Most overrated quitarist of all time
Posted by: chuck777 on 12 February 2006
I have to say that there is one quitarist that has been rated in the top 3 of all time that makes me absolutely sick. Nearly every quitarist in the top 100 IMO beats the pants off this man when it comes to real music creativity and playing ability. I was once told by a much older and wiser individual who agrees with me on this that most people in general do not have the ability to grasp large melodies and that is why this guy is so popular. If there was a rating for most catchy short (riff) melodies, then maybe I could see him highly regarded in that circle. Okay, I apologize for the length of suspense.
The most overrated IMO is: Eric Clapton
Please understand that I think he is overrated but not a bad musician. He to me just does not deserve so much credit.
Regards,
Charles
The most overrated IMO is: Eric Clapton
Please understand that I think he is overrated but not a bad musician. He to me just does not deserve so much credit.
Regards,
Charles
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by chuck777
So sorry....new meds...guitarist 
What was with that? Not a Sunday speller 
Charles
What was with that? Not a Sunday speller Charles
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Earwicker
Jimmy Page.
Clapton's quite good - if you lke the blues.
EW
Clapton's quite good - if you lke the blues.
EW
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by chuck777
quote:Originally posted by Earwicker:
Jimmy Page.
Clapton's quite good - if you lke the blues.
EW
Funny, Jimmy Page was in the top 5. Who rates this stuff?
Charles
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Guido Fawkes
The top 5 doesn't contain Mr C
Davy Graham
Robert Johnson
Hank Marvin
Nick Drake
Bert Jansch
but nonetheless I still think Eric is a fine guitarist and so I'm led to believe is quite stunning on ukulele - please listen to Disraeli Gears if you're in any doubt about EC.
I'm not going to vote for most overrated guitarist because it sounds like another negative thread and I pledged not to induldge by voting for Mark K.....
Davy Graham
Robert Johnson
Hank Marvin
Nick Drake
Bert Jansch
but nonetheless I still think Eric is a fine guitarist and so I'm led to believe is quite stunning on ukulele - please listen to Disraeli Gears if you're in any doubt about EC.
I'm not going to vote for most overrated guitarist because it sounds like another negative thread and I pledged not to induldge by voting for Mark K.....
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by chuck777
[QUOTE]Originally posted by ROTF:
but nonetheless I still think Eric is a fine guitarist and so I'm led to believe is quite stunning on ukulele - please listen to Disraeli Gears if you're in any doubt about EC.
QUOTE]
I will say that his best stuff was definitely with Cream.
Charles
but nonetheless I still think Eric is a fine guitarist and so I'm led to believe is quite stunning on ukulele - please listen to Disraeli Gears if you're in any doubt about EC.
QUOTE]
I will say that his best stuff was definitely with Cream.
Charles
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Guido Fawkes
Charles
Who would you rate as a great guitarist that I should definitely listen to - I do tend to like songs rather than long instrumentals; although there are exceptions like The Marilyn Monroe-Memorial-Church by Amon Duul II featuring Chris Karrer and John Weinzierl.
Rotf
Who would you rate as a great guitarist that I should definitely listen to - I do tend to like songs rather than long instrumentals; although there are exceptions like The Marilyn Monroe-Memorial-Church by Amon Duul II featuring Chris Karrer and John Weinzierl.
Rotf
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by kuma
Stevie Ray Vaughan.
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Kevin-W
Clapton, Santana and Knopfler.
Plus all those 80s fretwankers like Satriani and Malmsteen.
K
Plus all those 80s fretwankers like Satriani and Malmsteen.
K
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by Kevin-W:
Clapton, Santana and Knopfler.
Plus all those 80s fretwankers like Satriani and Malmsteen.
Disagree about Clapton and esp Knopfler. Santana was good a long time ago but quickly outgrew it! I agree 100 % on the fretwankers. The electric guitar is still, unfortunately, the object of sporting ambitions.
EW
Posted on: 12 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by kuma:
Stevie Ray Vaughan.
Think you might struggle to justify that one!
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Diode100
Give the man his due, EC might not be the sharpest tool in the box these days, but anyone who heard the Bluesbreakers album when it came out in 1966 would know that he was light years ahead of the opposition then, the opening bars were simply monumental, I can still hear them in my head forty years later.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Guido Fawkes
quote:Originally posted by Kevin-W:
Clapton, Santana and Knopfler.
