Hamilton

Did you see LH make a joke about his dad's crash last week? ie, how can you crash a car at 30mph?!

Well done Kubica though hows that for "laying" the ghost(almost) of last years race?

"It was the bird in the Force India pits with her baps out Ron"

Jono

Hamilton is a talented driver but it was basic errors that cost him the championship last year and will be again this year if he doesn't look sharp.

Did anyone hear Brundle ask Bernie during the grid-walk about the "pikies" repairing the track? Best of all, Bernie knew what he meant!

Tony

quote:

Originally posted by Frank F:

Looked like a bit of a "boy racer" incident to me - didn't see the red light guv,

FF

He'll end up with more than a 3 point penalty for it, though, Frank!

Oops, Brundle is in the POO over his Pikey comment I mentioned above....

Tony

Pikeys ain't Gypsys. Usual PC wankers "angry of Tunbridge Wells" types wouldn't know real Gypsy if they fell over one.

I have to say when I first saw the accident I thought 'what a twit'. However, on reviewing it, it's easy to see he could have been blindsided, and the very fact that Rosberg made exactly the same mistake in the same place speaks volumes for the fact that the accident couldn't be avoided.

In my view the true fault lies with Ferrari who put out their man in parallel with outgoing traffic!

quote:

In my view the true fault lies with Ferrari who put out their man in parallel with outgoing traffic!

Yeah if the Ferrari lined up behind Kubica he could have taken them both out.

The Ferrari lollipop man should have kept Raikonnen in until the pit lane was free of traffic, but that would have meant giving the race to the others.

The fact is there is not meant to be overtaking in the pit lane. In effect, Raikonnen was attempting to overtake Kubica and if the crash had not occured it would have been a drag race to get out of it (onto those lovely marbles on the track).

Ferrari are the instigators of the crash in my view.

I'll remember Frank's reasoning if I ever get flashed going through a red light....


Tony

quote:

Ferrari are the instigators of the crash in my view.

So the people who obey the traffic lights are responsible for the actions of those that don't? Even if Hamilton was so inattentive, or did not look at all, that he missed seeing the red lights, how could he not see 2 stationary cars?

His fault entirely, no excuses - not from him anyway.

Nigel,

The Ferrari shouldn't have been there in the first place. No Ferrari, no crash. The lollipop man wanted his driver out in front of the McLaren and let his man out early.

Tony, on the road, you're allowed to go through a red light in order to avoid a collision provided it is safe to do so.

I wonder how many people have successfully defended themselves against a prosecution for going through a red light? Especially considering that drivers are prosecuted after being 'flashed' for going over the stop line at a red light to allow the emergency services through.

Tony

quote:

Pikeys ain't Gypsys.

Round here a "pikey" is understood to be a traveler of Irish decent, as opposed to a proper Romany "gypo", not that I condone the usage of either term. However, I met quite a few people at University who used the term "pikey" for what I would term CHAVs, and the Scots term NEDs. There are some interesting variations too, "pikelet" for small chavy children for example.

quote:

Originally posted by Frank Abela:
Nigel,

The Ferrari shouldn't have been there in the first place. No Ferrari, no crash.

Frank

You clearly have a Hamilton bias (or anti-Ferrari bias) which is clouding your usually good judgement. It is immaterial whether or not there should have been 2 cars side by side at the end of the pit lane. This is not, actually, that uncommon or in fact against regulations. The FIA has taken no action against the drivers of the 2 cars at the head of the queue or their teams.

What is a fact is that Hamilton slammed into the back of a stationary car from about 50 kph. That is stupidity at worst or inattention at best.

The "Hamilton incident" shows, thankfully, that todays formula 1 drivers are NOT robots. And congratulations to Kubica!

JohanR

quote:

It is immaterial whether or not there should have been 2 cars side by side at the end of the pit lane. This is not, actually, that uncommon or in fact against regulations. The FIA has taken no action against the drivers of the 2 cars at the head of the queue or their teams.

