new system new to Naim

I only had the streamer for one night so didn't want to start a free trial with tidal 

yes hopefully I can get this lot sounding nice but having just spent £££ on nac and nap and now getting the speaker cable I'm broke lol ..... Not quite 

The NAC A5 Naim speaker cable is a good start, I would fit and forget It.  Don't expect miracles from it, I wouldn't expect it will solve the problems you describe, but it puts you on the right road when you are using Naim equipment, so you can concentrate on getting the box combination and set up right for you.

Take your dealers advice if you want to go the streaming route, but you will need to do some ground work.  Make sure you rip to WAV and use DB power amp or similar to tag your files at the same time you rip.  Don't compress the music files in any way.  

Some here rip to FLAC and use the server to "transcode to WAV on the fly".  This basically allows you to easily rip and store smaller size files which automatically contain all the tagging you're most likely to need, but then when the information is sent to be played it automatically converts it to WAV as it plays.  Whatever way you choose bear in mind that Naim equipment is optimised for WAV, so try to make sure what it is playing is WAV, transcoded or not.

Whilst some report hearing no difference between real WAV and transcoded WAV, as you move up to more sensitive (read more expensive!) equipment, the differences appear to be more noticeable....the preference generally for original WAV.  This has certainly been my experience in any case.  There's plenty to read on the forum here about this, but most importantly you must try things for yourself.

Utilise your dealer as much as possible.  Try stuff at home and if it doesn't do what you expect, they are there to advise and help.  Setup plays a huge part when you are starting at 202/200 level, don't just plonk and play several thousand pounds worth of equipment....it needs a little TLC if you want to hear it at its best. Again, read up, listen to your dealer and try for yourself to make sure you get the best out of your "New toys".  Try the search facility on the forum here for tips on set up.

Most importantly, enjoy the ride.........and the music!

Not trying to spend your money, especially if you're brassic. When, and if, the time comes, Napsc first is all I'm saying. Otherwise bare 202/200 is still very fine.

 Oh, and it's supposed to be a pleasure!

C.

Thanks guys for the advice I will rip to WAV only, my dealer is making me a lead up so I can use the unity gain function with my Pioneer receiver, 

i will have to get a streamer or a DAC don't know yet more research needed I think

In my experience the quality of source material is key, even within CD quality music I find huge differences.

For example listening to a Sonic Youth CD from the 90s is just lame whereas current productions like Goat:Commune sparkle and shine with the instruments detached from the speakers

Time for a turntable and phono stage now!

Jason, I have conducted some network trace tests using Asset and I did confirm in these tests that there was no difference in the network data between original WAV file and transcoded to WAV file in the data transfer from the media server to streamer. This would be the same result I would expect from looking at the data from the same CD title bought from Amazon and Tesco. So  if you are hearing differences you may be hearing noise or other perturbations from your NAS or indeed your tramscoder is adding distortion by being broken. In my experience if you decouple the NAS from UPnP media server you are isolating these functions and minimising or eliminating cross talk, noise contamination or some other network dynamic between the two. My tests were taken with a decoupled media server from NAS. On sensitive audio equipment I recommend this.

Simon

Hang on, your dealer, who you've just bought a 202 and £300+ worth of cable from, says you have to buy an ND5XS before you can try it out properly (i.e. for more than a night with Spotify only)?

I assume he means buy, and return within a certain time period for a refund if not happy with it?

If not, and he means buy full stop, I'd be wondering if there's another more accommodating dealer anywhere nearby.  Many dealers will offer, and indeed recommend, proper home demos when spending the amount an ND5XS costs.

The dealer has been really accommodating actually it was his main demo unit and he knows I won't be buying brand new but I wanted to see what it was like before I bought elsewhere sec hand. The cables he is sorting me out a cracking price so I've no complaints with him

Ah, lending you demo gear that he knows you'll only buy second hand if you like it is a different bucket of fish.  Sorry, I misunderstood and thought you were buying new.  In that case, good on him.

Can't argue with that, very accomodating under the circumstances.  I only ever borrow demo gear if I'm going to buy from the dealer if I like it.  To be fair a good dealer knows that if they help you along, even if you don't buy from them, you will be back next time you do buy new.

Depending on where your budget is at...if you want to move forward, ask the dealer if he has a Rega DAC laying around.  They are the best bang for the buck I've found...real sparkly music.  < 500 USD used.

