Margerine vs Butter
Posted by: Stephen Tate on 29 November 2005
Do you know...
the difference between margerine and butter?
Read to the end...it gets very intresting!
Both have the same amount of calories.
Butter is slightly higher in saturated fats at 8 grams compared to five grams.
Eating margerine can increase heart disease in women by 57% over eating the same amount of butter, according to a recent Harvard medical study.
Butter has many nutritional benefits where margerine has a few only because they are added!
Butter tastes much better than margerine and it can enhance the flavors of other foods.
Butter has been around for centuries where margerine has been around for less than 100 years.
And now!, for margerine...
Very high in trans fatty acids...
Triple risk of coronary heart disease...
Increases total cholesterol and LDL ( this is the bad cholesterol) Lowers HDL cholesterol,
( the good cholesterol)...
Increases the risk of cancers by up to five fold...
Lowers quality of breast milk...
Decreases immune response...
Decreases insulin response...
and here is the most disturbing fact....
HERE IS THE PART THAT IS VERY INTERESTING!
Margerine is but one molecule away from being plastic..
This fact alone was enough to have me avoiding margerine for life and anything else that is hydrogenated ( this means hydrogen is added , changing the structure of the substance).
You can try this yourself:
Purchase a tub of margerine and leave it in your garage or shaded area.
Within a couple of days you will note a couple of things: no flies, not even those pesky fruit flies will go near it ( that should tell you something)...
it does not rot or smell differently..
because it has no nutritional value, nothing will grow on it...
even those teeny weeny micro-organisms will not a find a home to grow.
Why?
Because it is nearly plastic.
Would you melt your tupperware and spread it on your toast?
Share this with your friends.....
( Butter them up!)
P.S These views are my own and not necessarily the views of portsmouth college.
regards,
Posted on: 01 December 2005 by BigH47
Nope all OK here.
I hate this medium as a "talking" format.
Regards.
Howard
Posted on: 06 December 2005 by Rasher
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Tate:
Purchase a tub of margerine and leave it in your garage or shaded area.
Within a couple of days you will note a couple of things: no flies, not even those pesky fruit flies will go near it ( that should tell you something)...
it does not rot or smell differently..
because it has no nutritional value, nothing will grow on it...
even those teeny weeny micro-organisms will not a find a home to grow.
Why?
Because it is nearly plastic.
I am not familiar with the facts, but this seems to be a flawed argument.
Water: Put a tub of water in the garage and it won't rot, but we need water more than anything. It isn't close to being plastic.
Vegatables: OK if they are damp they will rot, but otherwise they dry, like rice or beans. These are nutritous, not fake food.
Dairy: Well, it's going to rot because it's rotting already*, and meat, again, it's pretty rank stuff to begin with.
I think the argument above could be turned on it's head with not much effort. Eating food that rots easily isn't awfully good for the gut, and I don't eat meat for a start, and, *why do humans insist on consuming milk after we have been weaned, yuk, and even then, milk from the mammories of another species!! Yuk, yuk, yuk!!! It's almost perverted!!
I'm sure you are right about any processed foods like margarine, but I just don't think butter is "natural" either.
I don't expect anyone to agree with me though.
Posted on: 06 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Rasher,
Well, I'll stick my head up above the parapet and say I agree with you on all of the above points. I do enjoy a slab of meat now and then, mind you, but its pretty occasional that I have it and then only in small 'doses'.
I also find it a little amazing that cow's milk is such a plentiful and oft-used substance for human consumption. I mean, even young cows stop drinking cows milk and go on to water, plus there are components in cow's milk that need serious digestive juices to break down and extract anything from (calves can do this because they are ruminants and have 7 stomachs).
And margerine being one molecule away from plastic? (Don't get me wrong, as soon as I found out how margarine was made and how ill-prepared our biology is for dealing with it, I stopped using it immediately). A *molecule* can be a really big and complex thing. To add to your argument, pure water is but one molecule away from being cyanide.
Still, to return to the essence of this thread, I agree - don't do Margarine, kids!
Cheers!