My understanding it is a single file as per behind the pace car. Whether it is an offence to be 2X2 I don't know.

I entered this thread hoping for a discussion on the merits of Hamilton, Lanarkshire. How disappointing to find this instead !

The last two races were pretty entertaining actually...let's hope the trend continues.

Nice for Kubica to have some good luck this year in Montreal... unlike the last time he was here.

Sandy

I'm a bit late on this one...it looks like Martin Brundel will be buying seven caravans each with a free dog LOL

Scotland mate. Hamilton is in South Lanarkshire, on the outskirts of Glasgow. It has close links with the Isle of Lewis.

Nigel,

I admire Ferrari immensely for their dedication and zeal. I just feel their competitiveness got the better of them in this case. I also felt they deserved last year's wins, especially given the industrial espionage committed against them - and I remain surprised McLaren were allowed to race after that, although the cynic in me says that politics played a role because the championship would have been a total blow-out if they hadn't.

I admire Hamilton for his generally well behaved approach. I also admit that he has been responsible for some truly spectacular blunders, one of which cost him his title last year. I also blame McLaren for 2 of those blunders because they should have known better last year and brought him in earlier to go for the points,a nd this year because they should have informed him of the red light.

I take a largely passive view of Formula 1 - I enjoy the racing and dont really have an allegiance any more. I used to be a big Lotus and then Williams fan, but find it difficult to be a fan of any team or driver nowadays.

My initial thought when I saw the incident on Sunday was what a numpty Hamilton was, but on reviewing the replays I firmly believe the crash is Ferrari's fault, and in particular the Ferrari lollipop man's. No blame should be put on raikonnen who couldn't possibly have seen the train of cars coming up the pitlane. Once ensconced by 16 men around the car it's simply impossible for the driver to see much of anything in the lane which is why the lollipop man is there.

At the same time, I appreciate why one could easily just say it was Hamilton's fault and that he was inattentive. Again, I think he was blindsided by Kubica's car and couldn't see the light early enough. In other words he was too close tot he car in fornt so there is an element of blame to be put on him for that.

That said, I find it interesting that Rosberg made the same mistake. He piled into the McLaren too, though not as badly, and he also went after the McLaren rather than being a good boy and moving up to take position behind Kubica. In my view, this shows that the possibility of the blindsiding and the closeness of the cars is a plausible explanation for their actions. the teams should have warned their drivers of the red light, but also the drivers should have been wary of those lights. So everyone had a part in the incident but I believe Ferrari's contribution was greater than any of the others', though you could argue that if the Ferrari wasn't there and Hamilton pulled up alongside Kubica when he noticed the red light, he'd probably have received a broken rear end courtesy of Rosberg! We shall never know of course and I wouldn't have been happy if Hamilton did that since there should be no overtaking in the pit lane. He could argue he thought Kubica had stalled of course...

At the moment it's incumbent on the teams to ensure that they send out the cars safely. In my opinion, this is unfair on them, because pit stops are just as much a part of the racing as anything else. I believe there's a good argument for the lollipop man to be an impartial (hah!) martial or even for motorised bars with sensors for pit lane traffic. The pressure on the lollipop man to send out his driver as early as possible while maintaining safety is extraordinary. If the ferrari lollipop man had waited, he'd have put Raikonnen out several cars behind Hamilton and probably lost his job.

quote:

Originally posted by Frank Abela:
Nigel,
... you could argue that if the Ferrari wasn't there and Hamilton pulled up alongside Kubica when he noticed the red light, .... since there should be no overtaking in the pit lane.

.

Well if the Ferrari wasn't there and Kubica wasn't there, Hamilton might have won. But they were and he crashed into them.

Also there seems to be some misconception about what overtaking in the pit lane is. I say again no offence was committed by either Ferrari of BMW.

Frank, the error was Hamilton's and McLaren's no one else. Get over it.