinyl, though not heartless. CD5 does a great job but can't beat vinyl at all times.

Ozren
seems like there is a happy ending to this thread.
Good that your satisfied with your new gear.
Another couple of weeks and it will probably be even better. Perhaps with some fine tuning of your es 12´s ( didn´t know at first what speakers you have),wich I btw think is a really good match, it will really sing.
Gunnar

Hi Ozren

I also now have a CD5 & Nait 5. Burn-in on the CD5 took about a weekend for me. What is your current opinion of the Nait 5 compared to the Nait 2?

Rana

I demo'd a CD3.5 versus a CD5 upon the launch of the CD5 back in August 2000, and the CD5 sounded more natural and unforced than the 3.5. The 5 also has better image focus and more accurate timbre.

I found that the 3.5 tended to mimick the music rather than reproduce it faithfully - those leading edges with the 3.5 were over-exaggerated, imho.

Both played the tune about as well as each other.

OTOH, the Nait 3 was clearly better than the Nait5, as it was more lively and involving. The Nait 5 did sound rather anodyne in comparison, and seemed to rely on a much longer warm-up period to really come on-song and start playing the music with any kind of balance and body, whilst the Nait 3 seemed to be able to play music from the outset.

The CD5 and Nait 3 was the most synergistic combination of all the slimline boxes I had at hand at that time.

Regards,

Steve.

The proof of the pudding...

quote:

---

if a nait 5 can make even an ARCAM CD player sound good then it can't be doing too many things wrong

---

Hmmm. A good amplifier's job is to reveal what is going wrong upstream...

BTW, I never said that the Nait 5 was a bad amp, only that the Nait 3 is better, imho.

Regards,

Steve.

The proof of the pudding...

Hi guys !

This weekend I was on a little summer uverture vacation. One of first things which I was do after come back home is that I was going to read what's new on forum. I am so happy that is so much of you which share my happines about my (finally) CD5. You all know that I am from Croatia and possibility to catch some advise is off. You guys are help me a lot, first of all just to not give back CD5 to "dealer" after two days. I was reading this forum for years with hope that my day will come and yes it is with CD5. I must say that I was learned so much here and I think that I can give some advice to newbies like I was been in past. I was dreamed about CDSII/52/250 for years (ok, now to, but with more down to earth), but now when I listen to CD5 I know what it's Naim about. You are all read in some hi-fi magazine that the "sonic picture was naturally streched between the speakers". Yes, shure, me to and I was just THINKING that I was heard that on for example Levinson/Revel system which I was heard. But CD5/Nait2 do that thing (sorry on word, but I just can't use any other) so f....n good that makes me crazy. Another thing which CD5 bring to my home is fantastic and realistic hearing of human voice. EVERY gear which I was heard before gives to much bas and something which makes vocals to sound unnatrually weight (some like that, I don't). A resolution... very good (what would it be if Naim make some 24/96 player?)
I can speak so much about that, but there is one more thing which I want to say and I do it with passion. I rediscover my more than 800 CDs again, but in right way. What more to say for CD5...It is fantastic what burn in can make to this product, from enough wrong overall timbre to so natural that I was amazed. As I said, now I know what Naim want to say and how they imagine music at home.
Thank you again,

Ozren

p.s. Rana, I must say that I am really not happy to say that Nait2 is much better than Nait5, but it is. I was hoping that Nait5 should be my next step after CD5, but it certainly wouldn't. Nait 2 is a truly legend and is made by genius. I was decide to not sell it ever. About Nait 5. I was found it sound to forced and undisciplined in order to naturally presenting of music with Nait2.
Nait2 have a better resolution and overall presentation and I enjoy it much more and the 13 W morethan Nait 2 is almost unheard.

Hi Ozren,

good to hear you're this happy. And yes, a lot of folks like the Nait 2 better than the 5.

So instead (of the Nait 5) your next step could be getting a second hand Hi-Cap for the CD5. It really makes the sound hang even better together.

Hi-Caps usually come in the 750 Euro range. (Pay attention to the serial number, though. The Cap should not be older than say, 4 years.)

Herman

Hi Herm !

