Statement has landed

Posted by: Graham Clarke on 09 May 2015

So after three long months of waiting, my Statement preamp finally arrived yesterday.  I managed to do pretty well in being patient until we got down to around the last ten days…  This was the starting point:

 

 

Since my Statement home demo via UHES in January I’ve changed my two main interconnects to Super Lumina ones and have swapped out NAC A5 for Super Lumina, at a somewhat excessive cost, but with brilliant results. 

 

 

To answer a previous question asked on the Forum regarding how these speaker cables are tuned, it is down to the resistor used.  The resistor is soldered across the positive and negative cables and then surrounded in the metal box to protect it.  This provides the correct inductance that the power amps require.  The tuning is the value of the resistor and the type of resistor used (e.g. RS Components, Farnell etc).  Required values were determined for specific lengths via listening and then other lengths were calculated via a computer program.

 

Anyway, onto the day.  The plan was to check the torque settings on the S-600 speakers’ drive unit screws, break down, clean, tighten and reconfigure the Fraim racks, install the six Super Lumina DIN-XLR cables and oh, just add the Statement S-1 pre-amp to the mix, replacing the 552…

 

To complete this task we had four people.  Ian and Norman from UHES of course, plus Jason Gould and Mark Raggett directly from Naim.  It’s always enjoyable spending time with Ian and Norman but also getting to spend around four hours with Jason and Mark was the icing on the cake.

 

 

Ian first checked the speaker torque settings, which turned out to be fine since their last check nearly two years ago.  Given I purchased these as ex-demo speakers from UHES it’s probably no surprise that they had already bedded in and didn’t need further adjustment.

 

I wish I could say the same about the Fraim racks.  These were new a year ago and Ian had told me that I should check the tightness of the spikes after a few months because there is a degree of compression and expansion of the wood from new which will loosen them.  Having assumed that they would just be slightly loose combined with a degree of laziness and a manic work schedule I’m afraid I hadn’t bothered.  Well, when we broke down the power supply Fraim rack and lifted the base off the carpet, one of the spikes remained embedded in the concrete floor, to my embarrassment!  So YES, you really DO need to check these with newly built Fraim racks.

 

During this time break down time, Jason and Mark had man handled the S-1 flight case out of Mark’s car.  At least for the UK, these are delivered direct from the factory to the customer.  “Man handled” is the correct term given the 102Kg shipping weight but this was slightly easier than in January as the case now has detachable wheels.  Direct delivery is done to ensure that the unit turns up in 100% perfect condition both cosmetically and functionally.  This was of course not a problem with mine.

 

While they were busy doing this, I kept myself busy by taking a look at the long awaited DIN-XLR cables.

 

Anyone familiar with Powerlines or Hi-Lines will recognise the packaging.

 

 

 

As you can see, both ends use the Air-PLUG technology that the other Super Lumina cables use via a set of interconnecting metal rings.  The XLR canons are also metal, unlike the original ones.

 

Jumping forward slightly, the only glitch of the day was that when installing these cables into my Snaxo BMR, the far end of the Air-PLUG connectors on the top cable touch the one beneath.  When the system has bedded in I’ll have to see whether this actually makes an audible difference.

 

 

There was another box which was unexpected, this turned out to be the Statement accessory kit, the finish of which was beautiful.

 

 

There were three layers to this box with the top containing the manual and a spirit level.

 

 

The second layer in mine was empty given I had not purchased the Statement power amps.  Apparently I am the first person world wide that Naim have supplied with just the pre-amp, all other purchasers have gone for the complete system.

 

In the bottom layer of the box were a number of tools

 

 

Including some Statement Fraim chips (different from standard ones) and the remote control which is in the bag on the right.  This is constructed of metal and is similar in weight and feel to the NARCOM remote.

 

Given the NARCOM remote is £300, I dread to think how much a replacement one of these would be.  I better not lose it down the back of the sofa.

 

After completing the first Fraim rack, Jason and Mark unpacked the pre-amp.

 

 

Given the size, weight and space constraints this does need to be planned!  With the protective cover removed it finally appeared for the first time.

 

 

Even unpackaged this weighs 60Kg so moving into position isn’t an easy task.  This is what it looks like inside to help explain (no, this isn't mine!)

 

 

That's a lot of components!

 

Happily (for me) I left the task of moving to Mark.

 

 

No pressure there Mark, I’m sure you loved me taking pictures of you while you were doing this!

 

 

We agree not to put it flush up to the racks so that it could be easily cleaned.  Getting the position right, ensuring it was absolutely level and parallel with the left hand rack easily took 30 minutes such was the perfectionist nature of Ian and Mark. 

