Where to start?

Hi SEAMAN.

You have it all covered within your synopsis of possibilities , I would imagine the XP5 would give most of what your looking for first..

just make sure your dealer does not introduce you to SN2 or 172 and 155/200.

If the bigger speakers work in your room - then happy hopping.

The whole system looks very well balanced to me. If you want oomph, and I know exactly what you mean, you want an amp with more drive. Ignoring your request to stay with the XS series, I'd suggest either an NDX and Supernait 2, or a 272 and 250 DR. It's a big jump, but either will deliver the results. Anything less is just tinkering. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

The whole system looks very well balanced to me. If you want oomph, and I know exactly what you mean, you want an amp with more drive. Ignoring your request to stay with the XS series, I'd suggest either an NDX and Supernait 2, or a 272 and 250 DR. It's a big jump, but either will deliver the results. Anything less is just tinkering. 

+1 Either of the systems HH suggests will be a real step up from your current system. In your position, I would hang fire and keep filling your piggybank, then start again with another well balanced system at a higher level. 

While I am sure an SN2 or 272+250DR would wake things up, the things you seek to address appear to be in line with the negatives listed in reviews of your speakers that I've just read.  Balance of all components is important, source is important, but if the end of the chain doesn't deliver, all of that will count for very little.  I would suggest you at least try some other speakers on the end of your current system, before worrying about the electronics around them, given your goal.  Popular choices around here seem to be PMC and ATC at a sensible price point, personally though, I do love my Proac D18s; none of the aforementioned should present a tricky load for the XS2.

Have you tried re-positioning your speakers?

Thanks for your replies! I have considered switching the amp but I feel that I just bought it! So upgrading the amp is in the more far future. But if i dont get what I want by either changing the speakers or PS I have to reconsider of course. In that case you are always in need of a second system ��

I agree with that Songstream, I feel that my speakers can be the "problem" here. They are wonderfull both in the middle and top but dont deliever as much as I want in the bottom. They are also easy to position. But do you get more umph by changing speakers or is it, as some of you points out, the amp that needs to go? Can a PS deliever more power (umph) to the music?

Sticking more power up your speakers is generally the way to get the drive, hence the direction I suggested.  That said, improving the preamp does give more oomph, so adding a flatcap 2x may help. 

I did look up a review of your speakers (Hifi Choice) which said that they lack bass weight and dynamic expression, which chimes with what you are finding. So if you are keen to retain the electronics, a different set of speakers may be a cheaper alternative. There are loads of threads on here to look at, to identify suitable candidates. 

If you limit yourself to the xs series then the power supply might help you forward. But I think you also need to think outside the xs series to get what you want. Normally more weight by the way is in the first place quality of source and pre-amplification.

I decided to visit my dealer today to hear his point of view regarding my wish to get closer to the music-Nirvana 

His first recommendation was to go for another set of speakers and that my current set has its limitations regarding bas and power. He set up Audiovector SR3 Super (the first product in order of four levels)in a listeningroom with the nait xs-2 and nd5xs. If I compare it with my speakers the SR3 has a deeper bas, a more open soundstage and doesnt sound bright or to aggressive when playing on high levels. It also delivers the oumph that I'm after. Leaving me with a stupid grin in my face 

His second recommendation was to change the amp to the classic 202/200. If I didnt want to do that PS could be a alternative. HH I see that you didnt mention this amp? In your experience is it worth the upgrade?

The comming year will be interesting in that I will try different speakers  My dealer also sells Ovator, Neat, System Audio, Audio Physic and Dynaudio. Have anyone tried any of them? When I have narrowed it down a will try them out in my home. Looking forward to this journey!

The 202 /200 is an option, but I was looking at low box count options. If you add the napsc and hicap need to make the 202/200 sound any good that's four boxes. Add a power supply to the streamer and it's six in total. The 202/200DR will be better without a hicap but still needs the napsc. My thinking was about how you could swap your two boxes for two better ones and hence keep things simple.

The SR3 may be a way to go, but it's a lot of speaker to hang off the end of an ND5 and Nait XS, and will ultimately lead to a system of the level I mentioned previously in order to do them justice. A pair of better but cheaper speakers than you have now (eg Neat Motive 2) may be the easiest and cheapest way to go if you don't want to upgrade the electronics. 