Glad to see you again. I was thinking about that option much, but for now I was really satisfied with CD5 alone, but on the other hand adding hi-cap to it is a worth and not cost so much improve.
But now I got other ramblings on my mind. I would like more power which is much more expensive because I don't want to reconfig. my Nait 2 to pre, because I want to leave him like it is. So, I must buy whole "new" pre and power amp. I would like to go for 102/Napsc (102 can't be powered by itself, isn't it?), or if I buy Flatcap2 for CD5 then I can feed CD5 and 102 together from FC2. I am not shure which is better - CD5 and 102 powered from FC2, or CD5 from Hi-Cap and 102 from Napsc? O.K. that was just future options, because I need some financial recovering from CD5. Can you tell me one thing... I was heard that 72/140 are just a little better than Nait2 (personally don't believe that just a "little"), what do you think and what ps/pre/power combination you prefer for my Epos 12 between 2000-2500 GBP. Not much, but that's life.

Ozren

Ramblings on my Mind

Hi Ozren,

Suffering from upgraditis, right? You know the advantage of getting a Hi-Cap, is that it's not an entire system overhaul. You like the Nait 2, you like the CD5, and if you add a Hi-Cap you'll like 'em even more.

Changing the Nait 2 for a NAC 102 would mean you'd have to get a power amp as well. The little NAPSC wouldn't suffice. So you'd have to get a NAP 180 or 140, plus the NAPSC and a Hi-Cap to serve the 102.

That's a very nice system, but it's gonna take a while to get there. If you really want to get there: a lot of people just stay with the Nait 2 and enjoy the music.

Like Julian says: should you get a Hi-Cap for the CD5 you would always be able to use it in the bigger system: either in the same position or with the NAC 102. That's what's so good about those Hi-Caps. They're the most versatile things Naim ever made.

Plus they're really cute.

Herman

Herm,

Can you make some things clear to me. As I know 102 need Napsc to power only digital parts of it, didn't it? So, Napsc should be ALWAYS connected to 102, but just to power digital circuit and the second PS is a must to power everything else?!
So, if I buy 102, I should buy Napsc and let's say Hi-Cap and my pre amp adventure raise to GBP2000. Hm, it's a hard way. I think that I should get some Hi-Cap to make some company to my CD5, then maybe 102/Napsc/140, but is it bad to feed 102 from 140 (if it's actually possible)?

Ozren

Hi Ozren,
Been away for a while. Just checked on the forum and saw your post. just like you to know that i had exactly the same problem as you with the CD5. I had an arcam 250/black box 500 combination running through a Nait2 and kans. When the Arcam needed repairing....again! I decided to buy a new player instead. I auditioned the Arcam Cd 92, Linn Genki,Cyrus cd7q and the Naim cd5. I took my own amplifier and speakers to the dem. I didn't like the cd5 at all, i found it dull and 'shut in'. The arcam was soggy, the Cyrus was very detailed but not musical, so I bought the Linn.
At home it was a different story! I found the Genki awfully bright and forward, how some people can describe it as dull is beyond me! I persevered with it for a couple of days but I couldn't get on with it at all. I rang my dealer who said, 'no problem, bring it back and take all the other players home that you auditioned'. So i did. I prefered the cd5. I bought one!
After listening to it at home for a couple of weeks i realised that I wasn't really enjoying it. I missed the open midrange and the bass drive of my old Arcam. It was musical alright but something was missing. Then i started messing around with amplifiers to try and put back some of that magic. First a 42-5/snaps/90, then a 62/140 and a 42-5/110. This took a couple of months and I still wasn't happy.
Over this period of time of course the CD5 must have run in. This morning in a moment of madness i decided to junk all my Naim gear and buy something else. I put the old Nait2 back on and bloody hell it sounded superb!I'm happy again!
The moral of this story is....don't judge the cd5 until it's thoroughly run in, I'm enjoying my cds more than i have ever done.
The nait2 is a fantastic amplifier. I will not ever,ever,ever sell mine. I've sold two of the pre-powers allready, just the 42-5/110 to get rid of now. The humble Nait2 buries the lot of them!

don't worry, be happy

You always want to know, don't you, Ozren? In order of necessity with the NAC 102, the Hi-Cap comes first, then the NAPSC. I.e. there are more people who have the Hi-Cap combo.

However, no one has the 102 without a proper power amp. I don't think it's nevessarily bad to power the 102 with the 140. However, other members would have to clue you in on this, because I have the 180. I've never even seen a NAP 140.

