Expensive Christmas...

Darke Bear posted:

Try plugging the Melco into the HiFi Mains, rather than into a different circuit and see if the HF blur goes away. I find that different mains circuits can end-up subtending a large RF loop and it gets into the system and can cause what you describe.

I may be wrong - but easy to try.

DB.

Actually it's not so easy to try!  I have two unswitched wall sockets connected to the dedicated spur.  The S1 pre is connected to one, the other connects to an 8 way mains block.  With the addition of the second 555PS all 8 sockets have Powerlines connected to them.  I could try temporarily disconnecting the NDAC I guess.

However, having taken the time and money to reduce noise into the electronics via a dedicated spur I'm also a little reluctant to connect up something with a switched mode power supply, potentially losing some of that gain.  I'll have a play...

Also, being pedantic I wouldn't say the HF is blurred, it's more like it's over damped.  If you've heard an over damped room you'll have some idea of what I'm hearing.

ken c posted:

very impressive "tower of power" Graham...

enjoy

ken

I'm wondering if I need to install a flashing light on the top to warn off low flying aircraft...

Darke Bear posted:

Try plugging the Melco into the HiFi Mains, rather than into a different circuit and see if the HF blur goes away. I find that different mains circuits can end-up subtending a large RF loop and it gets into the system and can cause what you describe.

I may be wrong - but easy to try.

DB.

Mike-B posted:

Darke Bear posted:

Try plugging the Melco into the HiFi Mains, rather than into a different circuit and see if the HF blur goes away. I find that different mains circuits can end-up subtending a large RF loop and it gets into the system and can cause what you describe.

I may be wrong - but easy to try.

DB.

Might be worth trying an unscreened (UTP) Cat-5e or 6 into the Melco.  

The STA & the "cheap" Melco are both Cat-7 (S/FTP) & the screen might be carrying a voltage potential (& noise) between the separate mains circuits.  

Alternative is to fit a Female/Male UTP adaptor at the Melco

Certainly worth considering Mike, that's a second thing to add to the "to do" list tomorrow then!

Well a gold star and 10 Brownie points to DB!  Early this morning I switched over the power into the unused 555PS with that of the Melco.  So the 555PS is still warming up nicely but connected to the standard house ring main (but not powering the hifi) while the Melco is on the dedicated spur.  Although both were only off for a couple of minutes I then left the system for several hours.

Upon returning to listen the dampening on the HF seems to have disappeared, the relaxed, open, airiness has reappeared!

Back to listening once more...

Try my suggestion of an unscreened (UTP) Cat-5e or 6 into the Melco,   the Melco on a different mains supply with a Cat-7 (STP) carrying an earth potential & noise between NAS & ND could the real issue. Having it all on the same (common) power supply is one way, a section of UTP cable (or a UTP isolator) is another

Mike-B posted:

Try my suggestion of an unscreened (UTP) Cat-5e or 6 into the Melco,   the Melco on a different mains supply with a Cat-7 (STP) carrying an earth potential & noise between NAS & ND could the real issue. Having it all on the same (common) power supply is one way, a section of UTP cable (or a UTP isolator) is another

That's next of my list, Mike.

So I switched back to the original power arrangements and compared the Chord STA Ethernet cable against a far far cheaper cat 6 cable.  They both sounded the same (so I guess I won't be buying a Chord STA Ethernet cable then!) and both sounded a bit flat, like they had lost their sparkle.

I don't have an explanation for my results, but nevertheless, they're my results.  So it seems that best approach, SMPS or not, is to put it onto the dedicated spur.

I've read a fair number of horror stories on here regarding SMPS and how many generate a lot of electrical noise, however is it fair to assume that a well designed one (for instance the one in the Melco) should be able to avoid such problems?  How widespread is their usage in high end hifi equipment?  I know that my Statement preamp has one, to power it during standby.

SMPS is becoming ever more common,  Linn for example is all SMPS these days,  then all TV's & almost anything else in the home that needs low voltage DC. 

From what I've read it seems they can be designed with very good low noise performance when designed to operate with specific loads & conditions,  they are more limited to those specifics than is a linear supply.   It seems they have a bad reputation gained in part from the cheap, no/low quality items such as wall warts & PC PSU's,  but the average domestic users are probably unaware of all this & its only ham radio & hifi peeps that are aware.   I also read there are now international standards w.r.t. SMPS noise emission;  I'm not sure how rigorous the standards are applied or verified at point of manufacture or if that is done in the home marketplace(s).

What price fancy ethernet cables now ???  

Well, one would hope that given it's meant to be an audiophile grade component that a lot of thought would have gone into PSU construction.  Likely the ex-Naim experience at Melco would help that.

