Obama's First Year

quote:

Originally posted by ROTF:
Will you guys treat Mr Parry with the respect he deserves as a long term supporter of trade-unions and the rights of good, decent hard working people - thank you.

This forum is a nice place where men and women share honest and cordial views about life, the universe and why, as sane people, we all detest PC.

Have a beer sir

Ah come on Mick, i quite enjoy your posts.

Please contribrute more, it's hilarious.
same as on the other forums.
On a more serious note, i think it is too early to tell what Obama has acheived or hasn't acheived. He comes across much better than the ex drunk golf playing texan spouting on about smoking people out of their caves.

Regards, Steve

Steve

The membership has to decide on whether it wants a sensible vibrant forum or whether it just wants to dumb down. Usually you get mixture of each. What has happened recently is that the dumbing down element are becoming more popular and hence the overall number of postings is dropping. Dumb stuff is ok in the short term but in the long term it is a definate turn off.

Regards

Mick

Hello Mick.

There seems to have been quite a few posts of the 'not as good as it was' variety recently, and by definition I'm unable to agree or not.

A common component of the posts though is that they never give examples. It makes little sense to complain of something without specifying that something.

Please, an example or two or three would be appreciated.

Regards, Paul.

Paul

I agree that it is dead easy to fall into the trap of looking back with rose tinted glasses.

However, 5 or 6 years ago this forum was bursting at the seams with a massive number of postings from people who were really into the hifi and also it was political but nearly always backed up with wit.

Compare that to the "wit" posing as drivel in this thread alone. Also the number of postings is way down and that must suggest something.

Be honest, what is the incentive to post here when all you get is something a 10 year old kit could beat.

It hardly affects me now has I rarely login any more, so if they want to dumb down then let them, but the reality is that they are strangling the place to death. I have to be honest, it does sadden me but thats life.

Regards

Mick

By and large it is only you that consistently complains about it "not being as good" etc. Seems the answer is in your own hands.

Bigh47

To be frank, you are part of the problem, the only time you excel is when you start up an obituary.

Look I accept that I am in the minority, so I am quite happy to call it quits, but it is sad to see how you guys have dumbed it down. Just read your own comments in this thread and you will see what I mean.

Regards

Mick

Anyway, to pick up the actual subject of the thread...

Obama has sold Patriot systems to middle-eastern countries bordering Iran and stationed some "at ready" naval power in the Med.

Has he belatedly wised up to the fact that maniacs and bullies are more likely to chop off the hand of friendship than grasp it?

What does the forum think (given that it still can, presumably, following the latest posting developments)?

The budget makes use of flash so move cursor to explore further details. A few thoughts about the planed and future missile deployment and sales.

quote:

former US Ambassador to the UN John Bolton thinks this is the leading edge of an Obama Administration capitulation to Iranian nuclear ambitions

Strange. A response of a new defense posture to a threat is a "capitulation"?

Is that some sort of "Neo-Con Newspeak" from the U.S. Ministry of Truth?

Roy T, interesting numbers, not seen them all together before

Re Obama's dilemma in The Gulf & the build up of military capability:
I have worked in the region for years & have my own opinions, but to pose scenario type questions to all readers, especially in light of the post Iraq politics & the stalemate/loosing/winning situation in Afghanistan, I am interested in others views.

Based on accurate factual intelligence & non-political common sense & we left Iraq to its own devises in 2003
(a) would the regional powers - Saudi & others - have sorted out Saddam & his regime on their own
(b) would we still be facing a destabilising situation in the region
(c) would Iraq just be a nuisance carbuncle on the regional landscape.

Same question on Iran
Same question on Afghanistan

For what its worth & not appear so insensitive over Afghanistan.
Dealing with it as a whole country will never work, they are a diverse band of local rulers & war lords making money from opium & living at a subsistence farming level. Trusting Afghanistan as a whole (not individuals) is unwise in the extreme. Our forefathers failed (Khyber Pass & all) the Russians have failed, & it looks like a negative for what's going on now.

