Wifi on the NDS

I'm sure that if you can afford a 500 system you can afford to get someone in to run the cables. Just do it, and forget about wifi. My SuperUniti wouldn't do internet radio over wifi even with the wireless router in the same room. Wires are what you need.  Wires, I tell you.

Whereas what HH says is quite right, if you have no desire for proper music and excellent SQ, then do the wireless trick.  It sounds OK, actually, a lot of the time.

Thing is, though, wired would give you better SQ and better reliability of continuity of music playback.

Have you thought about doing the ethernet-over-mains thing... although not as good as wired, it is one step up from wireless....  and it's cheap... and it's easy.

(...are you absolutely sure you can't get a wire from your router thingy to your NDS?)

Wired.  Wifi + Music = Problems,

In my experience when streaming CD quality or above, wireless just doesn't seem to cope very well, and delivers clicks, pops, and occasional drop-outs, and regardless of signal strength.  And yet Sonos and alike continue to expand their hold over the wealthy-ish-but-not-audiophile market with wireless offerings, so I assume there must be ways to make it work properly.

If you really must use WiFi, accept that you will lose some sound quality. As an NDS owner, I assume that is a high priority. If you do it, I strongly recommend that you disable the NDS Wifi, and let an external device such as an Airport Express handle it, connected by a short Ethernet cable. I've managed to stream 24/192 files like this to my Superuniti without dropouts. 

If you are streaming from a NAS, put it near the streamer so you can make a wired connection between them via a switch. Again, add an Airport Express to connect to your router, then the Wifi only has to handle streams from the web for iRadio, Spotify, etc.

I run an NDX wirelessly and since I ditched BT's Home Hub 5 for an Asus router it performs flawlessly over Wi-Fi (in the same room). I stream up to 24/96 (I don't have anything higher).

+1 for Airport Express plus ethernet cable, I have exactly the same experience as Chris albeit with the Superuniti in my second system, it will play 24/192 with no problems.

Main system NDS is wired however. As HH says if you can afford an NDS then the cost of wiring is minimal in comparison. Wiring my was not easy (through the wall to outside then into the loft, down an internal garage wall and through the wall to the NDS) and that only cost £100 with top quality cable.

I tried wireless and it didn't run smoothly. Get wired!

Thanks everyone for your comments.

BTW, Sonos use their own comms protocol, it doesn't use WiFi.

Ashrafs,

Like Gary Shaw I have been using wireless for about 15 months now with no problems at all. In fact we occasionally also stream BBC iPlayer concurrently to the TV again usually without incident although the iPlayer can buffer sometimes depending on the Internet connection.

Also like Gary I use a WAP bought for the purpose, in my case a Linksys, but this is located in a bedroom separate to the listening room.

SWMBO will not allow holes to be drilled in the ceiling and trunking run down the walls so Wi-Fi was the only solution. I did once run a 20 Metre cable from the main switch to the ND5 in an effort to persuade her to allow the cabling but to be honest neither of us could detect any real difference in sound quality so the Wi-Fi will remain.

External devices such as cordless phones and microwave ovens can cause interference to Wi-Fi signals. The signal strength will vary depending on distance and obstacles between the WAP and the device so everyone's environment will be different and there is really no way of knowing if Wi-Fi will work for you without trying it for yourself. 

Good Luck,

Peter

If you have decent quality material and a decent signal strength, I don't see a technical reason why WiFi should be any different to wired.

I use an ND5 XS over a wireless connection and have no problems with drop-outs, clicks, pops or whatever when playing streamed music (FLAC and mp3), even when the missus is watching streamed video over WiFi in another room.

There is the occasional buffering pause with iRadio, but that is due to the Internet connection, not the LAN set-up.

The one problem I do have is that the iPhone Naim App loses the connection to the ND5 XS after 20-60mins even though the ND5 XS will still play a stream or iRadio from the front panel.

Note that on some (possibly the better quality ones) WAP, you can scan for nearby signals, check which channel they are using and then set your WAP to use a different channel.

