Breaks between tracks

Posted by: John Treble on 09 May 2014

I am generally pleased with my relatively new streaming system, but one annoying feature continues to bug me. Some CD's feature continuous music, which is split into two or more tracks. Play these on a CD player and they will play continuously. However, play them on a streamer and they will - at least, some of them will - play with a short break between the two tracks. For example, I have four CD's of Ton Koopman playing harpsichord works by Buxtehude. These are mostly quite short, and of the 30 or 40 tracks on each CD, many are intended to be played continuously. The fact that the streaming software introduces a short break would not matter so much if the track breaks were in the right place, but every one of them seems to be half a second early, so that the dying note of the track before the break is cut short by a break of maybe a second and resumes after it.

I called this 'annoying' but a better word for it may be 'unmusical'.

Anybody know what if anything can be done?

Posted on: 09 May 2014 by sjbabbey

John

 

What streamer are you using and what version of the firmware is it using. There was an issue with gapless playback just as you describe but this has been fixed in the latest firmware version 3.22.

Posted on: 09 May 2014 by sjbabbey

If you're using the n-stream app have you noticed that the buffer level falls immediately before the gap in playback?

Posted on: 09 May 2014 by hafler3o

Also please let us know what software you used to rip the Cd and what the settings were. You may have inadvertently allowed an inter track gap to be inserted during the rip process. Just as annoying are when some CDs have music playing during a count- in period (where the CD time display counts down in negative seconds to zero). Some ripping settings have to be adjusted in order to grab this missing music, as aggressive inter-track silence removal can be just as much a pain.

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by John Treble

Thanks for your replies, folks. Here are the best answers I can give:

Originally Posted by sjbabbey:
John

What streamer are you using and what version of the firmware is it using. There was an issue with gapless playback just as you describe but this has been fixed in the latest firmware version 3.22.

The streamer is an NDX. I don't know what version of the firmware is installed. Presumably there is some way to find out, but I don't know what it is. It hasn't been updated since the streamer was delivered last October.

Originally Posted by sjbabbey:
If you're using the n-stream app have you noticed that the buffer level falls immediately before the gap in playback?

Yes. It does. About 3 secs before the end of the track, the buffer falls to 70%.

Originally Posted by hafler3o:

Also please let us know what software you used to rip the Cd and what the settings were. You may have inadvertently allowed an inter track gap to be inserted during the rip process. Just as annoying are when some CDs have music playing during a count- in period (where the CD time display counts down in negative seconds to zero). Some ripping settings have to be adjusted in order to grab this missing music, as aggressive inter-track silence removal can be just as much a pain.

I used dbPoweramp. I have not knowingly changed the settings from whatever the defaults are, except for the target folder. The machine that I used to rip the Buxtehude died a couple of weeks ago, so I can't actually check what the actual settings were. On my new laptop, I can't see where on dbPoweramp one might change the inter-track interval.

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by hafler3o
Originally Posted by John Treble:

The streamer is an NDX. I don't know what version of the firmware is installed. Presumably there is some way to find out, but I don't know what it is. It hasn't been updated since the streamer was delivered last October.

 
Originally Posted by hafler3o:

Also please let us know what software you used to rip the Cd and what the settings were. 

I used dbPoweramp. I have not knowingly changed the settings from whatever the defaults are, except for the target folder. The machine that I used to rip the Buxtehude died a couple of weeks ago, so I can't actually check what the actual settings were. On my new laptop, I can't see where on dbPoweramp one might change the inter-track interval.

The streamer sw sounds the most likely suspect. You can check your sw release by pressing the spanner key on your remote and scrolling down to 'factory settings', then select 'system status' then scroll down to 'version'.

Sw 3.22 is latest for streaming products and includes a bug fix for gap less (sic!) playback.

 

I use dBpoweramp too, but before we start talking ripping methods/settings let's make sure the sw on the streamer is up to date 

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by hafler3o

PS: updating to 3.22 fixed a rare gapless playback problem on both my SuperUniti and Qute2. Server is a cheap WD NAS running Twonky, which is reputed to be rather 'autistic', but we seem to get along fine!

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by sjbabbey

John

 

Firmware version 3.22 was released in November 2013 so you probably have an earlier version and will need to update. Click on the "naim" logo at the top of the forum page and then Customer Support/Updates. Scroll down to "Network Player" and there you will find the links to download the latest version of the NDX firmware including a pdf file with instructions on how to go about the update.

 

Good luck!

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by mrspoon

For what it is worth, all CD Ripping programs will rip a gapless CD as gapless, as there are no gaps there to remove. If ripped to a lossless audio format, there will be no audio gaps in the files.