 

Installing the second Fraim was relatively straightforward after this, poor Ian was left to do this while everyone else chatted and watched on.  Jason commented that normally with home installs they get involved directly but knew that they could leave this to Ian given his expertise.  High praise indeed for UHES.

 

One added bonus of moving to two racks and separating them slightly is that cable dressing is now much better, with no Burndys touching the wall and all but a few cables off the floor.

 

 

Finally, after over four hours of work, everything was set up and listening was about to begin!

 

 

By now it was about 6:30PM and we had a dinner reservation for 7:30 as we were all hungry, so we only had limited listening time.  I wasn’t too worried about this because the pre-amp is brand new and stone cold, the DIN-XLRs are also new and the rest of the system would have cooled down, so my expectations weren’t too high.

 

From the first track there was a slight degree of harshness around the sound.  This was consistent with the from cold demo in January.  High frequencies were also a little tight and I’d say that the pre-amp and system in generally was probably only at around 50% of its full potential.  Despite that, some of the greatness from the January demo was already apparent: the super low noise floor (if it was any lower it would be sucking noise out of the room) along with the incredible detail and separation of every instrument being played.

 

Unfortunately Saturday obligations mean I won’t get to listen further until later in the afternoon, but both main sources have been left active playing into the system and with further warm up I’m expecting a big jump.  So you’ll have to wait a while longer for the clichés and superlatives.

 

More to follow and thanks for reading if you got this far.

 

 

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by George Johnson

We all have bad days. Patience is virtue. Wait another day and the listener will be in good condition and - surprise, surprise - the the system will be back to the top-line as left by Naim in the initial instal

 

ATB from George

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by ken c
Originally Posted by George Johnson:
Originally Posted by ken c:

Dear George,

 

I am not arguing the merit or otherwise of DB's post. Clearly i can't as i wasnt present at the listening session. And even if i was, i would either agree or disagree with him. Of course, just to be dramatic or rude or ...  I could choose all sorts of more colourful words to describe my disagreement -- but i'm not sure this achieves anything in my view.

 

enjoy

ken

 

 

Dear Ken.

 

And there is the rub, because I am discussing the rubbish DB posted.

 

So with respect, I have to ask, "What is - exactly - your point?

 

ATB from George

if you choose not to see the point, then I give up...

 

enjoy

ken

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by Richard Dane

George (and a few others)...

 

Might I suggest you cool off and go straight to the Music Room.  

 

Do not pass Go, do not collect £200, etc..

 

 

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by joerand
Originally Posted by George Johnson:
I would give DB's post the prize for the worst I have ever read on the Forum in over ten years.

 

George

I'm interested to know what the prize is as I'm certain I could do (and have done) much worse 

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by Aleg
Originally Posted by George Johnson:
Originally Posted by ChrisH:
Originally Posted by George Johnson:

I would give DB's post the prize for the worst I have ever read on the Forum in over ten years.

 George

Seems a bit harsh?

Maybe I'm wrong but dont all multi box systems with a lot of cabling (and I can imagine there is a hell of a lot behind this system!) need re-dressing from time to time to ensure everything is as it should be?

The truth can often seem harsh, but kind in the long run ...

George

you are not the guardian of truth, you are just another dude with an opinion just like the rest.

you are entitled to to have a different one than others but you were not in the circumstances to judge the validity of the the statement made by DB.

 

so if any rubbish has been spoken than it was your statement and not DB's.

For me it is another example of what I consider to be your limited mental flexibility.

Posted on: 02 June 2015 by 911gt3r

Hi Richard ( moderator).

How about deleting the posting from Georges spat at DB onwards? It is a blemish on a thread, which essentially has been highly informative and entertaining. Graham was the first person here to receive the S1 and deserves better both present and for posterity ( future searches). ATB Peter

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Chris Dolan
Originally Posted by 911gt3r:

Hi Richard ( moderator).

How about deleting the posting from Georges spat at DB onwards? It is a blemish on a thread, which essentially has been highly informative and entertaining. 

..... but it would still be a form of censorship. I believe that George may already have deleted some of his own posts though. 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Richard Dane

Peter, as always, probably best to just get back on topic.

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Graham Clarke

Wow, what a lot of overnight excitement!  Is there a full moon?  <Checks watch> Oh yes, there is!

 

I normally refrain from getting involved in heated debates .  Rarely does anything positive come from them and bluntly, I have more important things to do with my time than trying to convince someone else of my point of view.

 

I am going to respond here this time because I appear to be inadvertently near the epicentre of this one and feel that people may read things into a silence that are not intended.  I do agree with Richard though regarding moving on, so I won't be drawn into further discussion on this.