Rich
Posted on: 06 December 2005 by fred simon
. I do love butter, especially unsalted, for spreading and cooking, and although it is superior to margarine in every way, it's not exactly a health food, even in moderate amounts.
But there's another way to go, which I've found quite satisfactory:
Smart Balance http://www.smartbalance.com/home.htmlThere's a variety for cooking (which as far as I know is the only such butter substitute adequate for cooking and baking), and a lighter version for spreading. The only thing I wish they offered is an unsalted formula, for cooking and spreading ... I really do love sweet butter. Especially these days, who needs extra salt?
Fred
P.S. Disclaimer: I don't work for Smart Balance, nor do I own its stock.
. Posted on: 06 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Fred,
I'm really, really sorry to point this out but Smart Balance contains a ratio of 5.8:1 of Omega-6 fatty acids to Omega-3s. (This is according to the picture of the label posted on their website).
Omega-6s and Omega-3s have opposite function - when you have more Omega-6s in your system than Omega-3s your body produces more of a hormone-like family of substances called eicosanoids. More eicosanoids leave you more prone to/at higher risk of asthma, allergies, arthritis, psoriasis and colitis.
Still, it's still better than butter, I believe, but I wouldn't claim to know about butter in much detail because I don't use it.
The current thinking is that its better to have more Omega-3s in your diet than Omega-6s, and you may be able to re-dress the balance elsewhere in your diet. You do however, need to have both types of essential fatty acids (and some others which aren't as important and no one ever talks about).
Excellent sources of Omega3s are (fresh) fish such as mackerel, herring, salmon, tuna and sardines. Good sources would be trout, shellfish, flaxseed oil, rapeseed oil, walnut oil, walnuts themselves and brazil nuts.
I spread flax oil on my bread instead of butter/margarine/melted plastic - It's a bit runny and soaks in but its LOVELY!!
Cheers!
Rich.
Posted on: 06 December 2005 by fred simon
.
Thanks for the info, Rich.
The USDA recommends the ideal balance of O6 to O3 as 2.5:1, which is moving in the right direction as far as your info, but also contradicts because it still favors O6.
I'll do some more research.
By the way, Smart Balance does make a spread with flax oil.
Best,
Fred
.
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Fred,
I only looked at the most-like butter, 67% spread at the top of the list - I realised later on that there were loads more spreads that may well have been healthier. Good to know they do one with flax oil - I love the stuff :swoon:
I guess Smart Balance is much better than butter, even in the 67% form. Of course not every individual food has to have a perfect balance, as long as the sum total of what we eat (over a short-ish period of time) comes out pretty balanced then we're ok.
Of course, my books (all written by qualified nutritionists) doesn't quite agree with the USDA, - contradictions certainly abound in this field!!
Keep well,
Rich.
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by Misguided Fool
Well that's me stuffed...I'm Lactose intollerant!
MF
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by Rasher
quote:
Originally posted by NaimThatTune:
- contradictions certainly abound in this field!!
Now there is a master of understatement.
I wonder how long before we hear the "anything's OK in moderation" cliche from someone? (
Damn! I just did it).
I'm giving up food and sticking to black coffee.
BTW, sardines & marmalade go very well together (a sweeter version of lemon on fish), so substituing sardines for margarine or butter could work. (?)
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
quote:
Originally posted by Rasher:
so substituing sardines for margarine or butter could work
Hi Rasher,
Substitute sardines for butter/marg/miracle spread?
As a friend of mine is wont to say (often enough that I sometimes want to punch him). "Well, if it makes you happy..."
Enjoy!
Rich.
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by NaimDropper
quote:
Now I have never thought I was inteligent. I scored zero in an IO test as a thirteen year old for example, but was never stuck with how to deal with real problems from a very early age. I know quite few highly inteligent people who seem to struggle with the basics, such as wiring plugs, or for what reason an oil light flashes on the dash-board of car, shortly before the engine stops, for two real examples. One was a brilliant Classics Scholar, but who actaully had his positive and negative back to front on his Hoover and the Earth cut off where it actually entered the plug. The other (oil pressure) was a Senior CoE Cleric. Now if you cannot apply common sense, as you suggest to sifting the chaf from the seed, then I suspect that you fall into the highly inteligent but rather stupid group of people who often do well, when others posessed of savvy, common sense, call it what you will, never get anywhere, probably because we tend to call a spade, a spade however brutal this may be.