K
I don't agree with Clapton or Santana both of whom produced interesting music.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by Diode100:
anyone who heard the Bluesbreakers album when it came out in 1966 would know that he was light years ahead of the opposition then, the opening bars were simply monumental
What was the first track?
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Steve S1
Are we all musicians?
I am not. But I have heard enough people who are, wax lyrical about EC's ability even as early as the Mayall period.
This sort of thread usually divides along the lines of - those we like the music of versus those we don't.
I am not. But I have heard enough people who are, wax lyrical about EC's ability even as early as the Mayall period.
This sort of thread usually divides along the lines of - those we like the music of versus those we don't.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by Steve S1:
Are we all musicians?
Guitarist and not-very-good violinist.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Rasher
I couldn't say that Clapton wasn't any good, but I wouldn't put him in the top 20, not since Cream anyway.
For me, a good guitarist is someone who knows what to play and how to play it, or actually even probably not. I mean that they probably don't know how they do it or what they are doing as it's a subconscious thing. People like Gary Moore and Mark Knofler are technicians; they play what they've learned to play and apply a technique and a skill - but it isn't spontanious music from the soul. David Gilmour is close to being the same as his parts are well rehearsed, exactly like Pat Metheny, but their soul is in the composition and they manage to retain that even though they know the notes they are going to play beforehand, and that kind of places them in a a different league where normal rules don't apply, probably because they are so damn good - but you can tell that DG has to work hard at it whereas PM doesn't. But I would put both of them up in the top 6.
Jimmy Page took electric guitar playing to new levels and is a genius.
The most hamfisted, dozy, clumsy and unreliable guitarist ever is Paul Kossoff. His playing could be absolutely disasterous and shambolic, but he could express like no other player I have heard before or since. Although he isn't a good technical player or a great guitarist, he is my all time favorite. He can make you cry with just a few notes, and his tragic life was written all over his playing. He will always be my hero.
So what are you talking about here; "guitarist" or musician?
For me, a good guitarist is someone who knows what to play and how to play it, or actually even probably not. I mean that they probably don't know how they do it or what they are doing as it's a subconscious thing. People like Gary Moore and Mark Knofler are technicians; they play what they've learned to play and apply a technique and a skill - but it isn't spontanious music from the soul. David Gilmour is close to being the same as his parts are well rehearsed, exactly like Pat Metheny, but their soul is in the composition and they manage to retain that even though they know the notes they are going to play beforehand, and that kind of places them in a a different league where normal rules don't apply, probably because they are so damn good - but you can tell that DG has to work hard at it whereas PM doesn't. But I would put both of them up in the top 6.
Jimmy Page took electric guitar playing to new levels and is a genius.
The most hamfisted, dozy, clumsy and unreliable guitarist ever is Paul Kossoff. His playing could be absolutely disasterous and shambolic, but he could express like no other player I have heard before or since. Although he isn't a good technical player or a great guitarist, he is my all time favorite. He can make you cry with just a few notes, and his tragic life was written all over his playing. He will always be my hero.
So what are you talking about here; "guitarist" or musician?
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by u5227470736789439
Dear Rasher,
I don't know or understand the differences between the 'great guitarists,' being discussed, even if I do know about Paul Kossoff, strange as that may sound. I know the work of Gary Moore, and Mark Knopfler, but that is about where it stops for me, but your post makes absolute sense to me. Great guitarists, technically (surely yes to that in the case of GM and MK), but the real point is whether the people are great musicicans. It helps to be out of the top draw technically to be a great musician. But it is possible to be a great musician while being almost inadequate technically. I think both MK and GM are both, and can see your point about PK.
This has its parallel with the two greatest Beethoven pianist of the first half of the Twentieth century, Artur Schnabel and Edwin Fischer, who for temperamental and technical reasons, would both have stood a very fine chance of failing the technical assessment (in scales and arppegios) for any middling College of Music nowadays, but were all the same two of the greatest classical artists of their time!
I prefer musicians to technicians, though it is nice when we get the two aspects together in one performer!
Nice post! Fredrik
I don't know or understand the differences between the 'great guitarists,' being discussed, even if I do know about Paul Kossoff, strange as that may sound. I know the work of Gary Moore, and Mark Knopfler, but that is about where it stops for me, but your post makes absolute sense to me. Great guitarists, technically (surely yes to that in the case of GM and MK), but the real point is whether the people are great musicicans. It helps to be out of the top draw technically to be a great musician. But it is possible to be a great musician while being almost inadequate technically. I think both MK and GM are both, and can see your point about PK.
