NAS Devices: Basic info for a complete novice

Hi Peter

Ok I’ll have  ago

1.     You are correct providing the NAS has an UPnP/DLNA server install on it.

2.     NAS drives are designed to run 24/7 by having enterprise quality HDD’s installed in them (worth checking any proposed NAS have these fitted).
My NAS a ReadyNAS_NVX can be set to spin down the drives after a period of inactivity, they spin up again when next accessed. Again you would need to check if this would be possible on any proposed purchase.
There is no reason why you could not shutdown and boot up again when required, overnight for example, though others will say they are designed to run continuously so should not be necessary.

3.    Wired is generally preferred, many seem to find wireless works for them it would depend on your location/building. Naim say only one leg should be wireless. I certainly would NOT want my NAS or any that I have so far heard in my listening room, mine is in my study. Although the discs may spin down the electronics are still powered and require cooling, so the fan will/may run.

4.     AFAIK you will need to run the squeezebox server in addition to the UPnP server. You would need to ensure that any proposed NAS could do this.

5.     The server on the NAS will build it’s own database of your music and it is this database that the streamer will use to allow selection of you music. Exactly what you see will depend what server the NAS has running on it.

6.      You can see some of the things to consider from above, you could also consider a WHS box as an alternative to a NAS, although I see Microsoft are discontinuing this shortly. The advantage might be that you would have a choice of server to run on it.

Regards

Peter

Simplest solution if streaming to a Touch is to buy a Vortexbox. Come in all shapes and sizes - look at their website. I have had one for 2 years - worked flawlessly and always left on. Rips, tags, catalogues albums and makes them available to a Touch via squeezebox server. Also has own in built player if using USB to connect to a DAC. Turn it on - Touch finds it straight away. Start ripping CDs - easy as that. Any issues - great UK back up. Can control from iphone or ipad via iPeng.

Mine is physically located in same room and hard wired to router which is hard wired to Touch. Mine has had some mods to quieten it down, but they do fanless and SSD versions which are silent. Cant answer about itunes as do not use it, although it will also mirror to MP3 in addition to ripping FLAC. Vortexbox also shows up on MAC and TV as a server and music can be accessed, also rips DVDs and can stream films to a compliant device such as a Oppo.

Peter and Focalist,

Many thanks, that is a great help to me.

Peter, you mention that Naim say that only one leg should be wireless. I assume this is because audio data does not pass directly from the NAS drive to the streamer, but passes via the router. Is this correct? Which begs another question - how important is the router to the whole thing? We have a standard BT home hub, would this suffice, or would it need to be upgraded? Incidentally is one allowed to use a router other than that supplied by the broadband provider?

Thanks,

Peter

+1 for VortexBox. For the price of a basic NAS, you get the entire solution.

+1 for someone's suggestion that NAIM or this forum write a detailed guide to home audio networking. I think I've asked before, and this forum software can't do Wiki's. There's several guides out there, but I think there's a benefit in doing one here.

- Wireless: I'm not familiar with NAIMs recommendation - but yes, if you use wireless, I would use it on the Squeezebox and have your NAS (or VortexBox :-) plugged directly into your wireless router.

- If you need more plugs for more network cables, what you need is a "switch" sometimes called a "hub." I suggest you get something by Cisco, with gigabit ethernet. These are not too expensive -  $50 - 200 depending on how many ports you need. You can safely fill up the ports. You need to run 1 line from your BT box to the switch. So, if you get an 4 port switch, keep in mind 1 of those needs to be the line between the switch and the BT router therefore you really only get 3 to use. You don't need or want another "router" Some wireless switch come with one - try to avoid it. If you need to get one of those, plug it into your BT box and turn off the router function.

- iTunes: Myself and others have had endless difficulties storing iTunes libraries on NAS devices. iTunes constantly creates a new, local library on your machine, and the result is a total mess, especially if you also sync an iphone or ipad with apps, content, calendars, etc. to that computer. It is possible to make it work, but I'd recommend against it. I've had as many as 6 iTunes libraries on my machine. Maybe it works on a dedicated Mac Mini, but if you use a lap top and open iTunes when not connected to your NAS, you'll get a new library.

This is good advice. I have never managed to get iTunes to play nicely with anything other than its own default libraries and file structures (which are just fine by me). I run a Mac Mini Server with 1.5TB so all my iTunes file storage can be local, rather than on a NAS or USB-connected drive. I do use a USB drive for back-up, though.