 

George - relax!  You generally seem a respectful person and this does seem out of character for you.  I'm sure the readers on this forum are quite capable of forming their own opinions on things said by everyone, there's no need for someone to adopt that role on their behalf.

 

I do find it surprising you can decide what Gary did or didn't hear last Saturday given you weren't there.  Unless you are now moonlighting as the invisible man!    To claim to know better what he did or didn't hear would be akin to me voicing an opinion on your DAC V1/NAP 100/ESL system when I've never even see it let alone heard it!

 

The system did sound off prior to his visit and I was concerned that he wouldn't be hearing it at its best when he had a 4 hour round trip.  I did warn Gary, he was very gracious about the whole thing.

 

By "pinging the cable" he merely checked that the Burndies weren't touching other cables and weren't under tension.  They weren't.  Mark, Jason, Ian and Norman had indeed paid a lot of attention to this during set up but as often with cable dressing there are compromises to be made due to room layout and available space.  Here's what cable spaghetti junction looks like:

 

A lot of cables, eh?

 

There was indeed a speaker cable touching the Burndy from XPS (bottom of right hand stack) connected to nDAC (bottom of left hand stack), so as described he made a minor reposition.  Both cables were lying on the floor.

 

Did it make a difference?  Well by the end of the three hours listening the system did sound better than at the start.  There was more tightness to the bass.  We're not talking orders of magnitude, but it was there.  Despite this, the system still doesn't sound as good as it did two weeks ago which appears to be an artifact of pre-amp run in (see Norman @ UHES's earlier comment indicating they experienced the exact same thing).  So it didn't miraculously improve the next day, much as I wish it had!

 

So the difference wasn't huge.  But it was there.  Three people all agreed on that.  Ignoring for a second my view and that of Gary's, the third was my wife who is uninterested in the technicalities of hifi but does have a good comparative ear.

 

What caused the change?  Well, it could have been a coincidental change in the run in.  Seems unlikely given that this didn't happen in 3 hours of listening the previous evening but coincidences can happen.  It also could have been the changing of the cable position.  Anyone who has attended a Naim factory tour will know that they are fastidious about internal cable routing, even down to the quantity and exact positioning of cable ties.  If that can make a difference then why can't repositioning a speaker cable?  Likely we won't be able to 100% determine the cause.  Gary may well be completely right.

 

OK, let's get back to the music, please?

 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Foxman50

Graham

 

Very well written as always, its always a pleasure to read your posts. And i really don't want to carry this on, but feel i must comment.

 

You say you don't know if it was the cable "Ping" made by DB or just the pre running in. Is this not easy to prove by placing the offending cables back together.

 

I have no experience of systems in your league so i try to have an open mind. But for things like this it seems a quick A-B-A-B etc would be easy to do.

 

Ultimately it does not really matter as you are clearly over the moon with it. Its a selfish request on my part.

 

Graeme

 

Graeme

 

 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Focalist
Originally Posted by George Johnson:

Ken,

 

I am not here as a popularity contest, but when ai see rubbish I call it so however un-pupoplar. DB can fix what the two best men from Naim and the two [possibly best men from dealer network] set up by "pinging" a cable and then the system came to life!

 

Could none of these people hear that their best efforts at set-up were wasted as the system was "sulking?"

 

Hyperbole is one thing, but defending it it is another altogether.

 

Admit that a change may have been achieved, but it was certainly not day and night.

 

Are the top men at Naim idiots for set-up? If you say that DB is right, then they are, and that is silly claim, which you will no doubt shortly retreat from, or you as daft as DB's claims of self-proclaimed [and as yet unsubstantiated - sorry to our Danish correspondence - use a dictionary]  by the owner, who must have been deeply unhappy with the efforts before DB "pinged" the cable if the Naim people were wrong ...

 

 

ATB from George

Finally some sense. If a £57000 pre-amp sound quality is dependent on the position of a cable its design must be terribly flawed. I maybe able to entertain small changes in sound, most likely from psychoacoustics, but coming to life....is hyperbole of the worst sort. I wonder how you can enjoy anything with that level of paranoia, it must be paralysing.

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Harry

Nicely done Graham.

 

How is the S1 sounding this week?

 

 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Graham Clarke
Originally Posted by Harry:

Nicely done Graham.

 

How is the S1 sounding this week?

 

 

Hi Harry,

 

Thanks for asking.

 

I think it's still going through it's "early life crisis" or "teenage tantrums" aka "burn in".  Or maybe some Gremlins have crept in through the Powerline.  Is there a mains filter for that?

