New Equippment choice

Your proposed source is as good as it gets in the Naim universe and one of the best you can buy anywhere. Highly recommended and I'd definitely go there first (in fact I did). Audition is always essential. I think of the NDS as a kind of spuritual successor to the CDS3 in terms of it's effortless, life like poise and grace, but it's miles ahead of the CDS3 for detail and tonal accuracy.  The only way you are going to fully appreciate just how good and special the NDS/555PS/555PS  is listening to it sing through a 552 - which goes very well with a 300 as it happens. But I'm still source first and subject to audition, that's how I'd go. What you do is up to you. I suppose that realistically you can't lose.

Without a doubt I would get a 552. It is just so much better than the 252 it's unbelievable until you hear it. The NDS is the streaming equivalent of the CDS3, and therefore different rather than better. I used to own a CDS3 with 555PS (it's not a NAP 555 by the way) with 552 and 300 and it was simply wonderful, and I'm sure the DR equivalents will be even better. 

Although the 552 is better - and it should be - in the various systems I have tried its not a massive difference - but a worthwhile one nonetheless. As always listen first - I passed up on my offer of trading in my recent 252DR for a used 552DR. The NDS/555PSDR into a 252DR/300 can sound incredibly good, nuanced and beautiful.

Simon

It's funny how we hear things differently - for me the 552 was the biggest step change I have ever heard. I suspect, Simon, that yours is something of a minority view. The 552 has a joie de vivre that the 252 does not even hint at. 

Simon were you able to compare both side by side in the same system? interesting view that you passed on the 552....

Side by side - but different systems. But have heard and usually enjoyed the 552 on many systems and times - in fact probably more 552s than 252s if I am honest. And once (two years ago) I thought I was listening to a 552 and was surprised to learn it was a 252 - so probably nullifies any expectation bias I thought I made have had. A good 252 and 552 in a good system are both fantastic. I do know the Hugo can sound amazing on the 552.. and not so bad on a 252

Simon

Been there, done that.

The first move was from CDS3 to NDS / 555PS, (together with 252 / 300), and, in my opinion the NDS made the CDS3 sound "closed in", and I've had no regrets about moving it on to a new home.

The replacement NDS sounded just great with the existing 252/300.

Last year, I took the plunge and traded in the 252 / Supercap for a 552 DR.

The result, as many on here predicted, was a seriously "wow" moment.

Since then, the 300 has gone in favour of a 300 DR, and I've completed 2/3rds of the Super Lumina thing.

It's not easy to quantify which single move resulted in the greatest incremental upgrade, and I would suggest that whilst the 552 will greatly improve any existing system, the source first mantra would tend towards the NDS first.

Not sure where you are, but if you have access to a decent dealer, ask them to set up a demo for comparison purposes.

My sequence of change was largely dictated by what kit was available at the right price at the time, though I did realise that the arrival of the 552 was somewhat inevitable...............just to see how good the NDS might sound! 

Hope this is of some help.

Dave.

As you are presenting the choices I first would shoot for the 552. It made a considerable difference to my ears when compared with my 252 before. The NDS can then be regarded as a next step unless you wanted to anyhow go for the route of streaming soon, in which case the NDS might be an interesting next step.

Thank you for your many thoughtful responses! 

My experience with 252 & NDS/NAP555 non-DR left me wanting and wondering when the magic would arrive. It was fine, but for me not more open or musical and perhaps a touch sterile compared to my CDS3/PS555-DR. Later I heard NDS with 2-NAP555-DR in state-of-art system and it was exceptional! No one has mentioned the scope of source improvement from using NAP with 2-NAP555. 

When going from NAC252 to NAC552 is the improvement incremental or qualitative?

Thank you all again.

Incremental and qualititative are not options. I'd call the difference transformative, if that helps - i.e. miles better, in musical terms. 

I personally hear an enormous difference between a 252 and a 552. I will never forget the music that flowed out of my 552, but i have long forgotten the dull times i experienced with the two 252's i owned.  I owned the second in an effort to convince myself that i had a duff copy the first time round. I really should have just trusted my instinct.

CXF04 posted:

Thank you for your many thoughtful responses! 

... When going from NAC252 to NAC552 is the improvement incremental or qualitative?

Thank you all again.

 

In all honesty, I could never describe this as an incremental change.  

My experience mirrors HH's experience on the 2 occasions when I have heard the back-to-back comparison - once with a CD555DR source and once with an NDS/555PSDR source.  It's a clear and unequivocal step up.

The NDS/555PS vs NDS/2x555PS is worth trying for yourself before you commit.  Some swear by the 2 power supply option, others don't.

