Is the 272 a mullet?

Amps DR or non?

Yes, all amps were DR. Also, everything was Powerlined, and the 202 had a NAPSC.

NDS 282 300?

*ducks*

It's not fair IMO throwing a 300 in against a 250. No contest.Completly different amps - as you would hope for the price difference. At the current potential asking price, I wonder if cutting back on the amp spend and rolling in an NDS would be a reasonable audition?

Sorry.

Beat me to it!

Can someone explain the fascination with eighties hairstyles and/or fish?

one of the most interesting threads, keen to hear your comments.

The 272 cannot ever by itself be a mullet. The question is whether a 272/300 is a mullet. It goes against source first ideology which says that the 272/XPS/250 should be better. If listening tests show that it's not, it says to me that the 272 is even better than is generally thought. If the 272/300 is not a mullet, yet the 282/300 is, and I'd say it was, then by deduction the 272 must be better than the 282.

P.s. Systems are called mullets when the (usually) speakers are better than the rest. A lot at the back, not much at the front. Mullet. 

Having said my slightly young in cheek comments above, how various amp combinations fit together maybe outside the mullet arena. I've heard good reports on here about the V1/300 combination, and also that the 272/555PS/300 makes for an wonderful four box effort.

What I particularly like about the 272 is that both source and preamp are maxed out with the addition of one power supply, whereas the maxed out NDX/282 needs three. So five boxes versus two. It's so last century. 

A 272/300 still sounds like a mullet. Systems should be flat, like a halibut. 

I don't know about the 272/300 but I listened for a short time to the 172 / 300 driving a pair of Kudos Titans and it sounded very good indeed.

For me the the similarity between the 250 and 300 really depends on the speakers you are driving and the sound level you are driving. At lowish levels, and small to medium rooms (using a 252)  I find a lot of similarity, after all the electronics in the two amps are very similar indeed, it's the separation and layout that is mostly different.

But use a pair of near / mid field monitors, or large speakers in a large room with good sound treatments, and the qualities of the top class sources really starts to become evident.. there is a 'feel' and cohesiveness that appears that just is absent on lesser sources, although these lesser sources can  sound very good indeed..And of course many of  the lesser sources can do all the hifi stuff as well like timing, bass slam, pace,  detail etc. with the right amps.

I only have room for 3 boxes 

Besides, I don't think I could face the barrage of criticism I'd get for not putting a 252 in there.........

I would have thought any streamer front end comparative testing needs a common denominator,  and whatever power amp is on the end is irrelivatnt provided its the same for each test & into the same speakers.

The one issue as I see it is the 272 has an integeral pre-amp & that is one aspect of the common denominator of a front end comparason that makes it impossible.

The best that can be done is to believe Naim & their estimate that 272 pre-amp is around the 282 level.  Therefore if comparing 272 with NDX, the NDX needs to be paired with a 282.  

The thing to avoid getting into the discussions about the 282 not being a good partner for power amp X vs Y  & 252 is its natural partner,  that is loosing the point -  as will be adding (or not) a XPS - its just over complicating the objective  272 vs NDX/282

My guestimate is the NDX/282 will be the best SQ,  the problem is the SQ per £-$-€ 

Good point, Harry, I haven't totally ruled out the idea of an NDS. I only have space for 3 boxes, though, so it would have to be with a Supernait. Last year I opened a 'what's the best possible sound you can get out of 3 boxes' thread, and Richard Dane's answer was NDS/555/Supernait. (I wonder if he'd give the same answer now that the 272 exists?) It would be stretching my budget a bit, but I haven't ruled it out yet. 

dunno about sound per pound.

compare cost of 282 with HCDR and 272 with XPS DR.

then 282/SCDR and 272/555DR

of course 282 needs a source, but nowadays 

I have no idea how a manufacturer 'voices' a speaker to match an amp, but you may well be right. Naim 'suggest' the partner for the 272 is the 250 - maybe that's already a bit of a mullet, and the true flatfish is a 272/200????? 

It's an expression which goes back to the 80s. It refers to the hair style and references in particular something having relatively little at the front compared to lots behind it. It's a source first thing.

This forum would be a dull plaice if we all agreed with each other all the time. I was expecting to come away from my dem with a 272 based system as winner, but my ears told me otherwise. Certainly more listening to be done before I reach a decision. 

You'd have to hear them for yourself. The NDS is a superb source and therefore has a potential to shine through when partnered with anything except shit. And Naim don't do shit, so it could be interesting, if only to rule it out.

I know it's different for all of us. I still subscribe to source firs although I try to keep an openn mind. At different stages of our system's life long development, some extreme source first systems have cycled with a collection of "balanced" systems and mullets. It's only in the last two years that it's leveled off and if anything significant changes in the future it will it is extremely likely to be the source. If different circumstances arose and the box count needed to go, I think I'd be looking at something French. But who knows what a Naim dealer could offer by then?

It's fun.

Photo: Action Images

Chris

EEK!

Yes, my thread title is poorly worded, it takes more than one box to make a mullet....but you get my drift?

My limit really is 3 boxes, so 21st century if you like, but I'm not yet ready to rule out some 20th century boxes either, if my ears tell me they sound best.

Just to put this in context, all of the options I heard sounded good, and if the only thing I'd listened to was a 272/250, I could very happily have chosen it. But there are just so many fish in the sea these days!

I would almost always choose NDX/Supernait over 272/250. The only situation where that is not the case is when the speakers are more difficult to drive.

Given your speakers, I'm surprised you didn't try NDX/XPS/Supernait against 272/XPS/250. That would have settled the matter. I suspect, though I haven't tried it, it would also beat the 272/300 combination, at least for musicality. That 'forced' sensation with the 300 (due to the 272's limitations, not the 300's) would wear me down - that's a mullet in my view.

Of course, the NDS/XPS/Supernait would leap up in terms of performance, but so would the price. It's a pity the NDS is so darned expensive because this would be the winner by far in my estimation.

Regards,
Frank.
All opinions are my own and do not reflect the opinion of any organisations I work for, except where this is stated explicitly.

Fascinating thread, ChrisSU.

Re box count: my take on it is that just because some Naim boxes have a power supply upgrade option, doesn't mean we have to take them.

Chris_M

Edit: Have just done some Googling and found out that NDS/ SN2, and N272/ Nap300 are both roughly £10K, with the former at one box less, obvs.