N-DAC against Linn Klimax

But did you hear, HDX/DAC with 555ps???? This is the combo you should REALLY try.

-patrick

Hans, I would keep at least for some time the HDX and would explore other streamers for feeding the Naim DAC and see if any is preferable or not to the HDX. My bet is that the order of importance in the overall performance might be: Naim DAC-555PS-HDX. How much important is the HDX is the key although only yours can tell.

Could 2nd hand HDXs really be hitting the market soon? Awesome.

I'll take your's Hans.... in a heartbeat.

quote:

Originally posted by pcstockton:
Could 2nd hand HDXs really be hitting the market soon?

I'd never sell mine!

Regards,
Michel

quote:

Originally posted by Hans Vereecken:
This week-end, I heard the N-DAC (with and without 555PS) --> Hi-line --> Supernait.
I also had the opportunity to compare this to a HDX (without PS) (--> Hi-line --> SN).

Results :
* the DAC outperforms the HDX.
* With the 555PS, the DAC sounds MUCH better

I already have a HDX.

My question. Since the HDX + DAC + 555PS costs almost as much as a Linn Klimax DS, has anybody compared the two systems? What are your findings?

Should I sell my HDX and go to the Klimax or should I upgrade my HDX?

Hans

Wrong question ... all you should be asking is if it's worth demoing the Klimax - only YOU can decide if the costs involved are worth it to you.

Eloise

Add a Mac and DAC to that list.

Hans, Please can you tell us what was feeding the N-dac/N-dac 555 ps for the demo?

quote:

Should I sell my HDX and go to the Klimax or should I upgrade my HDX?

Hans

Yes

quote:

Originally posted by pcstockton:
But did you hear, HDX/DAC with 555ps???? This is the combo you should REALLY try.

-patrick

Yes, I had the opportunity to hear the DAC with and without the 555PS. With the 555PS, it was clearly much better.

quote:

Originally posted by Mikeie:
Hans, Please can you tell us what was feeding the N-dac/N-dac 555 ps for the demo?

The HDX.

hi hans, the german magazin "stereoplay" tested the linn ds (majik, akurate, klimax) with the new dynamik power + sw....the majik ds has now (!) same points like the hdx... they tested with mp3, hires and cd ripped format... if you have a chance to listen, you should def. do!!!
rgrds ralf

Surely a better comparison would be the NS01-555PS-nDAC against the KlimaxDS, as this would be a more similar topology? The HDX takes care of all the ripping shenanigans (the NS01 too I suppose), and has an on-board UI, whereas the Klimax exposes you to all that stuff - OK if you like it.

I listened to the KlimaxDS and I liked it - a lot. But I didn't have a chance of an A-B comparison, but I have an HDX, and I'm very happy with it, but can't wait for the nDAC

I'm not surprised the DAC outperforms the HDX - the latter only has a Supernait DAC. But it's still remarkably good
Cheers
John

I use an HDX and I have heard it with a DAC and cannot wait!

quote:

My question. Since the HDX + DAC + 555PS costs almost as much as a Linn Klimax DS, has anybody compared the two systems? What are your findings?

There are not many burnt-in DACs around. Naim is going to launch them massively in November. I think the first posts on DAC/Klimax combat will come on January 2010. The contests will be definitely complicated by multiple PS options - DAC, DAC/XPS, DAC/555PS, with/out Powerline, with/out Hiline vs Klimax, Klimax/Dynamik etc.
There will be hundreds of posts and controversial views.
The general summary will be: DAC is better in all-Naim system and Klimax is better in all-Linn system
Sorry for cynicism - gears are changing, but not people.

I'm going to buy DAC along with XPS because I value Naim engineering and Naim house sound.
I'm sure Naim DAC/XPS targets at CDS3/Klimax level and I have a gut feeling they achieved.