The Cisco WAP4410N I use allows you to do this.

I don't have a technical basis for the following assertion, but I think the other thing at play with making Naim streamers work reliably on wifi is that the wifi implementation is a bit shitty.  At least in the Qutes and Uniti. 

Have never been able to make those work acceptably, but in contrast my mu-so works very reliably on wireless on the same network.  Up to 24 bit / 48k which is Naim's imposed limit for wi-fi.

Agree with the general thurst that wired is the way to go though.  Doesn't feel right to have an RF noise generator inside the streamer.

+1, getting Ethernet fitted was the cheapest and best upgrade I've ever made

If you are using Sonos as well then you could use the Sonos as a bridge.  I did this for a long time and it works very well.  Just plug an ethernet cable into the Sonos and the other end in to your NDS.

This assumes you have a suitable Sonos device close to your NDS.

Richard

I suspect it's true that Naim have done WiFi on the cheap. No amount of tweaking, repositioning or reconfiguring could persuade my Superuniti to work over an otherwise stable WiFi network, but an Airport Express wedged into a spare wall socket behind it works very reliably.  

Ashrafs, I'm not in the slightest bit knowledgable on computers etc but I am very happy with wifi NDS using home plugs. These, I believe, route the signal from the computerised bits (in the upstairs study), through the mains wiring, to the NDS in the living room downstairs. I do not doubt that wired would be better still, probably some may not like homeplugs either, but to get a cable through would be difficult and has been vetoed!

Re quality of sound; before I ran CDS3 with 555 PS, with 300 amp and 252/Supercap DR, and Totem Wind speakers. The only change was NDS for CDS 3, with dbPoweramp and NAS upstairs with our main computer, and iPad to control the NDS downstairs. Without a shred of doubt the sound is even better than the CDS 3 which is saying something. Not one problem accessing ripped CDs, no clicks/dropouts. No problem doing shuffle/playlists via the iPad. Internet radio may buffer occaisonally. I do not do hires downloads yet. So I would not worry about it, the NDS is fantastic and maybe one day the wires can come. 

Not only should you run ethernet wires, your hard drive/server/switch should be right next to your NDS. High quality ethernet cables are also a must... Chord C-Stream is the best place to start.  Sarum Tuned Array provides the best performance.  

You've got a great system... streaming is tweaky just like a turntable.  It's worth it as the result is so much better than wi-fi streaming.  Night and Day.  

Actually C-Stream isn't a Tuned Arry, it's a classic SFTP and meets or exceeds Cat7 in every parameter.

So yes it is a high quality Ethernet cable.

Depending on construction, it's as simple as cutting only two holes, each of which will be covered with an RJ-45 outlet.  Everything else is done inside the walls (at least where the walls are hollow, as in much construction over the past 100 years here in the States).

Hi Wat,

You are right about the other Chord "Ethernet" cables though, the Indigo and Sarum (the "Tuned Aray" cables) are not given any Ethernet Cat rating and use a type of construction that is generally regarded as unsuitable for Ethernet use.

Here's SiS's comment on the Tuned Aray cables (i.e, all Chord "Ethernet" cables except C-Stream)

https://forums.naimaudio.com/to...01#37750163760281501

BTW, Audioquest specifically state that all their Ethernet cables meet the Cat7 specifications, so Chord seem to be out of step with their pricier cables.

Bart,

Thanks for the info. Unfortunately it is not that simple. My house is mostly plaster over brickwork and the IT is at the opposite end to the living room.

The process would involve running the cable under floor boards from one bedroom to the other through a supporting wall. Then guide the cable through a hole in the ceiling into the living room. To run the cable down the wall the choice is either surface trunking or channelling out the plaster to insert trunking and cable then make good and redecorate the room.

I sort of took the opportunity of blaming SWMBO for the WiFi decision but to be honest it works so well that I am glad I tried it and see no reason to change. So for now I think I'll stick with the WiFi.

I do though appreciate the attempt to help.

Pete L.