If you could do it all over again .....

I would like to thank my first dealer who sold me a 2nd hand 90/92 in 2000, plus used Spendor speakers, Everything else was new, soup to nuts. Then my P5 TT and told me where a good record store was. Duh, I was down in my bank account and having the greatest time entranced every day and night.

I'll also thank every guy that sold his equipment used on Audiogon as I upgraded. It was an incredible journey learning and listening 92 to 300, 82 to 52.  My 2nd speaker was SHL5, still have them. As I aged I had a better knowledge of music and appreciate my hybrid system. I wish more of my friends would come over and listen, but alas, it's more of a personal experience. It was worth all the money up and down the line.

Hungryhalibut posted:

As George so rightly says, hindsight is indeed a wonderful thing. In 1994 I had an excellent system, with Lp12, Ekos, Troika, CDI, 82, Hicap, 250, Nat 02 and black SBLs. Applying the aforementioned hindsight, I should have kept that system and then moved directly to what I have now, without all the fannying around in between. I got rather too much into upgrading and all the ensuing downgrading, upsizing, downsizing and general confusion has meant I've wasted more cash that the cost of a few nice family cars. The stuff I've had that I didn't need since 1994 includes, (in no particular order) 252, Supercap (both x2), 552, 300, cherry SL2, cherry SBLs, Nait 5i, 122x, 150x, flatcap, nSats, nSub, Spendor A5, Neat Motive 1, 102, 180, Hicap, another 82, another olive 250, Linn Kaber, IBL, SuperUniti, PMC GB1i, PMC twenty.21, Fraim, Isoblue, Hutter, Quadraspire Q4, some awful oak stand from Hifi racks, prefix, Armageddon, Aro, 202, 200, Chord Rumour, Chord Odyssey, NACA5 (a few sets), Tellurium Q Black, some Grado headphones that were never used, NAT05, Nat01, Nat101, another Nat02, a funny and massive mains block thing, a huge Ron Smith aerial that we had to get planning permission for, and probably some other stuff as well. If it was all in one room together I'd get a rival for a second hand Hifi shop. 

Never mind - it's helped to keep the roof over the heads of various Hifi dealers, and I've learned a lot along the way. Hopefully, 22 years later, I've finally leaned my lesson. There's no need for anyone to tell me I was bonkers - I know!! It's been quite cathartic writing out that ridiculous list.....

Admire your honesty HH.

George Fredrik Fiske posted:

Hindsight is a wonderful thing. And without the actual experience of what has been done [in any sphere of life] hindsight would be different in any case.

But with the hindsight I have today, I would have gone straight to where where I am now without the intervening steps. 

Not only would this have cut out owning Naim, but also loudspeakers. 

On the accumulation [and distillation] of my collection of recordings, I would not want to have alterred those choices at all. 

These days my recording collection is worth more than ten times my replay hardware, and yet I still have quality replay though high quality if old fashioned designed headphones. All that is needed plus a bit! 

ATB from George

What happened to your Quad ESLs George? 

I'm thankfull to life to have placed on my path people that have a passion for music early on my journey. I was still a teen when I listened to my first Naim system.

What I would change if I could is the moment I've sent my resignment card to the Columbia Club, LOL!!! I know that sounds funny, but that was the start of a general dissinterest into music that lasted a decade for me (1995-2005). 

If I could go back in 1995, I would have put extra efforts to get a CD3 or CD3.5 and a pair of Epos ES-14 to match with the Nait 2 I had since 1990 (and ditch the Sony 507-esD and Elipson Melodyne 4). Maybe also upgrading to a basic LP12, instead of hanging to the charms of a beautiful Rega Planar 3 that I bought at about the same time as the Nait.  And go more often to Sam the Record Man to buy more music (that would probably helped saving him from going bankrupt!).

Still very happy with what I have for about 5 years now.

Bye.

dayjay posted:

nigelb posted:

ken c posted:

dayjay posted:

.... I was driving myself mad at the time and spending stupid amounts of money chasing nirvana ...

sadly, this also sounds very familiar to me. i have a recor of all my hifi expenditure since year dot and when i added the numbers, i almost fainted!

