Please Naim, can I go back to the n-Stream app

Yes, the remote is fine, and is getting more use. Where an app scores for me is visibility. That green-on-black OLED display (the ND5 XS in my case) is poky and only readable from a narrow distance range. Compare that with, say, the Pro-ject DS colour display. The Pro-ject app is dire, but then you hardly need it.

Alan

You and me both, I find that part of it absolutely infuriating, I suppose I will get used to it.  But they will probably change the app then!

@rjstaines - as I have said a number of time on this site - we are the lunatic fringe.  I don't know too many people who would sit down and listen to music all night and not talk or do anything else whilst listening.  But your observations about NAIM's direction are rather scary and I think 100% correct.

@ken c - as far as I can see you remove all or one at a time.  I blame touch screens for this though, that sort of thing would be easy with a mouse and/or keyboard but on a touch screen not so.  The mouse fires click and double click events and one selects (click) and the other invokes (dbl click) - it's simple and impossible on a touch screen.

I hate touch screens.

as i recall, there was some kind of 'edit' function on nstream that allowed you to 'nominate' which tracks from a playlist to delete, but i dont see that functionality now in the new app.  so now what happens is that when I accidentally touch a track from an album and then the whole album is added, I cannot 'undo' that last action -- so I have to remove the accidentally added tracks one by one?? Hmmm... i guess i just have to be more careful in my old age...

enjoy

ken

rj-Daunt has hit the nail on the head here, here's an app deveolped for a £1k player and presented to the £12,790 (NDS) customers as an 'afterthought' control app

Absolutely untrue, our plan was always to combine all apps into one, the app would recognise which device you had , streamer, uniti, mu-so, server etc

I have no difficulty using the app with my nds and many others also, if you are having trouble explaining it to customers arrange a trip here for training.

This being said we are totally clear about the issues recently faced and have worked  to resolve them, many of this issues  have been found to be outside of our control and for sure many have been under our control, but fit for purpose for a nds, absolutely.

I've been using the 'new app' for a while now, and I find it as easy to browse to and play my music on my NDS or Qute2 with the new app as the old.  The new app has gotten a LOT better since it was released initially.  There definitely are still a few features on my wish list (e.g. scrolling titles on the iPhone so I can read the entire title), but for the way I use it (turn it on, browse to Albums or Artists or Newest Cds to find what I want to listen to, and then click to play) it works just fine and the interface now seems intuitive and navigable.  The album art graphics and they way they are used in various parts of the interface is a rather nice touch. 

I personally loathe the iPhone as one of the most over-hyped products of all time but I bought an old Apple iPhone3 from my daughter to act as a controller.  Its operating system only allows me to use n-Stream but that is adequate.

I trust Naim will leave n-Stream on Apple Stor so that those of us not worshipping at the Apple Church every time it comes round with its collecting bowl and a new toy, can continue to use it

Ken no need to tell me that, I am doing it all the time.

This is not a sound strategy -- relying on a very old piece of hardware when you KNOW that legacy support is for a limited period of time.  Knowing that legacy support is finite, you "trust" that it will continue.  You are free to loathe what you like, but when you start complaining that legacy support has ended for what you rely on it for . . . "I told you so" will be an appropriate response.

My experience: I found N-Stream very intuitive and did what I wanted.

I found the Naim app initially confusing, a confusion compounded by the fragility of the coding and a coincidental flakiness of my home network. 

By the time the first fix was in place I'd worked out how to use it without pain, though the odd crash was infuriating but not deadly.

The current version is fine for my purposes (I don't use playlists so maybe that's a plus, I don't know).

It's clear there was a rush to release this for the Mu-So launch but even so, the testing for the first two versions was poor by any standards, a lesson clearly now learned by the thorough testing, by real end users, for this new version.

I'd also add that a lot of grief could also have been easily obviated by a user guide - I know Apps don't customarily have one, but Naim have never had much time for custom (thank goodness).

Yes Gary why no manual?  I had to post on here to find where clear cache had been moved to.  OK so if I had faffed around a bit I would have found it.  But no manual is poor.

Bart

I'm so pleased I'm allowed to like or loathe what I want.  Long may that continue.

But tell me, why should Naim or Apple or anyone else simply take down something that works?  They do so to force people to buy their new products; it's as simple as that.

If I buy a vintage Mercedes I do not expect Mercedes to keep improving it; of course not.  I do expect them to either stock the spares for it or allow others to manufacture them.  They do and that is why you see vintage cars around in working order.  You don't see vintage computers working - and you won't

The computer industry takes us for the mugs we are and the "I told you so" argument just plays into their greedy hands

I suppose it could be argued that a policy of continuous improvement is an improvement over a policy of only incorporating improvements in new models?

My ancient NAP250, serviced and upgraded by Naim ( who have always guaranteed that serviced products are as good but generally better than originally) sound dramatically better, in part because of improvements in components. I didn't need to buy new in order to enjoy improvement. 

Pin the case of iPhone, if you sync with iTines and NOT icloud, all your old apps are there, ready for you to 'downgrade' to when you don't like the new. I decided to persevere with the new app but if I really need to the old one is there on standby. Whether that applies to other phone brands I can't say.

naim clearly feel the new app in a better app and maybe they are right - a voice ferrous few of us disagree - I susoect a good few of us watched the Simosons, where Homer thought he could design a better car - and promptly didn't! If Naim responded to all our issues the app could end up very strange indeed and probably worse despits our well intentioned commentary.

of course, you are right, it is good that we can choose, we could also choose Linn, VTL or Sugden too but presumably we chose Naim because we liked what it did in its primary role, to play fabulous music fabulously?

as I said before, we complain because we are passionate about this stuff and perhaps because we think, rightly or wrongly, that we have a unique handle on what we see as a serious issue. Other posts suggest deep joy with the app and many, who don't know the old one are probably wondering what all the fuss is about.

naim read all this stuff and probably at least acknowledge our criticism - I suspect some bits will filter into later updates and, who knows, there may be other apps just around the corner - or not.

one thing I also suspect is the case, is tha Apple put a great deal of pressure on developers to adopt the new styles, in this case the rather uninspiring 'flat' style and I doubt very much whether a sim would be allowed to make nStream pretty again!

Not quite.  Recall that the naim app, and the nStream app that proceeded it, are free downloads. If you don't like them, you don't have to use them -- there are alternative UPnP control points.

No, the issue here is expense avoidance.  It costs Naim money - primarily in people time - to support multiple, older versions of their apps. In addition, they have long had the goal of unifying their apps, so I would not be surprised if a future version of naim includes nServe functionality (greyed out for those who only need it for network player functionality).

Hook

Well, I've ditched the new Naim app for now.  I'm tired of it's bugs.  It often wont load up when I open the iPad and it takes some time to close it down then open it up again.

If I select an album to play, hit 'play all', the app closes down to the system tray and I have to open it up and go through the selection again and the last thing I want to be while listening to music is infuriated.

I'm going to use Bubble UPnP until we get an app that works smoothly and flawlessly. Like the NStream app used to come to think of it.

That surprises me as well. Why no manual?

Hook

You miss my point.  I realize Naim and nStream are free (and in my opinion hardly worth that, especially the woeful Naim Android "controller"). 

The point is that computer manufacturers are content to let old hardware die; other industries do not.  Vintage cars are an analogy. They were designed for leaded petrol and cross ply tyres which we cannot now readily buy.  But the industry still produces them (yes, at a cost) so that those who wish to use them can still do so.  Computers and their peripherals don't give us that choice