"Intelligence" is an interesting term to define.
Your friends that are apparently "intelligent" but don't know what to do about an oil light or basics about positive and negative are, in my view, out of balance with their intellect and practical knowledge.
Being an engineer it seems that I'm always having to be the pivot point between the theoretical and the practical, the possible and the impossible, the simulation and the realization, the interpreter of the dreams of marketing into the reality of a product for the customer.
I do get very tired dealing with people that are highly paid and regarded yet don't have the slightest idea of very basic things around them.
Changing a tire (tyre) for example. Or just observing tire pressure, not running their expensive cars with about 50% of the recommended pressure, especially during the winter (PV=nRT, the pressure goes down as the temperature...).
I have a neighbor who is a high school science teacher. My past experience with these folks is that they are part physicist, part mechanic, part electrician, etc. and serve as a model for their students, bridging the practical and the academic. Not so with this guy, I had to light the pilot in his furnace once, his family was cold and he didn't know what to do. He had no idea how to light it. Couldn't be simpler and there are instructions on the furnace.
I reserve the term "intelligent" for those that have climbed the hills of academia and practical knowledge.
As to the alimentary debate, I choose the glorious saturated fat of butter over the heart-stopping glob of flavored chemicals in margarine. Doctors and scientists have been talking about the dangers of trans-fats since the 1970s at least. Trans-fats do make the product more saleable but at the expense of our health. A sensible, balanced, restricted junk carb diet allows the body to fully utilize the vitamines and nutrition in the fat.
David
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by JeremyD
quote:
Originally posted by NaimThatTune:
Excellent sources of Omega3s are (fresh) fish such as mackerel, herring, salmon, tuna and sardines. Good sources would be trout, shellfish, flaxseed oil, rapeseed oil, walnut oil, walnuts themselves and brazil nuts.
I used to take flaxseed oil (which helped with depression) but stopped a few years ago when I read that it could cause testicular cancer. This doesn't mean you shouldn't take it but if what I read is correct [sorry, no reference] then it may be important to keep to the recommended amount.
I take fish oil supplements (mainly EPA - omega-3), and I favour coconut oil [which is saturated] for general use (including cooking) or ghee [clarified butter] for cooking. Unfortunately I never cook dinner, which means it is often cooked in olive oil.
I have no way of knowing whether what I say is right: my preference is simply the result of reading various contradictory sources and deciding which to trust.
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Jeremy,
I'm sorry to hear about your depression - I hope that terrible affliction is no longer your current situation.
Yes, contradiction is rife in the world of nutrition advice (and many other places, too). I have a highly active 'bias filter' that operates on a 'is there something in it for the giver of the advice that makes them want me to believe them?' basis, which often serves me quite well.
Getting info from a number of sources and deciding which one to trust (as you do) is indeed the only thing any of us can do to safeguard our health and happiness, I find.
Generally, I try to eat foods in as natural a state as possible (so margarine isn't even on a distant horizon), having said that, our chemistry is such a complex thing that something being natural doesn't mean it's good (fresh Deadly Nightshade with your organic lettuce, dear?)
That said, since I cleaned up my act and sorted out my diet about two years ago (and discovered for myself the effects of de-toxing this year) I feel much better, more energy, more able to sleep etc, and my hearing is better too!!
Keep well,
Rich.
Posted on: 07 December 2005 by fred simon
.
Rich, just as a matter of interest, I wrote to Smart Balance and asked for their take on the O6 to O3 ratio of their products. Here is their reply:
Authorities differ on the best Omega-6/Omega-3 balance; our nutritional experts recommend 4:1 to 10:1. Smart Balance products have been designed to be within that range, including the 3# tub which is identical to the 1# tub of Smart Balance spread. The average diet is 20 to 1 (Omega-6 to Omega-3). We are not trying to get folks to cut down on Omega-6. We would like to see them increase the Omega-3 intake, that is why we market new Smart Balance Light with Flax Oil and Smart Balance Omega PLUS with phytosterols and fish oil.
