Which way to go

I think you should do the CDS-II vs 52 demo. After all, should you choose the CDS-II, you can either change the CDX into your 2nd system and liberate funds from the 3.5/Hi, or just sell the CDX toward the cost of the CDS-II.

The 52 certainly has it's magic, and will improve all of your sources. But with the proportion of CD listening as your whole, the CDS-II deserves consideration. The ease, additional dynnamics, and the way it plays strings like no other CD player (amongst it's many other strengths) make it a worthy source, and demands a serious listen.

HTH.

Rico - all your base are belong to us.

-=> Mike Hanson <=-

I agree that the choice really comes down to CDS2 and 52, rather than 52 and 135s.

The 52 will improve all your sources. The CDS2 is top-loading so you may need a tall top shelf to sit the CDS2 under the Garrard. Given that aesthetics are important to you, this may be less appealing to you.

These make for a strong argument for the 52.

The CDS2 adds richness, a kind of maturity and depth to CD replay. If the CD becomes much better, would you play your other sources less? Is this an argument for or against the CDS2?

Regards,
Frank.

Trade in the CDX for a CDSII. No question about it.

Oh, and if you don't quite have the money for the CDSII, then sod the new furniture and you can still get the cd player.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

[This message was edited by Andrew Randle on THURSDAY 05 April 2001 at 12:44.]

Yours is an enjoyable decision.

In view of the proportion of time you spend listening to radio and vinyl I would go for the 52.

I'd borrow one and see if you think it's worth the entry fee!

Jonathan

having heard your system recently, and discussed it with you, the changes that you make will to the
equipment location ie the stand, will I feel reap large benefits. Then, as stated here, have a good home dem, your dealer should be accomodating with this level of spend!

Regards

Geoff

Thanks for the advice.......all good stuff.

My course of action is as follows

1. Get either Hutter or Fraim to mount the stuff on...the wife can choose.

2. Then its either the 52 or CDS2. I still have a couple of months to make up my mind. I might get both depending on how my annual bonus shapes
up.

Also MESSAGE FOR NIC PEELING

Nic ....thanks for your kind offer but I am not getting any answer on your phone and am not certain which email address you are because you are not at work. could you email me again.

Present system :-

CSX+XPS /Garrard 401 /Nato5 /82+Supercap/250/SBL's
Above mounted in large oak cabinet.

I must be losing my powers of persuasion, the wife is adamant that the wooden cabinet stays, so the Hutter or Fraim is looking distintly unlikely, at least for the time being. She likes the look of the cabinet and thats the end of it as far as she is concerned.

Never the less, I am the master of my house (with the exception of choosing furniture) and she has agreed that I may continue buying black boxes.

On the asssumption that I am stuck with the wooden cabinet which is not sonically 100%, would I be better off buying a CDS2, which I believe has its own built in suspension system and as such is less dependant on racks and stands etc in comparison to the CDX.

This then leads me on to my second question, will the 82 plus supercap restrict the performance of the CDS2 and will I need to buy a 52 to allow it to release the music. Is the 82+Supercap sufficiently robust to handle the CDS2. This is all becoming very expensive.

Your views will be most welcome. I have ditched the idea of the 135's for the forseeable future.

Regards

Mick

quote:

---

I must be losing my powers of persuasion, the wife is adamant that the wooden cabinet stays, so the Hutter or Fraim is looking distintly unlikely, at least for the time being. She likes the look of the cabinet and thats the end of it as far as she is concerned.

---

I take it that there isn't enough room in the living room to install Hutter/Fraim.

One tactic is to install some Hutter/Fraim in the dining room system and see how your wife takes to it. Then you might be able to move it into the living room

Mick said

quote:

---

will the 82 plus supercap restrict the performance of the CDS2 and will I need to buy a 52 to allow it to release the music

---

Let's look at it 2 ways.

1) Is a Linn LP12 a worthwhile upgrade over a Linn Axis when using a NAC 72??? Let alone an 82.
2) Does the 82 restrict the performance of the Garrard in such a way that you can not tell whether it is superior to the CDX?

If the answers are 1=Yes and 2=No, then you are onto a winner with the CDS2. Sure, the 52 will be a worthy 2nd step.....

....the 52 is so good that it is the source that restricts the 52... not the other way around.

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

If your not going to be buying the new stand maybe you can do the CDSII and the 52! I'm sure you pay for one of them out of the furniture budget.

Matthew

quote:

---

On the asssumption that I am stuck with the wooden cabinet which is not sonically 100%, would I be better off buying a CDS2, which I believe has its own built in suspension system and as such is less dependant on racks and stands etc in comparison to the CDX.

---

Mick

forget about the engineering features of the CDSII or any other equipment, and just use your ears. With your ears leading your chequebook, you will make the best musical decision. And besides, as Sue has given approval for more black box purchases, it seems your path is clear!

As to your CDSII choked by 82, I can assure you this is not the case. The 52 will certainly allow more of the prformance to come through, but you can quickly tell a CDSII is in the system, 'even' through a 'mere' 82.

HTH.

Rico - all your base are belong to us.

quote:

---

I must be losing my powers of persuasion, the wife is adamant that the wooden cabinet stays, so the Hutter or Fraim is looking distintly unlikely, at least for the time being. She likes the look of the cabinet and thats the end of it as far as she is concerned.