Mike, The Gulf region is filled with many peoples, some who reside mostly within a single country while others are scattered across the region and it is this mix that may well hold back countries from operating in unison. Another line of thinking is to include Israel who is without doubt a player and someone who has influence upon the US posture in that part of the globe.

Yes, many peoples.

It's interesting that many of the countries in the region have availed themselves of the USA's Patriot systems as a defense against their fellow Muslims...

According to the Iranians, it's the "Great Satan" USA that they should be scared of.

You buy the right tool for the job be you Israeli or Saudi and the USA sell the right tools for the job so that's a Win-Win all around. If you have the time you could always work you way through the budget detail and see just how much is spent is subsidies to Israeli and Saudi arms buyers as I expect it amounts to rather a large figure indeed.

quote:

Originally posted by Mike Dudley:

quote:

former US Ambassador to the UN John Bolton thinks this is the leading edge of an Obama Administration capitulation to Iranian nuclear ambitions

Strange. A response of a new defense posture to a threat is a "capitulation"?

Is that some sort of "Neo-Con Newspeak" from the U.S. Ministry of Truth?

Sometimes I think that the Neocons won't rest until half the planet is incinerated.

The middle east is a quagmire that you become embroiled in at your peril - Iraq is the perfect example, and Afghanistan even more so.

Obviously the US have to be there for the oil, their strategic interest in the region. Forget promoting democracy, keeping people safe, and all that BS.

Until the US forces their proxy state, Israel, to make real concessions and afford the Palestinians proper status and a viable state to live and develop in there will be no long term solution, and continued distrust of the US in the Arab world.

The missiles are there to protect the ruling families interests in the respective countries, not their subjects. I suspect that the general populace would not want them to be there.

Also don't underestimate the fear that the Arab states have of Iran. Iranians, while moslems, are not Arabs, and Iran is 90% Shia, with most of the rest of the Arab world is Sunni. There is a very long history of distrust between the two.

In my travels in the gulf I've found the somewhat strange contradiction that no-one really likes America as a state, but everyone wants to go and live there. The propaganda power of TV/Movies I guess.

quote:

Originally posted by Colin Lorenson:
The middle east is a quagmire that you become embroiled in at your peril - Iraq is the perfect example, and Afghanistan even more so.

Obviously the US have to be there for the oil, their strategic interest in the region. Forget promoting democracy, keeping people safe, and all that BS.

Until the US forces their proxy state, Israel, to make real concessions and afford the Palestinians proper status and a viable state to live and develop in there will be no long term solution, and continued distrust of the US in the Arab world.

The missiles are there to protect the ruling families interests in the respective countries, not their subjects. I suspect that the general populace would not want them to be there.

Also don't underestimate the fear that the Arab states have of Iran. Iranians, while moslems, are not Arabs, and Iran is 90% Shia, with most of the rest of the Arab world is Sunni. There is a very long history of distrust between the two.

In my travels in the gulf I've found the somewhat strange contradiction that no-one really likes America as a state, but everyone wants to go and live there. The propaganda power of TV/Movies I guess.

Colin

I agree with every word of that. America needs to be out there to protect the oil supply.

However Obama does seem to be spending one hell of a lot of his tax payers money at the moment and his efforts on the environment (which is where I thought he would have done well) are woefully imadequate.

Regards

Mick

[quote]Also don't underestimate the fear that the Arab states have of Iran. Iranians, while moslems, are not Arabs, and Iran is 90% Shia, with most of the rest of the Arab world is Sunni. There is a very long history of distrust between the two.

In my travels in the gulf I've found the somewhat strange contradiction that no-one really likes America as a state, but everyone wants to go and live there.[/quote

So much for the "Umma" being a solution to the world's problems. Feh.

Of course they want to go and live in America - everything about it looks better than the repressive, morbid sinkhole they're living in right now...

"In my travels in the gulf I've found the somewhat strange contradiction that no-one really likes America as a state, but everyone wants to go and live there. The propaganda power of TV/Movies I guess."