My friend owns Linn Klimax DS with new Dynamik PS.
I'm going to stack up Transporter/DAC/XPS against Linn Klimax in couple of months and report on findings.
It's funny to mention that TP on it's own was quite a worthy contender against Klimax
We are all Naim-biased here and Linn should be way ahead of DAC to reep the harvest on naim forum.

quote:

It's funny to mention that TP on it's own was quite a worthy contender against Klimax

Have you ever compared the two? Considering the price difference it is a horse race.

I suspect that a lot of the Klimax cost is attributed to the cast aluminum case, funny how that the Macbook Pro with a cast aluminum case cost little more than US$1,200.

The Transporter is a fantastic value.

quote:

Originally posted by T38.45:
hi hans, the german magazin "stereoplay" tested the linn ds (majik, akurate, klimax) with the new dynamik power + sw....the majik ds has now (!) same points like the hdx... they tested with mp3, hires and cd ripped format... if you have a chance to listen, you should def. do!!!
rgrds ralf

Don't believe everything that is written in the magazines. I also read the German magazine "Audio" and have in the past been "mislead". It's a good starting point, but you still have to listen yourself.

When I bought my HDX, I did an A-B comparison of the HDX (without PS) and of the Akurate DS (without the new PS, not available one year ago). The system used was a McIntosh MA7000 amplifier (9000 euro) and a pair of the new Focal speakers (20000 euro).

For me and my friend (who was with me during the comparison) the HDX outperformed the Akurate DS. So, I don't believe a Majik can perform better than a HDX.

i had a HDX and sold it for Majik DS and Naim DAC:-)

... then of course the switching power supply in the Linn equipment might upset the HDX if used on the same ring-main .. and who knows what the earthing issues are if they were both connected to the same pre-amp for the A-B dem ...

The HDX sounds great, i sold it for a diskless solution...and i'm using already linn in my Naim tower...it works;-)

quote:

Have you ever compared the two?

I didn't do fair comparison.
TP was run through Naim and Klimax through the non-Naim electronics.
The clarity of the sound and 3D imaging is on par for sure.
Klimax was quieter, more analogue sounding and surprisingly better transients.
And Klimax did not have dynamik PS at that time.
Overall -- it did not sound as 10 $K difference to me.

Agreed with your assessment, I brought my Transporter to the store to compare against the Klimax, the Klimax seemed to have a slightly "blacker" background. But not worth the huge price difference, the Transporter street price is way less than $1999 list price. The Klimax, about $20K?

quote:

The Klimax, about $20K?

Klimax was 18 K$ before recession. I think now it went down to 14 K$.
It still > 12 K$ more expensive than TP.
The fact that TP is not hitting the sales around the world is just a
mere consequence of that any market is massively based on the established reputation.
The sad news is that Sean has left Logitech and this means TP will most probably stop in evolution as an audiophile gear.
I hope that such a talented personality like Sean will stay in audiophile world and design new gears. I think this type of people can't pause their creativity and enjoy the layback life on the beach.

quote:

The sad news is that Sean has left Logitech and this means TP will most probably stop in evolution as an audiophile gear.

Very True... they bought slim for the mid-fi streaming products. The Transporter as Sean's expression of real hi-fi must make them virtually no money in the great scheme of things so we will never see it upgraded. At least the community of developers keep the firmware up to date with the latest server software.

OK, this is funny.

People are using streaming solutions because they "dont want a computer in the listening room", but yet are doing exactly that with a DS, or the non-existent, but desired Naim streamer.

If it hooks up via ethernet it is a computer. Even if it doesn't look like one.

Hell, the HDX is a computer.

It depends on the way we use a word "computer".
If we mean digital domain then all CDPs are computers

To me there are three critical elements which make streamers to be a choice for hi-end audio:

1. Streamers have high quality power supplies which avails lower output jitter and don't pollute the rest of audio gears with noisy power supply feedback.

2. Streamers don't have noisy PC coolers and HDDs which are unbearably audible and always annoy me (even laptops).

3. Streamers don't seduce me to post while listening music

And this is why I use NAS/Transporter instead of PC/Transit (and yes, HDX seems to be more like computer to me ).