Does 'audio nirvana' exist? is it worth chasing? will we recognize it when we experience it? 

i fear the answers are Yes/Yes/Yes and this then probably explains all the madness on the journey. i feel i am close though -- whatever that means -- just that the next step is extremely steep... and probably infeasible...

enjoy

ken

Ken, at the risk of diverting a little from the original theme of the thread, I have been asking the same questions about Audio Nirvana and how will you know you have arrived there (so I can stop spending the children's inheritance on black boxes). I wondered if you have any ideas of what the milestones, achieved wants or areas of satisfaction (ooh err missus!) to be reached that will tell you have arrived? Or will you just know without warning?

Maybe this is a stupid question but I would like to get off the merry-go-round eventually but it is still spinning too fast at the moment and flippin' Naim keep coming up with wonderful new developments. It has to STOP, but when?

It's a good question, and when I was young I'm not sure I could have answered it.  Now that I am 50 the answer is simple, when I listen to my music, do I enjoy the artist and album, am I content, or do I listen to the system?  At the moment, even though I know there are many much better systems I enjoy the music, and I am content, and that is why I got into the hobby in the first place.  It's too easy to become a kit collector aiming for the next best thing and to forget that it is all about the music, perhaps you need a few years to learn this.

Umm... how old do you think I am? When I say 'the children's inheritance', my eldest is 27 today! So I have a fews years on you, but maybe my questions are a little juvenile? If I leave it a few more years to learn what you have learned, I may just have lost the best of my hearing and it will be time to hang up my speakers! But thanks for the wise words, I will bear them in mind.

I think the problem (well with me anyway) is that as you go up the Naim ladder you start you get a taste for better and better music reproduction (because that is what it is - 'reproduction', a facsimile of the real thing). The pure enjoyment of getting closer to the real thing is a fix - but a temporary one. So it starts again, the urge to get even closer. As it has been so aptly put - chasing the dragon.

I am demoing at home a 252 (I currently run a 282) and I listened to Chris Jones, Mary Chapin Carpenter, Melody Gardot and Leonard Cohen, among others tonight and I was transfixed by the music-making abilities and artistry of these talented performers. These wonderful musicians were in my listening room right in front of me performing just for me - OK I might be exaggerating a bit! But, to me, that is what it is all about.

Maybe I can stop here, right now with a 252/SupercapDR/NDS/250DR. But I know there is more! When will it end? When will I be clean (of the audio drugs)? When will my bank manager have a restful night's sleep?

Please, please help!!

Massimo Bertola posted:

joe,

is your question would you take the same route or would you (once more) arrive at your present system?

Max

It was a linear question as stated - maybe based on the presumption that folks are relatively content with the gear they now have. Good point though, as upgradeitis topics are pervasive here and several folks have gone back to previous, 'lesser' gear.

In a twist on the original question, I would like to go back in time and hear my old FCXS'd Nait XS with my current room treatments and better racking. OTOH I have no doubt my SN2 is a better match with my speakers. Still miss my HP listening sessions on the former XS system though.

My gear changes have been quite limited as I have strict financial limits for hi-fi and tend to do a lot of homework before acting. No impulse buying, and there's no second system, so I sell off the old stuff immediately with no "gear graveyard" to reconcile. It helps that my wife is far more interested in TV in the evening and trusts me to make sound decisions with regard to the hi-fi. No stamp of approval required.

joerand posted:

I (...) tend to do a lot of homework before acting. No impulse buying, and there's no second system, so I sell off the old stuff immediately with no "gear graveyard" to reconcile. It helps that my wife is far more interested in TV in the evening and trusts me to make sound decisions with regard to the hi-fi. No stamp of approval required.

Joe,

it's the same for me.

I probably asked because while I am not sure that starting all over again, with my current knowledge and experience, I would reach the same point; and yet it's what's happened, because I am now more or less where I was ten years ago.

Anyway, without any desire to compete with HH's intense journey, my journey took me from CDX2-XPS2-HiLine-202-Napsc-HiCap-200-NACA5-SBLs to Oppo DV980H-Benchmark DAC-rega Mira-rega RS7, and that was my lowest point in satisfaction. Then more or less back again. Between those extremes, I bought and sometimes sold and bought the same thing again and again, like my four pairs of N-Sats, and my gear included CD3.5, CD5, CD5i, CD5x, CDX2, CDS3, DVD5, NAC42.5, NAC112, NAC202, AV2, NAP90, NAP140, NAP 150, NAP150x, NAP160, NAP175, NAP200, Nait, Nait5, Nait5i, NaitXS, SuperUniti, Supernait, plus one or two FlatCaps, various SNAPS, various HiCaps, an XP5XS, at least three XPS2 (the current one being upgraded to DR), a number of HiLines and enough NAC A5 to have amp and speakers in different time zones. And N-Sats, Arivas, S-400s and SBLs.

