What's the new DAC benefits?

thats right Blackadder, I have created the purest green!

Hilz

I do not, I have no whatsoever idea what the Blackadder series was about!

Back to the original post: AussieSteve believes Naim are about to release a new DAC. What's the problem? He might be wrong or perhaps right, have bad or good reasons to believe Naim will soon release a new DAC or have no reason at all. But that does not really matter, does it? That's his belief.

Under that premise, and given that he is considering upgrading, the questions raised seem on spot to me. A new Naim DAC could add interesting alternatives to options like NDX/DAC, NDX/XPS/DAC and NDS/555, depending, among others, on the answers to such questions. 

Naim strictly follow the policy of not providing whatsoever roadmap or forward information about their products. They presumably believe this is a good corporate policy. As in the case of the OP, they might be right or wrong (I do believe they are wrong) but it does not really matter, that's their belief.

And because of this (quite silly, I believe) belief, questions like the ones raised by the OP have can only be discussed under speculative assumptions. I do not mind such discussions: if anyone has to be blamed for the uncertainty, this is Naim.

Apropos uncertainty, wasn't the Chord DAVE due to appear in September? Or was it to be released later?

Congratulations, enjoy!

Thank you, I have been! One thing worth saying .. I think it is very much better than a Hugo .. smoother, much more solid, incredibly dynamic yet never stressed, incredible tonal accuracy and stereo imaging,   .. very very good indeed. Highly recommend folk try one for themselves.

I think the Hugo is poorly designed, atrociously built and sounds thin and whiney, with occasional sputtering noises. That's when it doesn't break down. Honestly, it's barely driveable. 

Oh no. My Hugo sounds broken now.

Interestingly an earlier adopter of the TT reported very marginal difference to Hugo so I'll be interested to compare the two myself.

G

I would very much hope the differences to be marginal, every other outcome would be quite surprising given the specification! Best, nbpf

Absolutely not marginal IMO. And I haven't bought one. I only have it on trial, so I'm not trying to justify a purchase - the change would be  a lot of money for me, so there needs to be a substantial difference to justify me making the move.  But there is, so I think I am doomed!  Please don't think I'm suggesting your (or my) Hugo is broken; it's just that the TT has a lot more Hugo-ness. Tremendous muscle and finesse at the same time. I'm using the balanced outputs into active ATCs, which might be relevant though. And driving it from USB. Just get yourself a listen! (If you want a negative, the remote is definitely poorly designed. Pity.)

Interesting, thanks.

G

Please could you let us know what Naim systems you are using with your TT ?

Thx

S

I have had a melco feeding a tt set up on my system for the last week, my system is 252- 300 into neat momentum 5 sx i ( usually fed by NDX XPS DR FROM SERVE) we have set this up to trial to test 

1 the TT 

2 the melco 

3 not being attached to a general use network.

so far the results have been amazing,

the quality of the music is astounding especially feeding dsd files.

the depth of silence between notes is staggering detail is superb.listening to sonny boy Williamson live is intriguing, almost to distraction, I keep wanting to tell the live audience to keep their feet still and stop         

Talking. 

Switching back to NDX based replay, whilst it is good, it's rather thin, not so absorbing.

tomorrow we put the Sarum power leads back on the amps.

all cables up to now have been the cheapest lowest grade possible.

TT is connected with a naim lavender, power cables are stock supplied, melco connected with a throw away cable, slowly we will introduce better cables this week.

so far it has ben better then anything else I have heard streaming.

Will update as the system grows

hilz

No naim, alas, not since a NAC12/NAP160 many moons ago. My TT goes straight into a pair of ATC SCM25As, and is fed either by a nice little Acer fanless laptop, or a squeezebox Touch.

I listened to a TT recenty and was disappointed, I was expecting more than I get from the Hugo... Certainly my Hugo wasn't going anywhere after listening to the TT. One thought, I wouldn't  want a sound any more smooth than the already incredibly smooth sounding Hugo... I think that would be a retrograde step... You perhaps can have too much of a good thing... But to be fair the TT didn't strike me as being any smoother than the Hugo.. so no weakness there.

Now I have yet to listen to DAVE .. But I am not sure I will, I am not prepared to pay that sort of money on a DAC, although I am sure it's mighty fine.

Simon

Again, interesting observation, thanks.

G

That's an interesting comment for me.  To explain, when I added a DAC-V1 into my Cyrus setup, I was both blown away, but also left wanting musically. I did hear a massive leap in terms of detail, control, but a lack of energy.  It was like someone had said to the band 'Take it easy tonight, we don't want to disturb the neighbors'.  I concluded it was a mis-match between amplifier and source, so I bought an SN2 to cure this problem, and it certainly has 

Reading the many many posts regarding the Hugo, has lead me to lose interest in it, perhaps wrongly.  The reason being, in my interpretation, it seems to introduce this easy going lightness lightness of touch thing, timbres, textures, detail etc, and I don't value those things vs overall musicality.  I know, of course, that listening is the only true test, but consistently the way it has been described, reminds me of what I spent £3k to get rid of.  