The Rega DAC has allowed me to "punt" until I can figure out what I want from streaming...without losing an arm and a leg.  Now I *know* my next DAC will be an nDAC, but I didn't know this 11 months ago.  I'm still happy with the Rega DAC and won't be replacing it because I don't like it...it just doesn't have 4 TOSLINK inputs, and I'm wanting to use the same remote control for all my Naim gear.

That said I mostly only listen to vinyl now...a great bargain it is if you get an RCM and buy used...and I like the sound better--so does my wife.

I'd recommend Naim speakers too, I love them and have NAIT XS and NACA5.

What interconnect are you using between the 202 and 200?

Also, a rack...do you have a rack?

P.S.  Keep borrowing and swapping out gear until you can listen for a week and be very happy.  It takes a week IMO to really understand what your system is putting out.

Using the standard Naim interconnector and the rack is a BDI home theatre unit the Naim gear is sitting on individual shelves 

Speakers are MA RS8 and I think if I can rip to WAV and fit new speaker cable I should hear a difference 

Yep, I use dbPoweramp to rip UNCOMPRESSED...not lossless...just full WAV.  Space is no longer an issue these days.

On Spotify did you set this to HQ streaming, or was this free account?  If you subscribe to premium you have to go into settings and turn on HQ...its like night and day.

Got Spotify premium so get audio is full high quality 320kps .....lol

Just checking, stuff like that happens often on the forums, where someone forget to flip a switch or has something backwards.

Just like anything else there is good sounding music on Spotify, and very bad sounding music on Spotify.

Since I moved to a real system with Naim components, I listen to different music because I didn't know how bad a lot of the stuff was I was listening to before.  I also didn't know how good some stuff could sound!

@Sneaky SNAIC

Not just Naim but when going to real hifi in general, listening habits change. Stuff you like, you might start to hate and stuff you hated you might start to like.

There is an excellent article from Esquire about audiophiles and their relationship to music.

http://www.esquire.co.uk/cultu...-something-were-not/

However, I think it gets it slightly wrong. It jokes about audiophiles having revealing equipment so that they can no longer listen to music they like and have to listen to stuff they don't because the gear is unforgiving of bad mastering. That is only part of it. It makes sense of the music in a way that you sometimes realise unfortunately there isn't more emotion hiding under the surface on some stuff whereas other pieces are loaded with extra insight leading to not a change in listening habit but a fundamental change in taste.

Funny stuff in there:

“It’s the audiophile’s biggest fear, isn’t it?” grins James, the immensely affable founder of HiFi Wigwam, an online forum that begat the show. “They die and then their wives sell their hi-fi equipment for what they told them it cost.”

Yeah. I don't know what's more depressing. The prospect of wives selling our gear for what we told them it cost (mine knows the cost); or the assumption that our wives would just sell everything as soon as we are gone - or even worse, that they are just waiting for us to be gone so they can sell it.

Until I read that, none of those ever occurred to me. But now...

Hi Simon,

That's interesting, I guess the possible issues you raise were affecting what I was hearing.  When you talk about decoupling the NAS from the upnp server, do you mean taking the information from the NAS but using a server on a separate machine, for example a unitiserve?

Unfortunately, my HDX had to go in order to part fund the NDS, so my NAS stores, serves and had to transcode as well when I did the tests.

Thanks, Jason.

Or instead you could get a Mac mini, running Audirvana, and a Hugo, and a USB/spdif convertor/isolator (some use the Uptone, I find the Gustard U12 very good, both inexpensive) and run the Hugo direct into the Nap200. Without buying a preamp that would get you up and running with streaming digital at a cost less than an ND5, networked server and preamp.

if you like it (and there's much opinion on here that suggests the MM/Hugo is better than Naim streamer) then great! whether Hugo into Nap 200 works well I don't know - it does into my power amp, but its not the same - but once you're up and playing music, you could get a demo of a preamp and insert it between and decide if it improves (or if you need it for any other reason)

You would still ill have the option, if you wanted to try, to add Naim streamer (through Hugo) and turn the MM into a network server using free uPNP software such as Serviio, again with the potential to do that with a home demo unit.

Hi thought I'd update you guys since I've got the Naim stuff hooked up to my reciever, this is via a rca and din lead - I've set the Pioneers EQ up again and I'm pleased with how it sounds with movies and tv viewing also I've been streaming Spotify via AirPlay and with certain tracks ie dire straits, Lindsey Buckingham and sounds really good it all depends on the quality of the song. I'm looking at getting a nas  then will probably get a streamer.

One thing I'd also like to say is I also connected my Pioneer LX55 blue ray player up to the rca connectors direct to the nac202 and I kid you not playing "private investigations" the Naim really does sparkle well pleased.