New n-Stream app is here

Naim - Please respond to these complaints regarding playlists!!!!

Bert,

I believe that there is an upgrade to the app coming that solves the Playlist issue. My understanding is that it has been submitted to Apple and therefore due anytime.

The issue, was that playlist created in n-Stream 3.x wouldn't play in 4, due to some extra detail in the playlist file. I had recreated mine, but had an old one in the backups, so was able to send them, old and new versions of the same playlist making debugging the differences easier.

In my exchange with the Engineer, I confirmed that in the update, Playlists created in both 3.x and 4 will be supported.

So just hold on in, and wait for the update.

Simon.

You guys need to calm down a bit, pebble dashing the forum with these moans is not helping Naim & Apple,  they have a new beta in for validation at Apple & we are waiting for it to be released.

............  go read TJ's (Naim R&D Designer) posted fixes sticky list in the Streaming Audio header.

When that does get released I would normally expect most issues to be fixed but would not be at all surprised to have more revisions required over the next months; thats the way it is with apps & soft/firmware revisions on already working systems.  

(you beat me to it Simon)

I think that's a bit rich for someone who's made 8 posts in the last 24 hours.  If Simon 'beat you to it', why did we need your musings?  As an aside, I'm not here to help Naim and Apple - they provide the services, not me.

Mike's right - stop mithering and wait for the new app update. It's a lovely sunny day, so be happy.

My "musings" are staying where they are my friend,  Simon was nice & polite, maybe too polite.  

I too am not here to help Naim & Apple & agree as a customer its frustrating to have something new not working as we all wish,  but to keep blathering on after the fix list was published is achieving nothing.  

Simon,

Thanks for your encouraging words, and great to hear you have been of help to the Naim engineers to work the issue. I'd rather wait a couple of days than rebuilding my dozens of playlists. Fingers crossed....

By the way how did you save and send playlists from your iPad? How & where my iPad stores my playlists is a mystery to me... Tx!

They disappear or contain tracks which cannot subsequently be found. Delving in for a closer look crashes the app. It then repeatedly crashes when restarted, facilitating deletion and reinstallation.

Two words. Piss poor.

Not so much the icing on a Naim system which could cost more than a house, as crapping all over it.

Acquired a Sony Z2 tablet on Friday so as a newbie to 'pads' thought I'd download the new Naim app. Installed without a problem, found my Qute and Uniti and controls both beautifully. 

Incredible that Naim has got this so good first time round. To read it will soon be even better, is frankly amazing. Taking cognisance of dual platforms, multi-room application, older hardware support, multiple network variables and customer abilities. Exceptional. Few companies do that.

And best of all Naim sound quality preserved. The frills will be great if they can be fitted in but not at the expense of redundancy or reliability. 

Well done Naim, cracking job. The best just got even better.

Andy

In my opinion, if you're constructing playlists on a manufacturer-specific control app against a locally-namespaced media object store, you are bound to run into problems, especially when the content directory is re-indexed at the server, at the control point's local cache, or at the player / renderer (if a local cache exists)–or if you change players within the same brand.

The industry, as a whole, needs to be much more sensible regarding track metadata (e.g., every track, in each codec / format, should be assigned a globally unique identifier against an openly-accessible global object store, of which track instance has its own checksum). This would resolve a tremendous number of issues that (at the moment) are only addressed as rather incomplete facets (e.g., ISRC, AccurateRip, broadcast auditing tools, etc.).

This also does not address the fact that a playlist against material compatible with a specific renderer (say, an original 96-kHz compatible NaimUniti optimized for WAV playback) might be unplayable (or suboptimal) on a different renderer (e.g., a Linn Klimax DS optimized for 192 kHz FLAC), depending on the level of abstraction involved.

Only then could a contract exist that (on a given local media server / cache) a specific file resource exists, in a specific (on-server) location, that it is what it says it should be (e.g., commercial release of 96 kHz/24 bit material from a specific collection of tracks organized as a release) and that it could be made available for playback (or transcoded playback) as a member of an ordered set of file resources (i.e., a playlist) compatible with the destination player.

Fair comment. Why don't Naim know this? I can't understand how it got through beta testing. And why did it work in nStream? 