Also, my recommendation would be to enjoy the music, instead of immediately fretting about future upgrades, possible or impossible.

Herman

Julian,
My CD5 is sitting on same shelf as my Nait2 just about 15 cm next to it. Is it make any sense to put away CD5 from my amp?

Caddyman,
Your'e absolutely right, man. Two of my friends have Arcam cd players, one of them have Arcam 250 transport which is converted by Arcam pre-amp which have dac inside (older model), other friend have Delta270 cd player and my Alpha 8 cd player is much more better than they players. I was heard some new Cyrus cd and found it non musical and somewhat empty sounding. I have heard cymbol cd player but sounded too muddy. I have not heard Ghenki yet, but just a few days before I was auditioned CD5, my dealer tells me that Linn madegood players, but that Ghenki is just beginning of something and that it's not a player for me.
You said: " First a 42-5/snaps/90, then a 62/140 and a 42-5/110. This took a couple of months and I still wasn't happy. "
Did you mean that Nait2 is better than that to you?
Herm,
You always suprise me with something. Thanks.

Ozren

Ozren

I had a Nait 3 but I replaced it with a 32.5/250. This has a different sound to the Nait 3. I thought first of all that I had lost the involving characteristic Nait 3 sound - but after listening for a short time I realised that I hadn't lost anything. When I first switchd on the replacement system it was what I had gained that I was listening to and it took me a little time to realise that what I have now is just more than I had before. Switching back to Nait 3 and my reaction was - yes I do really love that sound - but I prefer the new sound. The Nait 3 stays with me but as a second system. My 32.5 will be replaced in due course with 82 or 52 (second-hand).

The advice offered about Hicaps and Flatcaps is worthwhile. I have now a Flatcap on my CD3.5 and a Hicap on the 32.5. Again the sound changed but for the better. I wish I hadn't bought Flatcaps (I have 2) because the Hicap gives greater flexibility for the future (eg for 82) - but I will be able to sell them for approx the purchase price.

What I am leading up to is to make a suggestion that greater experimentation can be carried out if you buy second-hand. For example if you buy a 32.5 and Hicap you will be able to sell the 32.5 later without losing much financially. The Hicap will be useful for other purchases if you decide to upgrade - or you can sell it too. The important point will be that you will then be able to try out - with little cost - other Naim amps to see if you can improve on the Nait 2 as far as your listening is concerned. The 32.5 is a great purchase.

Good luck

Terry

[This message was edited by plynnplynn on MONDAY 03 June 2002 at 14:08.]

Osren
In my humble opinion, the Nait2 gives you all the famous Naim qualities in a small neat and cheap package. I've had Naim amplifiers for about 15 years now. I've heard/tried most of them and the more expensive ones don't give any more musical satisfaction than a good Nait2. just read postings on this forum and note how many people are constantly upgrading and worrying about their systems. The problem with buying upgradeable gear is that you will always want to upgrade it! I'm not slagging off people who do that, each to their own, but if I ever get to the stage where I'm wondering whether to buy a supercap/nap500/thousands of pounds worth of racking to make my system sound any good, then I'll shoot myself.
My CD5/Nait2/lp12/Kan system plays music just how i like it.The Nait can't be upgraded, it cost me 160 ukp 7 years ago, I love it. I don't worry whether it would sound better hi-capped because it can't be done, i just enjoy it.
just stop fretting and enjoy what you've got. I've messed about with my system over this last couple of months. I was stupid. I like what I've got and I'm sticking with it!
Buy loads of music and go to loads of gigs. that's what i do. After all it's about enjoying the music, not worrying about your tackle!
Regards..Caddyman.

Nait 2

I agree with the interestingly named Caddyman (Kin of the Candyman who Can, perhaps?).

I've never heard of a Nait 2 owner who wasn't truly happy with his li'l boogie machine. Just hang on to it, Ozren!

Herman

quote:

---

but surely naim's music first philosophy means that if it sounds good it is good

---

Double hmmm.

Naim's philosophy (iirc) is source first in order to achieve the goal of music first.

The amp is only a good as the source component.

Regards,

Steve.

The proof of the pudding...

A 2nd hand Hi Cap on the CD5 would work wonders...

Bob