NDX or Dac for Longevity?

Hi David

As with everything hifi have a listen and see what you prefer.

will just say before the fire storm, that if i had the money for an NDX again, id demo and ND5 SX  and a Chord Hugo. This way you cover all bases.

Graeme

Thanks for the replies guys. It's good that you enjoy the Hugo so much, particularly since it looks like something you'd put in a picnic box to keep it cold. Now if it did that too it really would be a bargain!

What I was wondering though was which out of the ndac or ndx you thought was more likely to be outdated by future technology - not in terms of sound quality, but in terms of actually still working with newer networking equipment and protocols, new file types etc.

A slightly odd sort of question I know and probably unanswerable, and maybe I wasn't clear enough, but that's what I meant to ask.

Cheers,

David

I would say that both are out dated already going by what other units can offer. But only you can decide if these other formats or functions are important.

Graeme

For what it's worth, these pieces of equipment do slightly different jobs. The NDX will stream and convert specific file formats and converts the LPCM digital signal to analog using its own internal DAC. The nDac handles the digital to analog conversion stage only. You could therefore conclude that  the NDAC is more future proof in that as long as the equipment feeding the LPCM signal can convert any future file format this will not present it with a problem.

You should be aware however that there has been a lot of discussion on the future of the current NDAC which some here feel could be succeeded in the not too distant future.

Buy secondhand and get both. They sound fantastic together. I tried the mac mini but just couldnt get it to work as I wanted it to. Im not computer illiterate but im no expert either. I cant see either being a doorstop for the next decade. Of course better things will come along but you will always have a great sound with these. 

sjbabbey,

This...

"You could therefore conclude that  the NDAC is more future proof in that as long as the equipment feeding the LPCM signal can convert any future file format this will not present it with a problem."

...is kind of what I was thinking. Probably the way I'll go I think.

Mr Happy,

I might if I could, but even secondhand I probably couldn't manage that. ND5XS and Dac maybe....

" I cant see either being a doorstop for the next decade."

You're probably right. Probably not something I should worry about.

"Of course better things will come along but you will always have a great sound with these."

That's the way I see it. Thanks.

Is there a reason why you haven't considered the DAC-V1 in tandem with a Mac mini?

Hi David,

I've considered it. I kind of suspect the others have more potential. Plus my guess (which is all it is) is that USB might not be terribly future-proof itself. It's ubiquitous now, but we all know that's no guarantee of anything. Plus I want to plug a cd player in as well for occasional use and I'd be surprised if the ndac wasn't better for that?

I also like the idea of being able to plug in my iPod, though I'll be surprised if that's still an option in ten year's time.

Am I wrong about any of this do you think?

I think I would tend to suggest the NDX. It can act as a DAC with SPDIF and Apple inputs and USB memory sticks and also handle web radio and UPnP. Also there is an update scheduled for around September so I understand which will allow it to work with an increasing range of streaming services such as Qobuz and  Spotify.. Although they may not both be available in the first update.

Simon

Yes I heard that - that'd be good as Spotify is fantastic for classical, which I want to listen to a lot more. I suppose you'd use the app to control that - can't imaging using Spotify with the remote and the screen on the NDX.

The lack of Spotify as it stands though is weak point of the NDX for me. Would be a pain to have to get another device just for that. That and listen again on iPlayer.

I read that you can (unofficially) get Spotify to play through the NDX on an iPad by starting to play a song on it then pressing the home button. Can anyone confirm that?

Thanks.

Yes, you will control the functionality through the new Nstream, which looks quite different to the current version... And that I have seen.

As far as the hack you mention, not aware of that and cant see how it would work.

Simon

I set up one of the digital inputs on my NDX for my girlfriend, who is intimidated by the NStream app, so that she can stream from Spotify or LastFM. She controls it with her iPad, which connects to the NDX via AirPlay into an AirPort Express. Optical out of the Airport connects to the NDX. Simple, and though it doesn't sound as good as UPNP playing lossless files, she isn't complaining.  

Hi David,

If Naim network players were available with a replaceable dac card it wouldn't be so hard to make a choice between nDac and NDX don't you think? I would go with a second hand nDac and Mac mini or laptop.

with battery powered dacs

what will happen when the battery goes dead?

I would not buy this kind of device if I wanted longevity

some other risks are there, the battery might expand and damage the unit.

Good point.  However, I have a 9+ year old iPod that still works and I imagine the Hugo should last as long. [fingers crossed]

What was involved when they added 24/192 functionality to the NDX. Was it an internal board change.

Could they conceivably do this again to update it, or the Ndac for that matter.

Graeme

Nothing is future proof - nothing at all.

Dac V1 & Mac Mini is very flexible - separating the streaming / rendering from the Dac seems to me a very sensible and cost effective approach.

Tog

Graeme, yes it was the streamer module that was changed. However the main Naim DACs have an architecture that is largely defined in hardware.. although there is scope to modify the DSP from what I have gathered, possibly incorrectly,  there is limited processing power and memory available. Also the short coding sequence of the DSP for I assume the recursive IIR reconstruction filter is very sensitive to coding timing. Changes here have had (possibly un intended) sonic impacts with some of the previous firmware upgrades. ...

I believe current DSP wisdom is that the best reconstruction filters can be created from FIR filters albeit at much increased processing cost. If you read the Naim white paper in development they appeared to listen to FIR and IIR filters within the constraints of the architecture and settled on IIR sounding best. Let's see what happens..

Simon

DAC of course

+1