* - perhaps should add onto that first paragraph as:

If you are using a manufacturer-specific media-server control app, you should entirely expect that any playlists created on the server itself should persist after a database re-build.

On the other hand, if you are creating playlists at any location other than the server, there is no clear mechanism for insuring that the objects you selected will be / are available for playback unless some other means of synchronization or point-of-reference is established. One way of doing this is to use globally-namespaced object UUIDs for media files; currently, there is no absolute guarantee that the UUIDs generated by most media servers (and consumed by control points) in the DIDL will persist a database rebuild on the server itself (unless it is encoded into the metadata header on each individual file).

This gets more complicated if you create playlists that span more than one media server root, since there is no safe notion of accessing a resource (from a server-based playlist) that you have no control over....

can someone confirm in the know confirm to me that the imminent upgrade fix (once installed) will allow me to see and play my ntream-created playlists with UPnP/Input settings/UPnP compatibility mode/OFF? or?

enjoy

ken

Hi Ken,

yes, 4.1 will allow viewing, playing and editing playlists created by both n-stream 3.x and the new naim app

What does the UPNP compatibility mode do? Mine is inactivated but all seems to be functioning OK.

G

I've just come across a new (to me) issue which I've not seen posted before.

i have set up 'Presets' to include the relevant DAB and iRadio channels. Whilst in 'Edit Preset' it is easy to move channels around to order the list. However, when leaving the edit screen the channels saved randomly change order, disappear or duplicate of their own accord.

i have a NaimUniti running firmware v3.22, the new Naim app and UPnP set to compatibility mode in order to remove any playlist issues.

Any ideas anyone?

Same problem here with NDX (firmware 3.22).

It  gives a better & more stable presentation to the whole UPnP play Graeme.  Among the stuff it does the album cover page is "fixed" so it does not allow the playing track to change if you inadvertently move (swipe) the picture across.  The folders & other viewing lists are neater as well  

-  try it,  if you don't like it its easy enough to go back;  I am sold on it tho' ....   

A disadvantage of the compatibility mode seems to be that you can't FF and RWD tracks. The pointer on the slider bar disappears so that you have no in-track navigation.

nudgerwilliams,  I believe Phils description is for the old 3 series nStream as its dated July

Its different in the new 4 series released in Sept

I tried & rejected compatability mode with the old nStream,  but really like it in the new. 

Mike,

Phil's description still stands correct in that in compatibility mode it is the streamer that acts as a control point not the mobile app. This works round potential compatibility issues with the router not handling UPnP properly from a mobile device (unfortunately quite a common problem) or there being a compatibility issue between the mobile device and the UPnP server such as wrong transcoding or delivery of wrong cover image size etc.

The difference with the new naim app and n-Stream is that the compatibility mode browser has been improved. In fact the same browser is also used for iRadio and USB. So for all these inputs the following improvements have been made:

- Faster list loading

- Much faster list searching

- Alphabetical sorting is now available - previously only the native sort order was available (tap A-Z button to switch between native and alphabetically sorted)

- Different size list and grid sizes (repeated tapping of list and grid option buttons)

I have a SORTALBUM (or ALBUMSORT) tag in all of my FLAC files so that albums sort by artist and release date.   Sorting by title is less useful (for me), not least because I can't remember if it's "The Division Bell" or "Division Bell" and I never can remember the name of that China Crisis album with the ridiculously long name.  I don't think I'm the only person that sorted their CDs and records by artist and by year (sort-artist anyway).

I know it's not possible now, but it would be really nice to be able to define a sort order.

Hi,

Any browsing or sorting functionality is provided by the UPnP server itself - not by the app or the streamer - however if the UPnP server provides a browsing functionality that doesn't result in alphabetically sorted lists then it may be necessary to enable UPnP compatibility mode on the app to prevent the app resorting the lists alphabetically...

Best Regards

Phil

@ Ollix2 and XH558

Preset moving should have been disabled for existing product firmware. This bug will be fixed in naim app version 4.1. The next uniti firmware release will enable preset moving from the app at which point it will start working. Sorry for the confusion on this one.

Tom