Despite contradictions, which, as you say, are inescapable in nutrition/health advice (this week, coffee is good for you), everyone can agree that this is at least moving in the right direction.
Best,
Fred
.
Posted on: 08 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Fred,
Almost missed that you'd posted again.
Thanks for referring the issue back to the folk at SmartBalance. I think their answer is excellent - they're clearly referring to the source info behind their decision and are also quite able to see that their product is only one of a large number of things that we eat, and what ratios of Omega 6s to 3s the average diet contains (but who is average?). Also, it is still important to have some Omega-6 fatty acids, but they do state they don't want to cut down people's Omega-6 intake.
The ratios quoted aren't quite what my nutrition book recommends, but I agree that indeed this is a step in the right direction over both butter and (yuk!) Margarine.
Hmm, coffee's good for us now? Rats, I gave it up a few weeks ago and gave my machine away! Ah well, maybe paint thinners will give me the same buzz, but without the caffeine...
The book I've been referring to is called 'Get a Real Food Life' by a lady called Janine Whiteson (M.Sc.) published in the UK by 'rodale', with whom I am not affiliated.
(Originally picked it up in the store because I thought it was called 'Get a Life' which I clearly need to!)
Cheers!
Rich.
Posted on: 09 December 2005 by Rasher
quote:
Originally posted by NaimThatTune:
Hmm, coffee's good for us now? Rats, I gave it up a few weeks ago and gave my machine away! Ah well, maybe paint thinners will give me the same buzz, but without the caffeine...
I'm really sorry Rich, but on the radio last week I heard that Decaffeinated coffee can be really bad. Better stick to the proper stuff. Go get you machine back.
ReportPosted on: 09 December 2005 by NaimThatTune
Hi Rasher,
Thanks for the info - though I think you perhaps misread my post. I've given up all forms of coffee, decaffeinated included.
I'm sticking to paint thinners from now on! *hic!*
Cheers!
Rich.
Posted on: 09 December 2005 by Rockingdoc
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Tate:
And now!, for margerine...
Very high in trans fatty acids...
Triple risk of coronary heart disease...
Increases total cholesterol and LDL ( this is the bad cholesterol) Lowers HDL cholesterol,
( the good cholesterol)...
Increases the risk of cancers by up to five fold...
Lowers quality of breast milk...
Decreases immune response...
Decreases insulin response...
,
Well, all very amusing, but this conveniently avoids specifying what is meant by "margerine". I am willing to believe that some sort of spread exists which may fit the above description, but if you are suggesting that these "facts" apply to the popular market leaders like Flora or Benecol you are seriously misinformed.
I believe that margerine was originally prepared from whale blubber.
I prefer butter myself.
Posted on: 09 December 2005 by Stephen Tate
quote:
Originally posted by Rockingdoc:
quote:
Originally posted by Stephen Tate:
And now!, for margerine...
Very high in trans fatty acids...
Triple risk of coronary heart disease...
Increases total cholesterol and LDL ( this is the bad cholesterol) Lowers HDL cholesterol,
( the good cholesterol)...
Increases the risk of cancers by up to five fold...
Lowers quality of breast milk...
Decreases immune response...
Decreases insulin response...
,
Well, all very amusing, but this conveniently avoids specifying what is meant by "margerine". I am willing to believe that some sort of spread exists which may fit the above description, but if you are suggesting that these "facts" apply to the popular market leaders like Flora or Benecol you are seriously misinformed.
I believe that margerine was originally prepared from whale blubber.
I prefer butter myself.
Posted on: 09 December 2005 by Stephen Tate
Anything hydrogenated.
I change my oil in my car more often than the average takeaway, because hydrogenated fat in places like mc donalds has a nine month life span and takeaways alike. Let alone margerine_ nothing ever grows on it! The only place it is fit for is diesel engines.
regards