Hi PjL,

I think Peter_Rn perfectly answered your questions.

In case you would opt for a NAS and avoid VortexBox (though a very good solution), the only thing I'd add to Question 3 is to really try using Wired connections to the streamer and avoid wireless. Especially with Hi-Res music and Video files can be quite large and need some "free-highway" to smoothly stream through your gear. For cabling choose at least Cat5e or even better Cat 6 (prices are similar).

When you choose a NAS and assuing you stick with the more well-known devices from Synology, QNAP or ReadyNas, my selection criteria would be:

- noice generated

- raid possibilities

- available UpnP software

- easiness of swapping disks

When I bought mine, I choose a 2 * 2Gb model. If I coukd do it again, I'd go for 2 * 4Gb bearing in mind my rather "enthusiastic" purchasing of music :-)

Good luck

Iver

Many thanks to all for the replies. This information is extremely valuable to me. I am at present in the position of an outsider looking in on the whole hard disc/streaming world, a world that I hope I shall before too long be taking my first tentative and shaky steps into.....

Peter

I was the same but did some research and found a cheap entry into the world of streaming with vortexbox, a touch, and ipeng for ipad. It happens to be very good for the money. Although you can buy ssd prestige versions or custom versions. Good luck with whatever you decide.

I'd agree. - for a laptop etc it can become messy. With a fixed installation you've got no problem with moving the library to an external drive. My NAS starts up 10 mins before my Mac auto starts. The mac runs a script to auto mount the drive so if I need to fire up ITunes, the external library is available and iTunes functions as normal. 

Dear Members,

Regarding iTunes libraries and storing them on a NAS, please have a llok at the website frol iLounge. If you follow the clear and easy instructions, there are hardly anyvissues with the library.

Iver

Regarding wired vs wireless. Do not confuse these with audio cables. The nas should not be anywhere near your hifi they are all noisy in more ways than one.

They need to be wired to a switch, which in turn is wired to the router, both of these devices can be far far away from your hifi. If by some strangeness your internet is fed from the outside into your music room, thats fine, the router can go there but send a wire out of the room to a switch to hook the nas up.

I've had Synology and (currently) QNAP NAS's, both great and very easy to set up, just use the default settings and you won't have a problem. Amazingly useful things for streaming music and movies around the house, impossible to live without once you've had one.

If you're running Squeezebox Server make sure whatever NAS you buy has at least 256MB ram, it's painfully slow with less.

I've never had any problem with iTunes libraries on an external drive, either NAS or Firewire, but I don't use a laptop.

Also, avoid wireless connections and only use hard drives recommended by the NAS maker, extensive lists available on their websites.

Hi Peter

If at all possible wired will always be preferred to wireless except you will need a wireless connection for you phone/ipad of course. You are correct in saying that everything passes via the router or switch depending how the wiring is arranged.  

Personally I have a cable connection so do not use BT, however, from reading other peoples comments on this forum the home hub has come in for some criticism, many changing them. I guess you would try it and see if it works for you.

If you could install fixed wiring remember that the switch (you need a switch not a hub) can be installed in any convenient position, it doesn’t have to be next to the router.

Regards

Peter

Peter,

Many thnks for clearing that up for me.

Jasonf,

I agree totally with your philosophy of keeping things as simple as possible. That is one thing that worries me about the whole streaming business - it seems in some ways like using a sledgehammer to crack a nut, at least if you don't require multi-room playback, which I don't. Unfortunately I could never consider the Unitiserve option on cost grounds. But for those that have the money I agree that it is probably a nice neat and simple answer, although I do wonder about flexibility and future proofing as the technology seems to be maturing so rapidly. It is an awfully big investment to make if in a few years time it is effectively obsolete. But everyone will weigh things up and decide for themselves.

The other option is to go down the simple PC/DAC route, which certainly is the simplest and most elegant of solutions and also offers a number of advantages. For myself I still have plenty of time to mull things over before making a firm decision. The jury is still out......

Peter  

Cant get cheaper or more simple than vortexbox music (£350 - (google search "vortexbox uk") + sb touch (£200), job done. If you like it then you can look at more expensive options - Mac Mini/DACs/Naim (other) streamers. Or if you have a PC already why not download the vortexbox software - its free from their ".org" website under downloads (although may not have all the functionality of a fully configured purchased unit) and includes Squeezebox server - can have a play for nothing then!!!