It was fun and frustrating, dispersive and illuminating, and brought me to the conclusion that I was doomed from the beginning, when I saw a 32.5/110/Kan combo in a store back in the late 70s or the very early 80s. I sometimes tend to think of myself as the Richard Burton of Naim, and of Naim as the Liz Taylor of my audio life.

When I strted out with a 82, as a replacement for the Linn 5101 or what the surround receiver was called. I  did not change the power amps, so upgraded to an active system with 3 Linn 5103 or what they were called. When the Arcam p7 was introduced I sold the Linn amps, and this was a huge improvement. I do not really know why I did not go for Naim amps at that time. A few years later I finally change to 3 200s, again a big step up in performance. It would have been much cheaper to go for the 200s 10 years before,, and resulted in better sound.

Claus

I "found" Naim a year ago and in that time I've progressed from a Unitilite to a Uniti2, added a 200, changed the U2 for a 172 then the 200 for a 250.2.  

It might seem a bit of a convoluted path and some would say the end result is unbalanced but a restricted budget has meant everything has been bought 2nd hand, ex-dem or discontinued so choices were made because of the availability, or lack thereof, of particular items.  However, each step has bought a significant increase in sound quality and if funds ever allow the next step will be a 272 with the 250.5.

JOHNELL - If it is any comfort, you haven't followed a bad route (I made some of the same upgrades as you) and you will have saved a pretty penny by going secondhand or ex-dem - very smart as you don't loose anything in SQ (assuming the gear is in good condition and not too old).

Your future plans are also sound IMHO. Just be conscious of the fact that the 272 is a great product but is a little limiting if you want to upgrade further. Having said this if I were to do it all again, I may well have taken this path and kept some money back for the children's inheritance. 

Johnell posted:

........ with the 250.5.

Is that a new one that can be powered by a Hicap? 

Chris Dolan posted:

Johnell posted:

........ with the 250.5.

Is that a new one that can be powered by a Hicap? 

Might be.......

My first record deck was bought from woolworths back in the 70's, upgraded to an Eagle deck, then technics , JVC amp, Rotel speakers....then a had an extremely long sabbatical getting married, raising children and paying the mortgage, which in the 80's turned out to be a painful experience, too much month left at the end of the money....

found naim only about 6 or 7 years ago, as recommended by a very good dealer, started with the entry level boxes, and have subsequently upgraded....

In reflection the journey has been an extremely enjoyable one.....not really any mistakes , maybe nieve at times, don't place touch importance on other peoples opinions, ones own ears are what really counts....took quite a while for me to understand the importance of speaker cables and interconnects, power cables ect, but when the penny drops...you realise what you have been missing.

The emphasis for me from here on in , is enjoy the music ....maybe with a tweak or three along the way......

nigelb posted:

JOHNELL - If it is any comfort, you haven't followed a bad route (I made some of the same upgrades as you) and you will have saved a pretty penny by going secondhand or ex-dem - very smart as you don't loose anything in SQ (assuming the gear is in good condition and not too old).

Your future plans are also sound IMHO. Just be conscious of the fact that the 272 is a great product but is a little limiting if you want to upgrade further. Having said this if I were to do it all again, I may well have taken this path and kept some money back for the children's inheritance. 

I've already heard what a difference the 272 makes with the 250.2 and Kudos C10s so if one comes along at the right price it will be a no-brainer.  If it doesn't ever happen I've still got an immensely enjoyable system that I love listening to, especially now I've signed up to Tidal Premium .      

I should add that none of this would have been possible if it wasn't for the guys at Signals....... 

Massimo Bertola posted:

joerand posted:

 

Joe,

it's the same for me.

I sometimes tend to think of myself as the Richard Burton of Naim, and of Naim as the Liz Taylor of my audio life.

What an excellent analogy, Massimo.  I enjoyed that.

Mike