 

In some ways the sound does seem more coherent when listened to as a whole, but when focusing on specifics such as high frequencies they seem further back in the mix than they used to and the "there's no where to hide" precision is still a little lacking.

 

I'm guessing I will just have to be patient in this regard...  When UHES leant me their demo unit in January it had about six weeks of run in under its belt.  It had all the qualities I initially heard in my unit, before they ran off and hid.  My unit is two weeks behind by comparison so hopefully things will soon change for the better.

 

Many of the S1 characteristics are still there though.  For instance the fact that no instrument affects an other.  Gary succinctly described this as a lack of intermodulation.  Wish I'd described it like that!

 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by ken c
Originally Posted by Graham Clarke:
My unit is two weeks behind by comparison so hopefully things will soon change for the better.

 

 

they will, Graham, in 2 weeks, or less ... even without 'pinging'

unless the system has been infected by some virus... 

 

enjoy

ken

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Harry

It will be only a matter of time Graham, as I'm sure you already know. Who knows what goes on, but we've all been here or hereabouts. I look forward to hearing of developments and however this thread develops I hope that you will continue your trail blazing accounts. You will not be alone for ever but right now you're our man who can.

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by Lionel

For me, and it has been a bug-bear for many years on this forum, is the almost slavish expectation that naim equipment takes weeks or months or more to reach perfection and that along the way the sound will get better, then worse, then better, then worse etc. and the more expensive the kit the longer it will take.

 

Some seem to take an almost peverse pleasure in this.

 

Solid state electronics simply does not behave in this way and if it did planes would be falling out of the sky every other day, MRI scanners would work or not work unpredictably, your TV, watch, computer, phone would be fickle and tempremental.

 

If those members who have an expensive car found that on one day it would do 180mph but on the next would do only 30 I am damn sure they would complain vociferously about it.

 

I am sure that those who claim to hear these artifacts do indeed hear them, what I seriously doubt is that it has anything to do with the cable pinging.

 

 

 

 

 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by ken c
Originally Posted by Lionel:

 

I am sure that those who claim to hear these artifacts do indeed hear them, what I seriously doubt is that it has anything to do with the cable pinging. 

 

you're dead right. warm-up/run-in has nothing to do with 'pinging'...

 

enjoy

ken

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by 911gt3r

Is it me or is this thread almost predictably ' souring' ?!  Peter

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by james n
Originally Posted by 911gt3r:

Is it me or is this thread almost predictably ' souring' ?!  Peter

Yep - bit of noise creeping in. Let the man enjoy his new purchase. The block function is extremely good at removing the crap 

Posted on: 03 June 2015 by CharlieP

I am most interested in posts by those who are reporting on the sound of the Statement playing music.  Strongly held opinions, unsupported by observations, are of no interest to me.  However, this discussion does raise an interesting point regarding the setup, "care and feeding" of such a very fine preamp as the S1.

 

In my experience, as the quality of my HiFi components has increased and become more revealing of subtleties in reproduction of a musical performance, so also has my system been more revealing of subtleties in "setup."  Changes in shelf support, cable dressing or digital file format which were once unnoticeable now become important to getting the best that a system has to offer.  

 

Consider the effort which has gone into the design and build of the Statement components.  Attention to vibration control, electromagnetic interference, temperature stability, are all over the top.  The result is a preamplifier of unprecedented musical capability.  However, these features are not likely to make the S1 completely immune to the effects of cable dressing or other external influences on the music signal before that signal enters the S1.  To say that the S1 is "flawed" because it is sensitive to setup is lake saying a Bugatti Veyron is flawed because it won't run on heating oil.

 

In any case, I am guessing that Graham's system sounds mighty fine, even when it is a bit off optimum!

 

Cheers,

 

Charlie

Posted on: 04 June 2015 by Graham Clarke
Originally Posted by 911gt3r:

Is it me or is this thread almost predictably ' souring' ?!  Peter

Peter,

 

It's just thread run in.  All Naim threads do this, they eventually get better.

Posted on: 04 June 2015 by ken c
Originally Posted by Graham Clarke:
Originally Posted by 911gt3r:

Is it me or is this thread almost predictably ' souring' ?!  Peter

Peter,

 

It's just thread run in.  All Naim threads do this, they eventually get better.

enjoy

ken

Posted on: 04 June 2015 by Harry

That's good.

 

And so obvious now you say it.

Posted on: 04 June 2015 by Tabby cat

Darke Bear pings a cable and all hell breaks lose 

Posted on: 04 June 2015 by tonym
Originally Posted by Tabby cat:

Darke Bear pings a cable and all hell breaks lose 

Lucky he didn't pong it instead!