Posted on: 10 May 2014 by quickben

I had similar problems even with 3.22 firmware streaming from my Synology NAS - eventually resolved when I switched from diskstation to Logitech media server - no idea why but I eventually got to enjoy Dark Side Of The Moon gapless

Posted on: 11 May 2014 by Singlespeed

Also, FWIW, if I set my Synology Nas to transcode audio from flac to wav I get the gaps in playback on albums like DSOTM & Marillion Misplaced Childhood etc....

Posted on: 11 May 2014 by Jota
Originally Posted by Singlespeed:

Also, FWIW, if I set my Synology Nas to transcode audio from flac to wav I get the gaps in playback on albums like DSOTM & Marillion Misplaced Childhood etc....

 

I have set Minimserver on my Synology NAS to transcode FLAC > WAV24 and these albums play properly.  Listening to Misplaced Childhood just now.

Posted on: 12 May 2014 by John Treble
Originally Posted by sjbabbey:

John

 

Firmware version 3.22 was released in November 2013 so you probably have an earlier version and will need to update. Click on the "naim" logo at the top of the forum page and then Customer Support/Updates. Scroll down to "Network Player" and there you will find the links to download the latest version of the NDX firmware including a pdf file with instructions on how to go about the update.

 

Good luck!

I've checked the NDX. It is running version 3.21, so presumably I shall have to update it. Shouldn't my dealer have notified me of this?

Two difficulties:

     I) I haven't got a machine that fits the specifications in the instructions. Will the update work with Windows 8.1?

     II) I haven't a clue what the cable specified might look like, or where it ought to be plugged in. It sounds very exotic, but probably isn't. Did one come with the streamer? What's all that stuff about drivers?

Posted on: 12 May 2014 by sjbabbey

John,

 

To be fair, your dealer probably wasn't aware of this issue and, of course, the firmware update was released after you received the unit.

 

I'm not sure whether you can use a Windows 8.1 machine (I use an old XP based laptop) but I would expect that you should be able to as it is currently the latest version of windows.

 

Below is a picture of the back of the NDX. The cable should be fitted to the RS232 slot i.e. 2 to the right of your network connection.

 

 

Below are pictures of a male to female RS232 connector (the male end fits to the NDX) and a USB to RS232 cable which you may need to use if your computer only has USB ports. Finally, I would normally expect windows to automatically detect any new hardware (i.e. the RS232 cable) and instal any necessary drivers.

 

 

 

Posted on: 12 May 2014 by Singlespeed
Originally Posted by Jota:
Originally Posted by Singlespeed:

Also, FWIW, if I set my Synology Nas to transcode audio from flac to wav I get the gaps in playback on albums like DSOTM & Marillion Misplaced Childhood etc....

 

I have set Minimserver on my Synology NAS to transcode FLAC > WAV24 and these albums play properly.  Listening to Misplaced Childhood just now.

Good to know cheers Jota

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by John Treble
Originally Posted by sjbabbey:

Below is a picture of the back of the NDX. The cable should be fitted to the RS232 slot i.e. 2 to the right of your network connection.

 

After dropping £25 (and 90 minutes driving) at Maplin's, I find that the back of my NDX doesn't look like your picture at all. In place of the RS232 slot there is something called 'USB update', which sounds as if it might be the right thing. The socket is not a USB socket, though. It's about half the width and has wiggly sides so that the bottom is narrower than the top. I'm not happy with the idea of taking the NDX all the way back to Maplin's. Does anyone have any idea what I should ask for when I get there?

 

(Tried to add a photo of the socket to this, but failed.)

 

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by sjbabbey

My apologies John. Obviously the picture on naim's product info page is out of date.

 

Looks like you need a usb to mini usb cable. However, in view of my previous inaccurate advice I'd prefer a current NDX owner member here to confirm this.

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by John Treble

I wouldn't feel too badly about it. The Naim documentation unequivocally specifies RS232 for the NDX, so who are we to know?

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by hafler3o

I spent £6 on a miniUSB to USB at Amazon, when it arrived I realised it was the same lead that was sat in front of me when I ordered it! My wife's digital camera (Canon) came with one, and I'd just downloaded fotos to the PC. Moral: maybe you already have the lead, but don't know it!?

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by John Treble

Funny you should mention that. My camera's got one too!

Posted on: 14 May 2014 by John Treble
OK. It seems to be all OK now.
I still don't understand why Naim's instructions devote so much space to the obvious page-by-page exposition of how to respond to the Wizard(s), but lapse into the incomprehensible (indeed, inaccurate) when it comes to explaining the hardware required.

Thanks to all who offered help.