Which LP12 would you choose?

Good idea. You're a multi-decked geezer, right? Shame you live so far west :> )

Alex

Lingo stomps on Valhalla. I don't believe in Armageddon, but if it works for you it will also stomp on Valhalla.

Arms and cartridges are secondary and tertiary.

Paul

On the basis of further upgrades in the near future then the second may make sense. OTOH why not search out an LP12 already equipped with both a Lingo and an Ekos/Aro? Even cheaper in the long run. IMO cartridges have very little second-hand value and don't really factor.

I'm likely to be conservative on power supplies, that means Lingo. I don't get Armageddon.

Cirkus is a good way of refreshing a tired Linn, but I don't think it is fundamental in the same way as a Lingo over Valhalla.

Paul

Jonathan (apart from the hypnotism) makes the crucial point: s/h Aro not easy to find; Lingo updated and better, available s/h? Other PSUs available. Also, now that Valhalla is no longer made it may even be worth something in future (hope someone who knows who they are isn't reading this).

As an aside, I must say that I do believe in the Lingo but a new motor after 10-15 years running is an equal improvement.

Alex

Its just a question of taking what's on offer. I can buy Valhalla/Aro for a bit less than I'll get for Lingo/Ittok. I bought the Lingo s/h in the first place and can do so again when funds allow.

Out of interest, what is it you don't get about the Geddon?

Alex

I can do you a Valhalla at a good price, maybe a simple Italian for example!

That way you can keep the Lingo.

A.

Sadly, the Valhalla is part of the buy deal and the Lingo part of the sell one. So how many Italians does it take to build a Lingo? :> )

Alex

I'd take the Valhalla/ARO. In fact, I DID take the Val/ARO. For me, it cost more than the Lingo - and provided a much bigger bang for the buck.

JV and Naim recommend the ARO before the 'geddon. They think the arm is more important than the PS. Ivor and Linniacs prefer the PS before the arm.

The point is very clear: this is purely a matter of taste. Listen if you can. And if you can't, why change?

Phil

quote:

---

Out of interest, what is it you don't get about the Geddon?

---

Its philosophy and price. It's an extremely crude way to power a deck, and leaves you dependent on your electricity supplier for rotational accuracy and stability.

So even if it appeared to sound good I would remain uneasy....

If you're set on an ARO then do the deal.

Paul

I'd take the Aro'ed deck 'cause I would sweat no end that the bearings in the other used arms would be buggered. Aro also extends cartridge life and 2nd-hand Lingo's are fairly easy to come by if you want to add later - you may need to switch out the motor though if you do this (we in the US need to anyway).

- GregB

Insert Witty Signature Line Here

Just to make it clear, I presently own the first option so I know it works. The question is should I sell it all in order to buy the Aro package? I have an opportunity to do this.

Alex

Forget getting a deck powered by an Armageddon.

It can't play 45 rpm records, thus depriving you of a huge amount of music.

Go lingo every time.

DS


OTD - Index ID - Expedition

I have no problem living with a 33 RPM only 'table. With the ARO, I have no trouble living with a Valhalla.

Phil

I've had two dem's of the Lingo and I've tried to like it but to no avail. It lacks soul and has no rhythm. Yes it does some extra hifi stuff but it also leaves things rather flat and lifeless. An AW modified one may well solve this but I've never heard one. I know I'm in a minority so there's not much point in flaming me....

Luckily, I am just about to organise another dem which should allow me to hear Lingo v Armageddon v Valhalla v unknown 4th option. I am going to try and do this blind so that my current bias doesn't get in the way. Hopefully I will end up making a purchase to improve on my Valhalla. Even if I don't, I can tell you that a Circus/Valhalla/Aro/17D2 can be a gobsmackingly good source when well set up.

Regards
Steve

... I agree With Paul Ranson! One of us is surely deranged.

Paul wrote:

>Lingo stomps on Valhalla. I don't believe in Armageddon, but if it works for you it will also stomp on Valhalla.

Arms and cartridges are secondary and tertiary.<

Seriously though, I *do* believe in the Armageddon. The Valhalla would be the deal killer for me. It's not a patch on the Armageddon or Lingo.