Never the less, I am the master of my house (with the exception of choosing furniture) and she has agreed that I may continue buying black boxes.

---

Mick,

My bet is that your system is probably giving less than 60% of what it is capable in its current location, big wooden cabinets sound absolutely awful, this is something I thankfully learnt years ago. I think that anyone who has heard the effect of a decent stand (whatever the stand of their choice is), would agree that throwing more good money after equipment upgrades is a total waste of time in this situation.

I would find a way of improving the support by whatever means necessary. Redesign and build your bulky wooden cabinet around a decent stand if possible (I remember you considering this as an option in the past), this should not degrade the sound much if you keep it from touching. I am convinced this would provide a far better upgrade for your money than buying more expensive boxes that will be so obviously handicapped by their environment.

Tony.

If she likes the antique then put it somewhere else so that she can enjoy it without spoiling your listening pleasure; or move your hi-fi to another room where the benefits of mana can be enjoyed; or move the antique so that you can hide mana behind it; or have a basement installed like our USA contributors.

cheers

Nigel

I am sorry that your wife will now not agree with you to change your hi-fi cabinet. The problem you have is that your cdx/xps/82/supercap/250/sbl system in my view really did not sound as dramatically better than my cdi/82/hicap/160/ibl's system as it should. Don't get me wrong, the sound was very good - (including that Record Deck!), but differences were not as huge as I would have expected. Therefore the cabinet must be a negative factor. To reap a better percentage return on your naim investments a stand has got a to be good move.

Time to re-negotiate!

BTW - Micks cabinet is not an antique!

Regards
Geoff

cheers

Nigel

Andrew

Andrew Randle
2B || !2B;
4 ^ = ?;

The oak cabinet which my wife likes is 5 ft high and 6 ft wide and I purchased it off an American Airman based at Lyneham. Its about 10 yrs old and I thinh they refer to it as an entertainment center. Its too big to fit elsewhere, so either it stays or it goes.

Your collective postings have convinced me that I need to convince Sue that the cabinet has to go.

I shall await the right moment in time and do a deal with her but it wont be easy.

So far the plan is Hutter because its cheap but good and then a CDS2 afterwards.

Wives can be a pain in the **** on occasions.

Regards

Mick

I have just come out of hospital, after an op, with one arm strapped to my body, so I cannot drive. I depend on her to get me around.

I sold the Jaguar last week.

My only negotiation stance at the moment is charm, and she getting suspicious already.

Regards

Mick.......he who will get Hutter

Perhaps you require less charm and more whisky. I am certain it can be extremely helpful in achieving an amicable arrangement. After a couple of Obans, and some pleasant music, it should be relatively simple to convince her that a beautiful stand would be the perfect get well gift.

A question. Why Hutter as apposed to the Fraim?

tw

I can import the Hutter direct for £800.00 ( you would be mad to buy it from a UK retailer ) ...The same size Fraim is £2,300. I would rather put the £1,500 difference towards the CDS2.

I may eventually go for the Fraim and no doubt the Hutter will fetch a good price on the second hand market similar to Mana.

I have never seen any Hutter for sale, so it should be easy to move on.

Regards

Mick........determined to get the Hutter

quote:

---

I can import the Hutter direct for £800.00 ( you would be mad to buy it from a UK retailer )

---

I don't know about the price difference for the UK, but beware the joys of shipping. It's a hell of a lot easier to go beef at the local retailer than over the phone to Germany. BTW, I thought Hutter was Austrian ?

Peter

I will be buying (once the wife has given her consent)two Hutter units which will sit side by side, each unit consisting of a base plus three shelves. This will house 8 pieces of kit.

Imported price buying from an Austrian retailer is just over £800 to include shipping.

UK price just touching £1200.

The Austrian dealer is only the other end of a phone, so no big deal there.

Dont worry about importing, 90% of the stuff in your house has been imported.

Regards

Mick

90% imported ? If I think about I suppose you're right. I imported my stand from the UK, coz I couldn't find one I liked here. Once I got it imported I found several that would have done the trick for half the price

Peter

I really feel for you at this moment in time because I sense the deliberation that you are going through. Buying the 52 will leave you wondering what the CDS-II would be like and buying the 52 will leave you wondering what the CDS-II is really capable of. I can tell you that I auditioned the CDX/XPS against the Marantz SA-1 and the very capable Wadia 860x. I can also tell you that CDX/XPS came out top based on price/performance. I then tried the CD12 and the CDS-II. All this through my 52/250. The 52 is just simply a very revealing preamp - the best in the business many would say. I can say the CDX/XPS sounded great and I am sure that you would get more from this than you currently do with the 82. My worry is the oak table. The CDS-II was IMO about another 15% better than the CDX/XPS. This was after evaluation in the shop. I then asked the dealer to bring the CDS-II and the CD12 to my home and this was when I would make my decision. I went for the CDS-II because in value-for-money terms it is simply the best player on the market. In some cases it put the 2xprice Linn to shame and in others the Linn really showed what CD is capable of. The real pleasure came when the CDS-II had been on for the mandatory 5 days. All I can say is WOW! This player really will give you great pleasure even with the 82 (which is basically a very good preamp). This will leave you in a good position with the 52 later and then you'll be in the same position as me - wanting the 500! Upgraditus is a really terrible disease and I fear that you are showing the symptoms.