I'd appreciate it if you could explain how one sets up the melco and where the music files reside etc. 

Thanks

SJB

My setup now has a Chord 2Qute in place of a Naim DAC, using this source-to-speaker layout:

Exposure 2010 CD player-> Chord Signature coaxial Bnc/Bnc -> 2Qute -> Chord Cobra Rca/Rca -> Naim Nait XS -> NACA5 -> Neat Motive 2

The Hugo TT was also considered however I couldn’t justify the cost on all the features as I never use any headphones for music or balanced XLR outputs. Also there is an inkling that to get the very best out of the Hugo TT it would require a step up in amplification and speaker type.  My one concern on the 2Qute is that wobbly input selector button which feels like it might snap out within a year.

Anyway this will come as no surprise since every man, woman and his/her dog already has a Chord Hugo, but the leap in performance even with a 2Qute is quite substantial and this is only based on CD standard playback. In a basic explanation, it feels like whereas the Naim DAC was brushing over information for the sake of quick music delivery, the 2Qute is representing the musical recording closer to its entirety. However the 2Qute is not being laid-back or polite.  There is a momentary feeling that 2Qute is not so bombastic, fast and is a tad restrained compared to Naim DAC. But it is a case of maybe yes maybe no, with some tracks and not with others so once the music does start to flow from 2Qute any such thoughts are quickly forgotten. With ultra-fast R.P.M (Rock, Punk & Metal) the 2Qute can still kick out the jams, and there is only a feeling that it’s just on the upper limit, slightly before it becomes too refined and genteel. So another nice all-rounder too for every man, woman and his/ her dog.  But nowadays even Naim is not brutal enough for exclusively ultra-fast R.P.M. To go total brutal it needs to be like the original John Farlowe era of Exposure electronics pre/power amplification, when I heard this with probably Jamo or some kind of monster speakers, it was the most brutal hi-fi in the entire solar system and perfect for rock 'n' roll.

 Even for a poor quality internet radio source into the optical TOSlink the differences and qualities of the 2Qute are instantly obvious. All vocals are more emphasised, even the Homebase advertisement about “3 for 2 on Dulux colour emulsions” has more depth and clarity. There are examples of music which you may have listened to since the day that you were born, and are now being heard in a more complete representation of what was recorded.  There are more vocals of all kinds “yeaaahhh” “oooohhh” or “huugghhh” from lead vocalist or other band members on microphone which were previously never heard. There are all of manner of wood/percussion/wind/string instruments (maracas, cabasas, cowbells, agogo, those wood hand-clappers, snares, cymbals, horns, trumpets) also electronic synthesisers all being more clearly presented by 2Qute. So generally a more textured and full bodied sound.

There were some comments about a harshness with the 2Qute.  This was heard but for my setup only in the first 4-6 hours of powering up the device. Then for every 12 to 24 hours after initial powering up the sound settled and it was really in the 48th hour that the revelation came.  The Naim DAC is somewhat ‘lossy’ and flat sounding and it doesn’t provide that meticulous musical delivery which the 2Qute does.  I’ve only had 1-2 hours of MacBook > USB cable > 2Qute using the usb cable that came in the pack so some more listening is required. But it is outperforming the Naim DAC which was previously used with WireWorld Supernova 6 optical TOSlink.

There is an awkward situation now where the Nait XS has the Naim DAC as the old wife and the 2Qute as the young mistress.  For there to be any reconciliation the Naim DAC upgrade would have to be very significant but at this moment it sounds like the 2Qute will hook up permanently to the Nait XS and the Naim DAC will move in with a Panasonic blu ray player.

So we are in the new era of the ‘Choim sound’: Chord + Naim and the 2Qute and Nait XS have a nice synergy that just works.  The 2Qute is compact enough to leave most of a plinth vacated for some other component. At least one person has mentioned the MCRU Linear Power Supply for Chord 2Qute DAC. Is it really worth using this kind of power supply upgrade and what/ by how much may you gain as improved sound quality?

Hi SJB,

The Melco is the HDD model N1A WITH 4 TB of built in storage.

we set it up off line from our home network,

connecting the two lan sockets with a simple TP link portable router about the size of a matchbox.

this was only to enable us to use an app on a phone to select music stored o board.

the Melco was connected to the TT via a USB cable.

all music was loaded from a computer, whether it was DSD down load or CD ripped using dbPoweramp.

Alan Ainslie helped set it up, he had a hand in its design and believes the networks as most of us use are very detrimental to the quality of our music play back.(most of our play back processor power being used to sort jitter and buffering) 

we thought we would try it out and the results have been extremely good so far.

regards Hilz

Hi SongStream, although one is moving into subjectivity here - I do find the Hugo very enjoyable to listen to music with Naim amps.. I wont try and use words to describe it.. I start to sound like a second rate hifi journalist - but it does make my recordings come alive and usually enthralls me - it really is a joy to listen to... and there is no strain or tiring - just foot tapping and appreciation.

Simon

Thanks for that, sounds a very interesting set-up.

Keep us informed as the days progress.

SJB