Gibraltar - What Does Spain Really Think

Not to worry, folks. Far-age in on the case!

"Nigel Farage, leader of Ukip, called yesterday for Gibraltar to have its own
elected MP in the House of Commons. “What I want to see is us saying to
Gibraltar ‘Right, let’s integrate you more deeply in the UK,” he told ITV’s
Daybreak."

And here we are making all those remarks about their politicians...

Indeed, Tony.  Mr Farage, though leader of UKIP, has yet to get himself elected as an MP. So perhaps he should be making these representations in the European Parliament, and to his colleague MEPs from Spain, rather than Daybreak.

One of the things people fail to realise is that  diplomats are the ones who are going to sort out this mess not the politicians who started it  in the first place! Politicians just take the credit for it!

This really is a storm in a tea cup with Spain calling the Kettle Black.

Both UK and Spain have a History of Empire and land acquisition.

So Spain should surrender Cueta and The Canary Islands to Morocco and maybe the Ballearics too.

We can then surrender Gibraltar and the Channel Islands.

But that could cause real problems.

So I agree with fat cat and Giles.

David

George,

I've never subscribed to this view that New Labour was Tory lite. True Tony Blair won power by moving Labour to the Centre but that was a facade. It was frankly a case of "Meet the new boss, same as the old boss" and in effect they were the same as Old Labour in that despite Gordon Brown's initial stance as "prudence" he was as profligate as any modern day Chancellor with the tax payers money. In the early years all was well because he had the best economic conditions any Gov't could hope for but as soon as the recession hit the cover was blown - he created 800,000 additional jobs in the public sector alone - that was never sustainable. The Baroness on the other hand had a tight grip on expenditure.

And as far as prosecuting war goes I'm sorry Mrs T had a mandate for the FI for which Blair never had for Iraq. 

In my opinion history will prove Tony Blair and Gordon Brown to be the most reckless prime ministers this country have had in modern times.

ATB Lindsay

PS: I'm not a tory Lloyd-George and Asquith were the truth reformers. I wish for a truly modern free market Liberal Party.

Dear Lindsay.,

Exactly where I stand on politics, and there is no Party that could contain me nowadays.

Politics in the UK has gone to the dogs. I voted Liberal at the last election with a view to moderating the excessed of the Tories, as there was no risk that this style of vote would let the Labour shower in.

ATB from George

As far as I am concerned the talk of territories and empires or lack thereof is so 20th/19th century. In the 21st century it should be down to devolution and the population to determine who they are affiliated to. If Gibraltans wish to be Spanish then so be it, otherwise it should remain or potentially even become under the juistiction of Morocco should they wish...

PS the same goes for the Flalklands, Ascension islands,  Scotland, England  you name it.

Simon

Ceuta (along with Melilla, another a Spanish enclave in Morocco)  is considered a part of Spain, whereas Gibraltar is not, and never has been a part of the UK.  Convenient semantics perhaps, but that's the main drive behind Spain's argument that the two are completey different scenarios and should not be closely compared.

However, I have to agree with Simon here - it should be down to the population to decide.

The last three posts have all concluded with " it should be down to the (local) population to decide", or words to that effect and that appears to be a wider concensus.

How "local" is "local"

Falklands ? Ascension Islands ? Northern Ireland ? Scotland ? Wales ? IoM ? Channel Islands ? Cornwall ? Yorkshire ? Newbury ?

and for out friends overseas..........Alberta ? Alaska ? The Confederate States ?

The list is endless.

And how often do the "locals" have to vote ? Every year ? every time Spaim/Argentina/Eire/Lancashire/etc threatens to invade ?

Cheers

Don

I detested Thatcher and everything she did and stood for.

But she did do one thing for which she deserves praise for, and which people fail to acknowledge. In 1982 she stopped a vicious fascist junta (one of the most brutal and murderous of the post War dictatorships) stamping their jackboots over 2,000 blameless Britons. I always find it odd that those who profess to oppose colonialism (and Thatcher for that matter) seem unable to accept this - it's almost as if they'd rather people were driven from their homes or suffered under the yoke of oppression.

The fact that she won another election as a result is deeply unfortunate but irrelevant in this case, as the outcome was positive: the people of those islands are free to decide their destiny. If they don't want to be part of Argentina then that is something Argentina has to accept.

All that matters is that people are free to decide their own fates. If someone wants to belong to Britain, or Spain, or Argentine or whoever, that is their right. If they want to be independent from Spain, Britain or Argentine then that is their right also.

If the people of Gibraltar want to be "British" then then is their right. Mr Cameron and Senor Rajoy have no say in the matter.

Pity that didn't happen in Chagos, when the British expelled the inhabitants to allow the USA to build a military base.

The indigenous population is only allowed to voice an opinion when it's expedient to do so.

Hello! Royal Navy just said HMS Westminster plus 2 auxiliary ships will be "visiting" Gib on their way to the Med.  Just like old times.

MDS 

Isn't that all part of the annual Cougar exercise?

Cougar exercise on Gibraltar.

Would that be when the older trannies from the Westminster go chasing the local Spanish waiters.

"Merely reinforcements of goodwill, Humphrey"

http://www.bbc.co.uk/news/uk-23624715

I agree. The whole Chagossians/Diego Garcia episode was - and remains - an utter disgrace.