Opera in English

Posted by: Tam on 18 June 2006



I spent a very enjoyable two hours yesterday listening to Mackerras's wonderful recording in English (the only one, I believe) of Mozart's Magic Flute. It strikes me (as it did at ENO a few weeks back for Makropulos) how fine opera can be when in one's native tongue (or, I suppose, in a language one understands - but since there aren't any others I am sufficiently adept at..). Now, I often listen to opera with the libretto in front of me, but somehow, it isn't nearly the same.

I recently listened to both my recordings of Janacek's Jenufa, both with Mackerras but one in Czech with the VPO and, more recently in English with WNO. Now, there can be little doubt that the playing (and much of the singing) is finer in the earlier recording, and yet, the English language gives the more recent one a really special something. In a way, it is almost like the 'live' effect that has been discussed on other threads (in that the concert hall lends the piece an extra special something), does the native language elevate a performance beyond its basic musical quality.

That said, I have spent yesterday and today very much enjoying Mozart's Idomeneo (Mackerras again) and haven't been able to have the libretto in front of me - in a way I've been able to enjoy the beauty of the singing (and there is some really lovely singing on offer here) without worrying about what is going on (since I cannot for the life of me recall the plot).

Of course, English does not ensure success - I attended an awful Rheingold at ENO a few years back and one of big problems was that only Albrecht's words could be heard (interestingly, when I was there for Makropulos, it was the first time since supertitles were introduced, though most of the key singers had no need for them).

I suppose the only real issues with opera in English come down to issues of poetry in translation and I suppose it is inevitable that something must be lost. But, to listen to the Magic Flute I started this thread with (and, I would contend, any good translation/production), you would not miss anything. Of course, sometimes we are lucky enough, I'm thinking especially of Britten, whose operas I adore, to have the source in English to begin with, and then such points are moot.

I'm afraid this thread has rambled slightly, but my main thrust is how wonderful opera in English on disc can be (indeed, in may ways I find it more compelling than a subtitled DVD performance). And how grateful I am to Peter Moores and his foundation for funding the Chandos series of such recordings (though I only have a fairly poor selection of them). I wonder if others here have recommendations for great opera in English recordings or have heard the new Chandos disc of Bluebeard's Castle with Thomlinson (which I am looking forward to hearing at some point).

regards, Tam
Posted on: 18 June 2006 by u5227470736789439
The only experience I have of Opera in English was attending Cosi Fan Tuti at the Festival Theatre in Malvern in a sort of small scale touring production, and it was tremendous fun.

The reason I listen to so little opera is because I like to learn the libretto, and its meaning, which of course is a huge task, so that I remove that layer of incomprehension from it! I think you noticed how little Opera there was in my record libraray. The ones I know I know by heart! I could not imagine me learning too many more...

But I would enjoy it in English either in the Theatre or on records.

All the best from Fredrik
Posted on: 18 June 2006 by erik scothron
Opera in english as opposed to english opera, is, in my view, to be avoided given a choice i.e opera in the original language. Take Italian opera for example where a particular vowel sound is matched to a particular note, can the same meaning be had in english using the same vowel sound or must some other vowel sound be used upsetting the music? In my experience the result is at best a loss in translation and at worst a loss in musicality. The result is always a compromise. If one is familiar with a particular Italian aria then hearing it in english is always a bit of a let down in my experience as the perfomer struggles to maintain the integrity of the music and still remain intelligible. I prefer the original with sur-titles anyday but this is only a matter of personal taste (as always).

It is easy to forget that an opera e.g the marriage of figaro has both a composer e.g Mozart and a librettist e.g de Ponti and an opera by Mozart/da Ponti is a collaboration of two different arts, music and libretto (often based on the work of a playwrite e.g. Beaumarchais)and that the integrity of the musical note/vowell sound combination is just not possible in translation so there is either a subtle loss in the music or translation to the detriment of the whole.

This is not to say that an opera in english is a waste of time I am merely say what I prefer. There have been some very commendable efforts I'm sure and I for one would not mind to listen to some suggestions. I have not heard Tam's suggested Magic Flute but based on his recommendation I may well give it a go. Sub titles on a DVD can be tedious. Maybe familiarity with an english version will increase my enjoyment of the italian and vice-versa?
Posted on: 18 June 2006 by Tam
Dear Erik,

You raise an interesting point with regard to Italian opera and, in fairness, none of the Opera in English discs in my collection were Italian in the first instance (the four I own are either Czech or German). However, I was at a WNO production of Rossini's Barber of Seville recently which was most enjoyable and sung in English, however, I suspect I would need to hear an English recording of an Italian opera I knew well (I suppose it would need to be Figaro) to make the judgement better.

If you decide to the get the Magic Flute (which, of course, was in German in the first instance), I do not imagine you will be disappointed. I have also very much enjoyed both Sir Charles's English Janaceks (Osud and Jenufa) and his recent Bartered Bride. He has done one or two Italian operas but they have yet to find their way into my collection.


Dear Fredrik,

I think I recall you saying this elsewhere - I can completely understand your point. However, sometimes I think a familiarity with the libretto can hurt. I'm very fond of Figaro, and in particular a certain aria that features in the film the Shawshank Redemption, for very much the reasons expressed in the film. What is interesting is that when one reads the words in the libretto they don't really seem to do the beauty of the music justice and so I have done my best to forget them again. I wonder if I would have enjoyed the beauty of the singing in Idomeneo (see the Mozart thread) quite so much if I'd known what was being sung?

As with Erik, I can't recommend the Magic Flute highly enough and can't see you being disappointed.