America is a great place to live if you are a terrorist.
To be sure,shoving dollar bills in the g-string of a stripper the night before you fly 2 planes into your choice of targets is a great place to live.

Sometimes I think the Romans had it right. When a Roman citizen traveled they felt safe. Why?
Because when something unjust took place against a Roman citizen, the repercussions against the perpetrator(s) was not in line with the crime.

I knew our president was fucked as soon as he said,"Don't worry,I got this". Replying to a question about how he feels about his ability to run the country.
MN

An odd position in these pc days Marc? Indeed perhaps even brave

Excellent point about the Roman attitude though.

But even if enough Americans were willing to enforce a Pax Americana I believe their opportunity has passed. Late fifties or following Gorbachev perhaps, now.....

quote:

I knew our president was fucked as soon as he said,"Don't worry,I got this". Replying to a question about how he feels about his ability to run the country.
MN

Oh dear.

I didn't know that. My condolences.

During the 50s you could find Pres. Eisenhower on the golf course more than in the White house. America was a little pissed but, shit, what the hell! The economy was growing,interest rates are low,taxes were nominal,and there were more people at work than any time in the past.
Really, what did Ike need to do?

Pres. Obama is screwed... The worst has not come yet. 2010 will show even worse foreclosure rates and an introduction of higher taxes.
Not one economist has stated that even,"they" now how to fix this mess.
MN

It does seem odd that as the world is still to suffer the most enormous economic blows since the early '30's, beginning in the US, that everyone is staring the other way with hands clapped over their eyes. What's going on?

quote:

Originally posted by Mick Parry:

quote:

Originally posted by Colin Lorenson:
The middle east is a quagmire that you become embroiled in at your peril - Iraq is the perfect example, and Afghanistan even more so.

Obviously the US have to be there for the oil, their strategic interest in the region. Forget promoting democracy, keeping people safe, and all that BS.

Until the US forces their proxy state, Israel, to make real concessions and afford the Palestinians proper status and a viable state to live and develop in there will be no long term solution, and continued distrust of the US in the Arab world.

The missiles are there to protect the ruling families interests in the respective countries, not their subjects. I suspect that the general populace would not want them to be there.

Also don't underestimate the fear that the Arab states have of Iran. Iranians, while moslems, are not Arabs, and Iran is 90% Shia, with most of the rest of the Arab world is Sunni. There is a very long history of distrust between the two.

In my travels in the gulf I've found the somewhat strange contradiction that no-one really likes America as a state, but everyone wants to go and live there. The propaganda power of TV/Movies I guess.

Colin

I agree with every word of that. America needs to be out there to protect the oil supply.

However Obama does seem to be spending one hell of a lot of his tax payers money at the moment and his efforts on the environment (which is where I thought he would have done well) are woefully imadequate.

Regards

Mick

Fuck no!!
I am tired of this point of view. Why should we protect the oil? Why?! We could be onto the next big thing if we were really pressed. We could be on bio fuel in 6 months for trucks,trains,and autos. Christ, you now us Americans can sure eat. We're fat-Right?
I heard on the radio today that if we cut back on all the military spending, we can fix ourselves quick. Bullshit.

America needs to NOT be the,"Go to",country for a decade or two. We need to regroup,get our priorities corrected,and fix us first. Then, and only then, will we be in a position to lead. It would be nice to see how the rest of the world gets on while we were,"Neutral".

I have traveled this world and seen my share of suffering. I can drive a matter of 25 minutes and see the same thing. America can not fix everything and should not be poo pood when we show our hand. Your priorities are not ours. That's business.

What really gets me? We are so damn complaisant and have the memory of a Beagle.

The middle east has been at war for 5000 years. Do you really think our Pres. is going to fix something God can not fix!? Jerusalem has been sought after for millennial and no small patch of land will fix what's really wrong.
MN

Neutrality policies along the lines of those adopted by Switzerland could be done but due to world commerce and the interdependencies due to government bonds, trading obligations and alike isolationist policies may not work and may not be desirable.