Adam - UK Gear in the US?

I moved to California in 87 and had my kit converted before I went. You should contact your nearest Naim dealer and have it done. It's a quick, cheap job.

Thanks Tom,

I'm only here for a year or two so not keen to meddle - just curious whether there would be any adverse impact on the sound - it's been sounding a little harsh at high volume at the top end, although I don't expect mains leakage would cause that. There's no discernable hum either...

CA - nice! DC here. I get out to San Diego fairly often, nice down there. Where are you?

Phil

I also had mine converted by my dealer, pretty easy really as the equipment is designed to be either 120v or 240v via a centre tap transformer, I belive is the name of the gubbins that does the magic that lets the music come out of the box.

I too was here for a year or so and that was six years ago!!!


Andy

Thanks Andy,

So if the transformer has a central tap, and using this is the only means by which the mains voltage conversion is avchieved, then I presume the capacitors remain unchanged? If so, then that answers my question - the capacitors are specified for either 50 or 60Hz?

Anyone care to confirm this?

Phil

just get it converted, eliminate the transformer, and get on with enjoying your music. Job done.

I agree with Rico...covert it and get it re-done when you get back to the UK...stop faffing around with that transformer! It'll sound better....

Cheers

Jim

PS. Andy, I came to the US in Oct '97 for 14 weeks to take over a project that was off the rails... I never could close it out I guess! :-)

Rico/Jim,

I appreciate the advice, but as there are 'several' transformers between the source of the AC power and my apartment, I don't see that another one locally will make much of a difference!

What would make a difference would be the wrong capacitors in the power supplies, hence my questions.

At a quess, what do you think NANA would charge to convert my XPS, Hi and 180?

By the way, the XPS and Hi have been added since I got here, and my room is also considerably bigger, with concrete floor rather than floorboards, so I have experienced quite a few changes at once. I don't know what it 'should' sound like!

phil

quote:

Originally posted by Phil Cork:
At a quess, what do you think NANA would charge to convert my XPS, Hi and 180?
phil

service@naimusa.com will give you better than a guess.

As to your question on capacitors - when we make units for the USA only the voltage, mains fuse and mains lead are diiferent.

Many thanks Adam,

So unless I'm to believe that my 1kW (overspecified) transformer is in some way causing a degradation in performance, the rest of the equipment is happy with 60Hz.

I will send NANA an e-mail and ask about the modification, however there doesn't seem to be much point making the mod only to have it reversed when I come back to the UK.

Cheers,

Phil

quote:

but as there are 'several' transformers between the source of the AC power and my apartment, I don't see that another one locally will make much of a difference!

quote:

however there doesn't seem to be much point making the mod only to have it reversed when I come back to the UK.

something about horses and water, I think.

Rico,

My several years of experience in Electronic Engineering and the EE degree that started off this career have provided me with a pretty reasonable understanding of this equipment at the design level, and of the mains supplying it.

I therefore require a little empirical evidence (preferably theoretical) to substantiate some of the more esoteric 'tweaks' proposed within this forum. Perhaps this is a failing of mine, and I should just 'get it converted, eliminate the transformer, and get on with [it]'

However, surely I'm permitted to attempt to understand the reason for any alleged sonic differences before parting with my hard earned cash?

Anyone have any hard evidence of how the transformer in front of my equipment may be adversely affecting my music?

Cheers,

Phil

No hard evidence, Phil, just go on using it.

Stefan

quote:

unless I'm to believe that my 1kW (overspecified) transformer is in some way causing a degradation in performance...

No, but if there's any "sound" to the unit, it is convolved onto the existing power supplies' response, transfer functon, etc.

1kW seems a little low in terms of dynamic headroom, anyway, but that's a whole other thread.

David, thanks - I chose 1kW intentionally to provide some headroom - perhaps not enough.

Why not this thread - its pretty much the same issue! I'd be very interested in your thoughts.

By the way, how many $$ would I need to convert the units? I'd need the XPS, Hi, and 180 done, oh, and a NAPSC that's waiting for me in the UK with my Headline... Should I e-mail you separately for a quote?

Phil

Go ahead and e-mail us, with serial numbers if handy: service@naimusa.com

quote:

As to your question on capacitors - when we make units for the USA only the voltage, mains fuse and mains lead are diiferent.

I think you have your answer Not that I know much about electrickery, being a humble Mech. Eng. graduate but there are plenty of examples of Naim equipment not liking anything but the most direct mains supply but you are in the enviable situation of being able to talk to Dave at NANA on his own terms. Nice bloke and very helpful is 'our Dave' Good luck with whatever you choose and let us know how you get on.

Cheers

Andy

PS Jim 14 weeks! you win!!!!

Phil, it's just as well the reconfiguration of your kit to run on 115v doesn't qualify as an esoteric tweak!

Better off without a crappy transformer in front. Cheap and easy to reconfigure - great design that!

horse, water, drink. Gather your own empirical data.

Rico,

Are you always this friendly or do you have to work at it?

I really do accept your point (although the manner in which you express it is unfortunate), however, the reconfiguration will cost $150 per unit (XPS, HiCap, 180) although David says I could configure the NAPSC myself. Therefore, I have to weigh up whether $900 to configure the equipment to US and back again is worthwhile weighed up against the 'potential' degradation in sound quality by having a transformer in front of the system.

Again, there is little to suggest to me that the transformer is going to have a detrimental effect on the sound quality, particularly almost $1000 worth. My DC apartment block probably has its own substation, further up the line there will be another, and further up the line there will be another, all with 'crappy' transformers in them. The transformer I'm using is rated higher than the transformers in the Naim equipment I'm using and is sited well away from the equipment.