On a more general note, I think one issue with opera in English is that is hasn't always attracted the very top talent, particularly in terms of conductors (and Mackerras is a rare star of the Opera in English series). I suspect there is a money issue here (which is doubtless why Makropulos Case was being taped live - I would just note that my studio recording with the VPO doesn't have a fraction of the magic of the Coliseum, let's hope Chandos captured a fair degree of it).

regards, Tam
Posted on: 19 June 2006 by erik scothron
quote:
Originally posted by Tam:
However, I was at a WNO production of Rossini's Barber of Seville recently which was most enjoyable and sung in English, however, I suspect I would need to hear an English recording of an Italian opera I knew well (I suppose it would need to be Figaro) to make the judgement better.



Hi Tam,

I went to an ETO Barber of Seville some years back and noticed that some arias did not seen to 'flow' as they did in Italian and I wondered how the difficult 'largo al factotum' would fare in english - its a bloody great toungue twisting nightmare in Italian but the singer performed it with almost cocky ease and whilst giving a little dance and he got a standing ovation at the end. It was not the most moving aria I have seen/heard but it was one of the most impressive.

I agree with you on the Sul Aria Shawshank thing 'I don't know what those two ladies were singing about and I don't care.....' totally sublime and achingly beautiful - are there any words that can pierce the heart like music? Very few I suspect.

Regards,

Erik
Posted on: 20 June 2006 by KenM
I have wondered whether to take the leap into Opera in English. Up to now, I've been put off by comments about Italian light opera such as "sounds like poor Gilbert & Sullivan". For me, opera is a visual as well as an aural experience, so video with subtitles is pretty good.

Still, that Chandos "Magic Flute" looks very tempting, to sit alongside Klemperer's EMI set.

Just to add to the native English recommendations, I very much enjoy the CD versions of "Hugh the Drover" and "Sir John in Love" by Vaughan-Williams.

And to add to the confusion, did not Rossini happily sanction the translation of "Guglielmo Tell" from its opiginal French into Italian? What is sauce for the Italians....
Posted on: 20 June 2006 by Tam
Dear Erik,

In fairness, Barber of Seville isn't an opera I really know (indeed, the WNO production was my first, and so far only, encounter with the work) so I am not really equiped to judge how much was lost in doing it in English (it was highly enjoyable though - I suspect a good production also helped it). That said, I do have Gui's recording which I inherited a while back waiting on my to be listened to shelf...


Dear Ken,

In regard to the Magic Flute, there is a too brief (as will almost all the Chandos series) exert downloadable from their website which should give a little flavour). The link is in my first post.

As far as translations to other languages go, I noted in my thread on Verdi's Don Carlos a few months back that it was originally in French as opposed to the more common Italian. I think it is fair to say I've yet to hear an entirely satisfactory performance in French (though Pappano is supposed to be fine, he makes certain cuts that I do not care for, so I have not bought it). However, the Abbado version is particularly interesting in this context. He gives a very full text (if one counts the appendices) but while he uses French he is recording at La Scala with an almost entirely Italian cast (Domingo is Carlos, as he was on the classic Italian reading with Giulini). Orchestrally the set is great, but very often there is something horribly grating about the singing (something I did not notice when WNO hooked me into the work with a wonderful, and full French text that was sadly not taped for prosterity) and I suspect that they are not entirely comfortable with the language. I wonder if one gets the same effect with Italian opera in English (if so I could see it being a problem). However, the all to brief exerts on the Chandos website are enough to want to make me expand my collection so I may try and pick up Figaro at some point (since I know that well it would allow me to judge how successful it can be).

regards, Tam
Posted on: 20 June 2006 by KenM
Tam,

Yes, I think I'll succumb. Though being an impoverished pensioner, I will shop around.

Thanks for your information.

Ken
Posted on: 02 July 2006 by Tam


As I mentioned on another thread, I decided to pick up the Parry/Philharmonia Figaro. During the week I only had a chance to listen to Act I and I had planned to listen to the rest this weekend but other things grabbed my attention more. However, I thought I would post some first impressions.

Firstly (as I suspect may well be the case with a number of these releases), I find myself wishing Mackerras (or someone of similar stature) had been engaged to conduct it. That's not to say Parry is bad, it is perfectly ok, but in no danger of ever approaching greatness. The first aria turned me right off - I have already noted that in one aria (the 'sul'' one), the words don't really live up to the beauty of the music, the same applies here (Figaro measuring up a bed and discussing a hat with Suzanna is a distinct disappointment (and I rather prefer to remain ignorant). However, this soon drops away and understanding does become a distinct plus and this is certianly a nice 'zippy' translation. I like "that [ilegitimate child - not sure if the moderation software will object] Figaro, I'll make him pay". Diction is mostly clear.

However, what of Erik's point about words and notes not quite sounding right when sung in English as opposed to Italian. To be honest, I didn't really object to anyone except Frances McCafferty's Marcellina and, in fairness to her, she may have deliberately been singing that way to characterise the role's age and undesirability (though if that is the explanation, I would rather she hadn't).

However, I think that understanding the words papers over most cracks - of course, better to have first rate casts and conductors (and I submit one gets that in the Mackerras Flute), but still worth having. Of course, the other option would be to learn Italian.... However, based on what I have heard so far, I intend to expand my collection of Opera in English discs.

regards, Tam
Posted on: 05 July 2006 by Guido Fawkes


This is stunning - great performance.

Thank you, Tam, for bringing it to my attention.
Posted on: 05 July 2006 by Tam
Glad you enjoyed it. I'm sure you'd like the other recordings Mackerras has made in the series (as mentioned above).

regards, Tam