Hi bazz

I am using QNAP/Twonky. I am happy with it generally but not being able to search music by Composer is a major drawback. I have heard that with Synology NAS search by Composer is one of the default methods. Since you have used Synology before, can you confirm this is really the case?

Thanks.

Hi Peter, I went through exactly this process a year ago when deciding whether to go 'cd less' at all, and if so, how.

First, I concluded that NOTHING is "future proof." Anything I bought in the summer of 2011 was going to be either obsolete or at least bested several years later.  But, I wanted hi fi in my home, and so I had to jump in.

Second, I decided that I wanted a solution that would just work at the touch of a button or two; I did not want to start down this road with a hobby -- just music. I do pretty well with computers and home networking, but I did not want to be 'playing with these' to ensure high quality music every time I wanted to listen.   

Third, we have no tv in the living room and I did not want a tv, computer monitor, or a computer at all in the room.  We wanted an elegant looking hi fi, and nothing that looked like the controls of a space ship, or like a 'computer room.' 

For us, the system I bought hit all of these objectives.  The source is UnitiServe into the Naim DAC.  I did later add a nas, as I am now more knowledgeable, and during the time I was setting up the nas I still had all my uServe music to entertain me   (Perhaps digital files stored on a nas are the most future-proof, but that is of little consequence as the nas itself is by far the least expensive bit of kit in the system.  Some interconnects can cost more than a nas   )

To answer 5. VortexBox operates as an iTunes streaming source using the DAAP (Digital Audio Access Protocol) You can listen your music from iTunes or from an Apple network attached client such as an ipod touch.  DAAP is an autodiscovery protcol so your VortexBox should just appear in iTunes. The VortexBox will appear in the “Shared” section on the iTunes sidebar.

The DAAP server in VortexBox rescans the mp3 folder every few minutes so if you add new mp3s or load a new CD it could take a while for them to appear

Bart,

Your solution is indeed an elegant one, but one which I could never afford! I agree about computer monitors - I don't relish the thought of having one in the lounge.

As for future proofing, yes for sure nothing is truly future proof, it is impossible as nobody knows what the future holds. One must take the plunge sometime, but at least if the chosen solutions are relatively cheap then changing them when necessary need not be financially disastrous. Of course this need be of no particular concern to those with deep pockets!

Peter

Hi Peter, 

As I recall, Synology's proprietory software does allow a search by composer, not a feature I took advantage of though.  A fine machine, and I'd still have it except mine was an entry level model with 128MB ram, which just wasn't sufficient to run Squeezebox Server at a reasonable speed.

I got a QNAP 219P+ just to try something different and software-wise it's broadly comparable, a bit more solidly built with a metal case, and with 1.6GHz CPU and 512MB ram plenty fast. It sits on a gigabit switch at the other end of the house with my wife's iMac, a printer and a VOIP phone controller box and has never given a moment's trouble.

Hello Peter.  I too have a QNAP / Twonky.  Can you not search by Artist?  On my database the composer of orchestral music comes up in the Artist field.

I must confess to being deeply troubled, yet smiling and foot tapping madly at the same time!

After a lot of reading on the web, this forum and discussing with my neighbour who is a media streaming software expert by profession, I have started to take the plunge into streaming music & movies.

First up, a Synology 212+ NAS with 2 very high speed, 2TB Seagate hard drives, plus a Synology 212 with 3TB Seagate drives as back-up in a different part of the house, just in case.

Second, a CAT6a network installed to connect everything to a managed switch (which minimises the audio traffic through the wifi router)

Third, rip the 600+ CDs carefully to AIFF format on the main NAS drive using dBPoweramp, checking that each rip passes the Accuraterip quality test.  We settled on AIFF because the other 50+ devices (a slight exaggeration) in this household are all Apple....

Fourth, use the built-in Synology upnp software to replay the music (this isn't the correct terminology, but you know what I mean!), transcoding it from AIFF to WAV in the process (hence the higher speed NAS drive to execute the processing)

After all this, I am temporarily playing the music via a 5 year old PC in the study through its creative 2.1 speaker system that must have cost at least 2p.

And the pop & rock music all sounds additively, foot tappingly engaging.  Lord only knows how it will sound when I pop an NDS into the main system....

Yours most currently cheap & cheerful, FT