If you do want to consider changing amps, I should point out I would support HH's original suggestion.  The Supernait2 is fantastic in my view, but because I moved to it from another brand, and from a price point nearer the entry level Nait 5si, I do not know how large the jump would be from your current amp.  In my case it was a huge leap, and I love it to bits.   I have not yet heard the 272/250DR, and plan to avoid doing so; it would no doubt turn into an expensive day.

I cant see myself ending up with 5-6 boxes so I like the thought about keeping it simple. Perhaps trying the supernait will be an option in the future. It will be a lot of testing next year! 

Seaman - your dealer has some great speakers - ask for a listen of some Neats and Dynas - just to get a flavour.

Seaman, I lived quite happily with a 202/200/Napsc for a couple of years after upgrading from 102/150/FCXS and definitely felt it was worth the money to upgrade at the time. However the next level really is in another league, be it 272/250 or 282/250. I did enjoy the 202/200 but it wasn't that long before I was upgrading again, whereas (250DR upgrade aside) I don't see myself hankering after the next level. Maybe worth waiting and saving to avoid the inevitable losses incurred through the extra upgrade steps. 

Strat: I will do that and try not to have my mind set up for the Audiovectors. I have heard the Neat Motive and thought that was a wonderful little speaker. I think an alternative with Neat is to go a little larger than the one that I listen to. Do you have a particular Dynadio in mind?

Marksnaim what was it that you felt where missing with the 202/200 combo? 

I heard the Dynaudio Focus 260 powered by a Nait at my dealer -- sounded great to me! The combo had good bass authority, even from a modest amplifier. 

I will try them out, Joe! I know my dealer has a pair, exdemo I think. 

After some deep soulsearching and thought I have decided to stay with my xs-equipment for now. My next step is to find a better balance in the system and find me another set of speakers. I have been doing some reading regarding Neats Motive sx1 and from what I have read they might deliever what I slightly miss in my system - a deeper bass and a bit fuller soundstage. Have anyone here any experience of these speakers? I think that they could be a good match for my livingroom which is 20-25 sq ft. Perhaps I can even get a little more umph? Like that word to - umph - it says it all! 

I once tried the original Motive 1 and it was a disaster: there was so much bass it was unbelievable. I'm sure the latest version is better, and your room is bigger than mine, so you may find they are perfect. You should definitely try them at home for a week before committing yourself.

I can be more positive about the PMC twenty.23; I had these before my current speakers and they are terrific - balanced, engaging and with a nice tight bass, and they look nice too. Of course, you may not agree; but I'd say they are one to look at. 

One other option to consider is Naim's Allae - very good speakers and pretty too, though again the bass wasn't quite right when I tried them at home, but I've heard them sounding very good elsewhere. 

Take your time and make sure you make the right decision - you want something that's conclusively better, not just a bit different. 

I think your decision is the correct one; I recently replaced my Nait XS with a Supernait 2, and I have a feeling the source is not really up to it (CD5XS). The system is slightly unbalanced, to my mind - which means more investment, probably a new DAC. In your case, a Flatcap XS will help, but I'm not sure it's going to give you the bass you crave for. As far as speakers are concerned, I concur with HH, the PMC 23 are lovely, with an XS system or better.

Hi, I'd look for speakers that are around 88dB sensitive and a 6 or 8Ohm load. Despite their sensitivity, the nominal 4Ohm load of your Audiovectors may be giving your XS a hard time.

Chris

I would recommend turbo-charging your streamer with an XP5 CS power supply first. Then add FlatCap XS to your Nait.

When an upgrade bug strikes again, think about an nDAC.

If you have a good dealer get him to lend you some different interconnects and speaker cables - for your system I would suggest starting with TelluriumQ: Black DIN-DIN and Black speaker cables.

Another thought: play around with some power cables. From experience they tend to have a fairly easy to hear effect on the system.

I would get the new upgraded ndac. It should bring more to the table. I actually think my ndac is much better than the Ndx, and cost the same as a 5xpd second hand. 

Fred

Thanks for all the suggestions! I totally agree HH the new set of speakers must be a big improvement or else I just stick with the ones I have. I will spend quite some time demoing different speakers at my dealers and perhaps narrow it down to 2-3 set of different speakers to demo in my home.

Chris: the Audiovectors has 8 ohm load and are infact a very easy speaker to drive. 

Adam: interesting thoughts about the PS to the streamer. Many here on the forum witness that it does quite a signifikant impact to the soundstage and overall performance. This should be the next black box for me I think. One thing, of alla the future upgrades I really am looking forward to is to have myself a proper rack to put my little "babies" in