But wait, what's this?!... Paul also wrote, regarding the Armageddon:

>Its philosophy and price. It's an extremely crude way to power a deck, and leaves you dependent on your electricity supplier for rotational
accuracy and stability.<

Paul, your statement is partially true but if you ever have the chance to hear a Naimed LP12 plugged into a PS Audio PowerPlant you will *never* bother with a Lingo again. Come visit, bring beer.

Best Regards,
Mark Dunn

Looks like my selling deal may have fallen thru - the line's gone quiet.

Given that I have a few 45s it seems my best bet would be to keep deck and Lingo, flog the Ittok and buy an Aro?

Is anyone using the Norton PSU? Does it do 45rpm?

Alex

quote:

---

if you ever have the chance to hear a Naimed LP12 plugged into a PS Audio PowerPlant you will *never* bother with a Lingo again

---

That's a little like a huge transformer coupled Lingo setup. Philosophically OK but a bit technologically over egged....

quote:

---

Come visit, bring beer.

---

One day, if I may.

Paul

I'd definitely go with the ARO/DV.

1. Troika production suffered from quite significant sample variation. The DV doesn't

2. The Ittok's bearings are old and delicate - more so than the ARO's.

3. You can always add a power supply.

4. It's a more musical combination in my view. I agree with Naim's philosophy of arm before power supply.

Richard, I think the Cirkus is great value for money. Others around here disagree, but in my view it raises the LP12 from the downright ordinary to a worthwhile listen. The power supplies can't fix that.

Jonathan, I'm one of those exceptions that prove the rule I guess - I prefer the Cirkus (big time) and yet prefer the ARO/Geddon options (big time).

Paul, what's wrong with crude if it works? (And I'm not saying it is crude) Sonically, the Geddon
delivers the goods. If you have bad mains, your other equipment is going to suffer too, so there's not much point in having a great power supply if your equipment isn't going to be able to exploit it. Better to have the fluency of a Geddon in either case. Admittedly, the Lingo does have that 45 rpm button.

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

All Armageddon can do is filter a bit of noise off the mains using a device whose design purpose isn't filtration.

To me, whether it works or not, this is crude. As well as expensive. Installing an Armageddon makes you more dependent on factors beyond your control for the quality of your LP playback rather than less.

That's why I don't like it from a philosophical pov. Naim amplifiers and CD players have increasingly precise power supplies as you ascend the range. The Armageddon sticks out like a sore thumb in comparison.

Of course if it works for you in practice then it is a perfectly valid choice. I'm arguing general rather than specific.

Paul

quote:

---

Originally posted by Paul Ranson:
All Armageddon can do is filter a bit of noise off the mains using a device whose design purpose isn't filtration.

---

Yes, but what is the purpose of the power supply in the first place?

I never got on with the Lingo, it just killed the life & dynamics from my system.

This persuades me that the Armageddon provides a lower impedance supply to the motor, and this lets the deck take more of a grip over the sound.

quote:

---

Installing an Armageddon makes you more dependent on factors beyond your control for the quality of your LP playback rather than less.

---

Perhaps an armageddon on a bad day is still better than a Lingo?

cheers, Martin

quote:

---

This persuades me that the Armageddon provides a lower impedance supply to the motor, and this lets the deck take more of a grip over the sound.

---

The Armageddon must feed the motor through a substantial resistor. So I think the impedance of the motor supply isn't governed by the transformer.

quote:

---

Perhaps an armageddon on a bad day is still better than a Lingo?

---

Only if it's going round at the right speed...

Paul

Lordy...



...my record player won't play singles anymore!

Tony.

Tony,

Have you been polishing or is that one quite new?

Andy (dull platter).

You'll be lucky to play anything at that angle.

I'm now going to be boring and sort of aswer my own question:

1. Ittok/Phase 3 Mana must better than Aro

2. I have just given the Lingo and Linto their own spur (together) instead of a shared one (with other equipment). The difference is not subtle. It makes me wonder how good Valhalla/Separate Spur might be?

Alex

If that's your new LP12 - what the hell are you doing on Loot with your CDX?



P