Yes, bit shocking that a stock 3m cat 6 cable (likely cost £20-30) appeared to perform no worse than a 2m STA which is probably over £2K...

Graham Clarke posted:

Well a gold star and 10 Brownie points to DB!  Early this morning I switched over the power into the unused 555PS with that of the Melco.  So the 555PS is still warming up nicely but connected to the standard house ring main (but not powering the hifi) while the Melco is on the dedicated spur.  Although both were only off for a couple of minutes I then left the system for several hours.

Upon returning to listen the dampening on the HF seems to have disappeared, the relaxed, open, airiness has reappeared!

Never presume anything with HiFi - experiment always reveals what actually works in practice. I find that anything that has any kind of earth connection with the HIFi needs not to go off on yards of its own power circuit before seeing the power circuit the HiFi is sitting on. This is about looking at the system from the perspective of RF and reducing all loops - the mains can be the largest one.

Anyway - now you can report on the Melco in your humble system.

Also, when you try the second 555PS remember that mains connection does matter and I suggest you plug it in near the existing 555PS socket without other equipment plugged-in between the two 555PS - if that makes senses!

DB.

Goddamit, i wish i didn't but i do....like this ruddy Melco. 

For me, it "cleans" the music prior to "hitting" the NDS. 

Now just trying to justify this to me and Santa!!!!

If it works for you then it works. You'll be a long time dead (same as the rest of us) so give Santa a kick and tell him to get a move on.

Dustysox posted:

Goddamit, i wish i didn't but i do....like this ruddy Melco. 

For me, it "cleans" the music prior to "hitting" the NDS. 

Now just trying to justify this to me and Santa!!!!

Justifications:

- hell it doesn't look like a nas

- I always wanted a black box I can afford

- otherwise somebody else would be forced to buy mine, I take social responsibility

- somebody senior in the hifi business needs to "test" it before it can be sold to less senior people...

Let me know if you need more excuses ....

Harry/Bert,

Trouble is the wife likes it to....dam!!!!!

Bert Schurink posted:

I now brought a Naim Fraim, after I bought the Melco earlier this month. So a very expensive Christmas. But honestly I also can't wait until everything comes together and I will have reached the end of the journey. And of course I still could contemplate about a second 555PS and dream about the NAP500 DR upgrade. But for now I feel I have reached the right level.

I will update all of you on the experiences when the Fraim is installed.

Don't worry Bert, the feeling will pass and you'll be your old self once again.

Got my Melco today, will be fun to get it going over x-mas! 

//Jonas

Be good to hear your thoughts as you use it Jonas, even out the box.

Looking to demo early 2016.

Dustysox posted:

Trouble is the wife likes it to....dam!!!!!

No alternative then - money well-spent!

DB.

Dustysox posted:

Goddamit, i wish i didn't but i do....like this ruddy Melco. 

For me, it "cleans" the music prior to "hitting" the NDS. 

Now just trying to justify this to me and Santa!!!!

You justified it in the first sentence, if you like it and you can afford it, then buy it and enjoy. You only live once - or yolo as my twelve year old would say 

Dustysox posted:

Harry/Bert,

Trouble is the wife likes it to....dam!!!!!

Mostly that's the problem convincing the wife, so you only need to convince yourself, and I think you already did.

rjstaines posted:

Bert Schurink posted:

I now brought a Naim Fraim, after I bought the Melco earlier this month. So a very expensive Christmas. But honestly I also can't wait until everything comes together and I will have reached the end of the journey. And of course I still could contemplate about a second 555PS and dream about the NAP500 DR upgrade. But for now I feel I have reached the right level.

I will update all of you on the experiences when the Fraim is installed.

Don't worry Bert, the feeling will pass and you'll be your old self once again.

I fear you might be right. But available funds also is a determine factor for upgrade sickness. I will now first have to safe again money after some heavy upgrading in the last two years.

i can from a CDX-2, XPS-2, NDAC, 252, 200 with Naca5 to get at this level. It has been a great journey, but it's enough now....

Dustysox posted:

Harry/Bert,

Trouble is the wife likes it to....dam!!!!!

I hate it when Helen does that. I feel compelled to proceed.

My sympathies.

I'm having a "Vicar of Dibley moment as far as the Melco is concerned.....no no no no....yes!

Come on Santa, ,make my day. 

Gents it really is that good. Jonas how is it working out for you?

Dusty how good and in what way if you don't me asking? Cleaner delivery, noise reduced, digital clean up, what in your view is the difference, if explainable as such, or is it just a much more pleasant overall presentation to your ears?