Statement Streamer?

What bothers me is that Naim remains so silent. Why not disclose what's in the pipeline. Most companies do, see Linn.

Could a memory upgrade be feasible?

Fred

 Sorry Allen _ i guess I was editing my reply at the same time as you were editing yours

Before I bought my Devialet I was concerned because the DAC was built in to the amp and I thought this would limit future upgrades. But in fact I think that one of the reasons that the Devialet sounds so good is because the DAC is tightly integrated with the amp and there are no cables and connectors in between which could degrade the sound. Devialet also provide approximately twice yearly functionality/performance upgrades which include improvements to DSP and I would say that mine sounds better now that it did a year ago. Plus it has another 30W of power, supports DSD, supports multiple phono curves etc. etc

Maybe. Admittedly a rather weak attempt to drag the conversation away from pulling faces and back towards the OP.

Sorry, I know I contributed to taking it off track but I think its vitally important for Naim to consider what other companies do better than them in terms of streaming if they are developing a new up-market product.

If Naim announced Qobuz or Tidal support now then I would most likely stick with a Naim streamer but, to be honest, I've been hoping for this for a year and have now tried other products which do provide that support and now plan to move on.

No not at all. At least not from my POV, which is all I can speak from. But I think a streamer above NDS, if such a thing can be built and sold, will probably have the kitchen sink incorporated, not that all potential customers will be necessarily interested in all the facilities. 

The last published comment I saw from Paul in one of the comics was that a Statement level streamer was in R+D and would be launched if Naim ever manage to produce a streamer which they consider to be a Statement level performer. So it is possible that a Statement level streamer may not see light, but I suspect this is unlikely.

I think the same applies to the NDS. Naim's position was always that such things work best in close proximity and the subsequent U-Turn when they launched the DAC was amusing. I think that the mere act of connecting a streamer to a DAC with a cable introduces variables that need not be there if the streamer/DAC package is implemented intelligently and effectively in one box. The only proviso being that you actually have to like the sound of the unified combo. This applies to anything you will ever buy. If you don’t then you won’t buy it, so no harm, no foul. There was not an awful lot of noise back in the day about the wasteful practices of CDP manufacturers who insisted on incorporating a DAC AND a digital out facility.  It seems that criticising streamers for this perceived sin is currently hip and fashionable.

Perhaps the answer is to develop a streamer architecture that is upgradeable (future-proofed) both in terms of hardware and firmware.  So you use FW updates to make minor functional enhancements (using FPGAs etc) and fix issues but also have a hardware architecture that supports exchangeable components/boards when more major upgrades are required e.g. networking, DAC etc.

The more that can be done with FW the better. I have to say that Naim and some others have been very on the ball about hardware retro mods compared to many manufacturers who would expect you to bin and buy again. But I don't have a crystal ball.

Spotify arrived in time for the Muso release, for which it seems entirely appropriate in terms of both SQ and market penetration. Of course, we'd like something better, and we know it will come when Naim have it sorted, but in the meantime, I'm happy to keep buying dirt cheap CDs. When my Spotify free trial ended I had intended to cancel it, but I find it such a useful music discovery tool that I've kept it. It means I never have to worry about weather I'm wasting my hard earned £2 on a used CD.

Not from my experience but I've not heard the Aurender. I've yet to hear anything that surpasses an Audirvana/Hugo combo but I'm always open to new options. Streamers generally don't appeal to me because of cost, software issues and the need for network storage. 

From my experience Linn don't like to talk about products that are still in development either: Exakt came as a total surprise (at least to me), SPACE optimisation, Tidal integration also.

Really?

Well I was invited for a Linn demo presented by Gilad Tiefenbrun and he was talking about the things that lay ahead very extensively.

Fred

Maybe in a personal talk Gilad T gave away some info (perhaps Paul S would too?), but in general I have not seen Linn publish (written) roadmaps because a.) why should they tell their plans to the competition and b.) they might get into trouble if they can't keep their promises.

However the Linn engineers do post quite frequently in the Linn forum and explain their designs. This is indeed very helpful and would be a nice addition to the Naim forum.

As I have mentioned we are committed to adding internet services to our streamers, when, yes its been an issue, we have supplied spotify, qubuz do not have  connect for ios available outside of dev, things changed at Tidal with their plans of ownership, we have continued to work with both companies and will launch when we are satisfied with what we have. As for changing products because it does not yet have this feature you really do have to ask the first question about sound performance and given that the internet service sound is still miles behind what we are used to as a reference, I do agree its improved but not good enough to show the ultimate performance of the systems.

Allen, you are more than entitled to make your points, even if some of them are just sheer speculation and always with a hint of sour grapes, its our right to release information when we feel its time, we will do this, you seem intent on forgetting just what I have posted. Yes the clock is ticking but you have no idea of the circumstances and to suggest NDA arrangements are bull shit just shows how far away from reality you can be.

We do understand the passion and closeness our customers have with our brand, we have a very long history of understanding  this and always working hard to fulfil expectations, we will always do this.  

Wat, of course we are reviewing our dac strategy but I cannot promise you, what, when and why, you have to make decision based on the facts you have today, if you send me a private email, I can reveal all joking of course. We have to decide our strategy based on resource, technologies available, completion of current projects and kicking off the ones the business feel are in the best interest of the company and of course trying to understand what are customers needs are and wishes-simple, sometimes we get it spot on and sometimes we miss but overall we are in a good place with the decision making.

Hi Paul, Your answer makes of course a lot of sense. As a customer I would hope the ND555 is soon on the agenda with room correction and streaming services connect. ......Just a small ask :-)

Not unreasonable in fact 272 was due to have a room compensation feature which had been in the offer some 4 years ago, when it came to implemention it was just not satisfactory enough, not saying never, just saying it was not good enough to launch for the supposed benefit.

Ok, will have a close look at the Christmas tree ...:-)

Paul that is interesting - I wonder therefore if Naim may be looking at re architecting the underlying processing platform on the current streamers to give more capability  - and perhaps asking the current architecture to do room optimisation is just taking the streamer DSP to perform outside its performance envelope for the performance level required?

PS Rhetorical question not expecting an answer

Simon

Spotify certainly is but what about Qobuz lossless & Deezer Elite? Are these services compromised in some way compared to streaming my HDX rips?

Thanks,

Graeme

Allen,

I respect your view, but I totally disagree. I'm a very pleased customer of Naim, both of the hardware and software. And so are many many customers.

Yes, my system tends to trip now and then so I need to restart my router or app. Yes I miss the volume slider on the front page. But all in all, the Naim app and the UPnP integration is a very convenient and user friendly way of enjoying music.

And I would like to thank Paul Stephenson for his direct communication with us, humble Naim forum members.

Bert is not everyone, including PS, a humble forum member?