David himself replied to my question about the transformer with the following:

quote:
unless I'm to believe that my 1kW (overspecified) transformer is in some way causing a degradation in performance...


No, but if there's any "sound" to the unit, it is convolved onto the existing power supplies' response, transfer functon, etc.

1kW seems a little low in terms of dynamic headroom, anyway, but that's a whole other thread.

I believe 1kW is larger than the trannies in the black boxes, so will not be the overriding limit in dynamic headroom.

Myths and conjectures abound in this community, and that's what makes it fun! I for one however do not feel obliged to run around defying engineering training and logic in order to adhere to them all!

Thanks to all (almost) for your constructive comments.

Phil

Take a read of
this thread

it may be a way out for you if they can do a 110v to 230v one.

Thanks Derek,

Have been watching that thread with great interest. I'm in rented accomodation in the US at the moment, so major modifications like that are very unlikely!

I may well move house when I get back to the UK, so will have an ideal opportunity to play around with thigs like that. Again though, I'm interested in the theory of it. I worked for London Electricity for a while about 15 years ago. One of the services we offered was mains assessment, where (mostly commercial) customers had complained of mains interference. We used to turn up with equipment designed to measure variations in Supply Voltage, Frequency, etc, and also measure the extremes of spikes etc on the supply.
These were most often caused by lift (elevator) motors, flourescent lights, and other commercial customers down the street. All of which are on separate spurs (and indeed separate commercial supplies) to the mains that was affected!

The interference on the mains is pretty much instantaneously seen by all consumers on the circuit, so I'd really like to understand the 'separate spur' theory a bit better before I do it. Balanced power is a whole 'nuther thing again!

I see all manner of things going on on the basis that 'it sounds better'. I personally like to understand why, especially if I have to part with cash in order to find out!

For example, I'd very much like to get an accelerometer on my CDX and determine the amount of vibration it sees from my speakers at different volumes, and how this varies with different supports. Now that would make for an interesting set of graphs? Anyone interested?

Phil

friendly? Phil mate, come on down here, I'll buy you a beer! I'm unlikely to lend you the outboard, chainsaw or my wife - but any man would realise that's beyond the bounds of friendship.

Sorry, some will misinterpret an economy of words. Simple point, simple words. It'll all work better after the minor surgery.

On these forums, many folk discuss at length the theory as to why something may be better. They spend so much time discussing, they often forget to listen and try it out themselves. then there's those committed to a certain route or position, without space to return. Amidst all of this, many forget about listing to the music and start in on the hifi again (argghhh!). In this instance, it's all been done before for you, by the factory. What could be easier?

I mean, mains cleaners and ferrte rings all work better in theory, don't they.

festive best wishes from down under. the airs warm, the beer's cold. cheers!

Rico,

This has now become an infamous thread - replies from both Adam and David, and now relegated to the padded cell!

No offence taken! From my perspective however, having become aware of this forum relatively recently, I'm amazed at the number of posts I see where people (not dealers, but punters with 'similar' experiences which are extremely unlikely to be in similar listening environments) say things such as "with your equipment, you need these speakers", or "a 282 will sort out your problems" - and people go and part with often huge sums of money! This is quite frankly amazing! Look at the problems Veronika's having, she bought some Allaes, was unhappy with the sound, so bought 202/200, still unhappy, now buying CDX - seemingly largely on the basis of advice from 'in here'... Crikey! Not sure a dealer's even been involved in the decisions.

I asked for a simple fact - are my caps good for 60Hz, and was given a number of opinions, not "have you thought of this Phil", but, "Phil, do this, now!" I got a little turned off by this, so apologies also if I appeared rude!

I personally am really opening up to the concept of upgrading, and would not have contemplated an XPS a year ago - so I try to be open minded and consider all options. I value all comments, although I may appear to resent some of them!

Will be down under in Feb, working in Adelaide and Canberra - any chance you're local? Mine's a Toohey's old...

Cheers,

Phil

I too find it difficult to understand why anyone needs permission to listen to their own system without the approval of the forum. You are happy listening to your system with a transformer supply and it is doing no physical harm. So why mess about with your boxes at considerable expense if it all has to be put back to "normal" when you return to "civilisation"? Go on enjoying your music and relax. The miniscule difference offered for the temporary changes seems hardly worth the trouble.

I think the, variously expressed, consensus was - you would be best off converting your equipment to the exact same specification as those units originally supplied for the US market.

When visiting a country with a different voltage the choice needs to be made between cost and benefit. If a person maintains strong doubts about the benefits then any cost may be too great. It doesn't seem a big deal and, I think, many respondents appreciated quite early that you might remain resistant to the "convert" advice.

Given the value of your system and the compromise in performance that we would expect from using a step-up tranformer, many would wish to optimise the system by voltage conversion.

Forum rules attempt to be comprehensive but the requirements of space prevent exhaustive listing of subjects which may be moved to the Padded Cell (and I apologise to the posters in this forum for such apparent “dumping”) – there being no necessary slur on the posters that the historic title “Padded Cell” might imply.

“An extension of this is discussion of alterations to the mains wiring, sockets, plugs, fuses and mains leads. Some exchanges about this can take place in the Padded Cell but will be subject to moderation on a precautionary basis. Excessive/obsessive discussion will also be closed or removed.”

quote:

Originally posted by Phil Cork:
Look at the problems Veronika's having, she bought some Allaes, was unhappy with the sound, so bought 202/200, still unhappy, now buying CDX - seemingly largely on the basis of advice from 'in here'... Crikey! Not sure a dealer's even been involved in the decisions.

Phil,

IIRC, Veronika did some dems, but not Allaes (??), which she then bought ex-dem.

I think there was also a comment or two along the lines of "if you can still back out, get this instead".

cheers, Martin