This has its parallel with the two greatest Beethoven pianist of the first half of the Twentieth century, Artur Schnabel and Edwin Fischer, who for temperamental and technical reasons, would both have stood a very fine chance of failing the technical assessment (in scales and arppegios) for any middling College of Music nowadays, but were all the same two of the greatest classical artists of their time!
I prefer musicians to technicians, though it is nice when we get the two aspects together in one performer!
Nice post! Fredrik
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Sloop John B
Just to add to the great guitarist/musician/technician end of the debate, I once heard an interveiw with Rory Gallagher (I have not seen this top 100 listing I presume he was in it - where exactly?) where he waxed lyrical about John Lennon's guitar playing.
Totally agree about the frettwank above though.
Totally agree about the frettwank above though.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by Rasher:
Jimmy Page took electric guitar playing to new levels and is a genius.
He was very noisy if that's what you mean.
quote:The most hamfisted, dozy, clumsy and unreliable guitarist ever is Paul Kossoff.
Oh? Not Bo Diddley then!
EW
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by the arctic monkey
Jesus Christ it's like punk rock never happened. How well or badly some guy plays the guitar ain't important peeps. A good tune and good sound are all that matters in a band. Image, attitude and technical profficiency on their instruments are afterthoughts in my opinion.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Analogue
Here's my twopenneth
In the 60s/70s Hank B Marvin was considered a great guitarist, he and the rest of the Shads were doing something that had not been done befor, many guitarists owe thanks to this guy.
Moving on from this era, musicians such as Gilmore,Clapton and Knopfler emerged, MK says that he was heavily influenced by the Shads.
I am not a guitarist but over the years i have found IMHO that i prefer finger picking rather than plectrum playing.
This is why i rate MK as a musician, this man baught to us, guitar licks that have a melody, rather than improvisation that often goes nowhere.
Regards
Chris N
In the 60s/70s Hank B Marvin was considered a great guitarist, he and the rest of the Shads were doing something that had not been done befor, many guitarists owe thanks to this guy.
Moving on from this era, musicians such as Gilmore,Clapton and Knopfler emerged, MK says that he was heavily influenced by the Shads.
I am not a guitarist but over the years i have found IMHO that i prefer finger picking rather than plectrum playing.
This is why i rate MK as a musician, this man baught to us, guitar licks that have a melody, rather than improvisation that often goes nowhere.
Regards
Chris N
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by u5227470736789439
Dear Arctic,
Oh! I don't know. A bit of technical address helps a lot, in my view, though it should nevetr be the aim as such, just a tool. We expect any craftmen to used appropriately maintained tools. The musician's tools include his instruemnt and his technique. Only after at least an adequate technique has been mastered is any expression be possible ( quotation from Rachmaninov), so while I beleieve a technician can be musically suspect, if there is absolutely no technique, by definition, there can be no music either.
Fredrik
Oh! I don't know. A bit of technical address helps a lot, in my view, though it should nevetr be the aim as such, just a tool. We expect any craftmen to used appropriately maintained tools. The musician's tools include his instruemnt and his technique. Only after at least an adequate technique has been mastered is any expression be possible ( quotation from Rachmaninov), so while I beleieve a technician can be musically suspect, if there is absolutely no technique, by definition, there can be no music either.
Fredrik
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Rasher
Well Monkey Man, I guess you have a point, and if I was listening to my beloved Swervedriver it wouldn't even register, but this thread is about guitarists and their ratings and I guess in that context, that is what we are discussing. Rated guitarists belong maybe to a particular genre so inevitably we are talking blues/rock.
Anyway, guitarists will always be like little kids with a new toy, so although they may appear to be unconcerned post-punk about chops, don't you believe it.
Anyway, guitarists will always be like little kids with a new toy, so although they may appear to be unconcerned post-punk about chops, don't you believe it.
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by Analogue:
Knopfler emerged, MK says that he was heavily influenced by the Shads.
... which is a bit worrying. Think I'd rather listen to Joe Vai weedling away than the Shadows!
EW
Posted on: 13 February 2006 by Earwicker
quote:Originally posted by the arctic monkey:
Jesus Christ it's like punk rock never happened. How well or badly some guy plays the guitar ain't important peeps. A good tune and good sound are all that matters in a band. Image, attitude and technical profficiency on their instruments are afterthoughts in my opinion.
I get the impression you're not into the subtle side of guitar playing?!