To complicate (or future proof) matters, you would be wise to try an NDS/555PS vs decent renderer+good dac option to see which you prefer.

So in summary, a 552DR is a wonderful step to take (from my auditions).  The conversion to streaming is more nuanced.

Best regards, FT

Hi CXF04,

Yes, my use of the word "incremental" may have been misleading.

I meant that each step up the ladder to reach the sound I have today was, as HH suggests above, transformative.

I can't say for sure which single step was most transformative, as for that, I would have to have kept hold of the various outgoing pieces of kit, and carried out a swap shop to determine which single box made the biggest difference, and finances precluded that particular course of action.

Suffice to say that if you can set up the necessary comparison demo, things may become clearer.

Trouble is, that one step tends to lead to another, and whether you decide to upgrade the source or the preamp, there will remain the feeling that the remaining upgrade might complete the picture.......the slippery slope beckons.

I can say that having gone down a similar route to the one you are considering, I have now reached the point where I cannot imagine any further upgrades in the future............though never say never!

Dave.

gary yeowell posted:

I personally hear an enormous difference between a 252 and a 552. I will never forget the music that flowed out of my 552, but i have long forgotten the dull times i experienced with the two 252's i owned.  I owned the second in an effort to convince myself that i had a duff copy the first time round. I really should have just trusted my instinct.

Funny you should write that - I had two dull 252s as well.... I remember the time I connected up the 552. The expression that came to mind was that it lets the music flood out - like the Tetley's tea bags that do the same for flavour, in their advertising with the little guy with the flat cap. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

gary yeowell posted:

I personally hear an enormous difference between a 252 and a 552. I will never forget the music that flowed out of my 552, but i have long forgotten the dull times i experienced with the two 252's i owned.  I owned the second in an effort to convince myself that i had a duff copy the first time round. I really should have just trusted my instinct.

Funny you should write that - I had two dull 252s as well.... I remember the time I connected up the 552. The expression that came to mind was that it lets the music flood out - like the Tetley's tea bags that do the same for flavour, in their advertising with the little guy with the flat cap. 

You had two 252s that were a bit dull, two.. No one could even afford 1/3 of a 252.

what does dull even mean ..your comparative two pence worth is not so mindful to those new to reading through this forum, wise flat fish has puffed up to be a poisonous slippery eel !

How about snapping up a CD555 to make your CD's sound even better? The time is right. There are used bargains to be had.

WIGIG. Watch what happens to prices then.

John.

CXF04 posted:

When going from NAC252 to NAC552 is the improvement incremental or qualitative?

 

Incremental doesn't figure into it. There is no comparison. It's a different kind of presentation where musical considerations push any HiFi considerations into the far distance. Qualitative sort of covers it but that's just the beginning. 

552.  

Incremental was the expression used recently by a review in hi-fi choice, comparing nap 250 with nap 250dr, strange phrase considering the forum suggests quite the opposite....I suppose it's all about interpretation 

Again, I'd like to thank everyone who took the time to respond! My interest in acquiring Naim equipment began more than 25-years ago when I first noticed Naim's attention to musical envelope that captured much of the knowledge of live performance.

My question about system upgrading was shadowed by measure of ambivalence about DR. Clearly many performances and instruments now glisten with palpable sound and nuance of real instruments and playing. But some of DR's uncovering is also distracting and in process clouds some of what I first came to Naim for, the capture of the musical story by not revealing every last conceivable utterance. Lots of electronics are gluttony of information and when your done listening your left exhausted and unable to recall what you heard. That is seldom true in live performance and I hope DR is not a portend of future stuffed with auditory overload. In any case I will buy NAC 552, not because I know for sure its right move, but I was amply impressed with many thoughtful and well considered responses. Thank you again!                             

That's right, the NAC 552  must come  first and the change isn't incremental is a complete transformation (I came from 282 supercapped) .

Fabian

552 first. I have always found that getting a better Pre in a good established system you already like does more once the source has reached a certain level of quality, which I think the CDS3 is at. The 552 will give more 'oomph', clarity and musical-connection over the 252.

The Pre is the heart of the system and will allow any source to work well or close it in. This approach only applies once the source reaches the right grade - if you had less than a CDS3 I'd not recommend the 552 first.

As you progress the system - if you do - then you will be pleased that you purchased the 552 as early on as possible in your system's life to get the best from it. In fact I only sold mine on when, using the same logic and a home-trial, I purchased a Statement S1 Pre.

Demo first if you can.

After that, the NDS and SL cables would be my progression-path.

DB.

I agree totally DB. However, Statement 1 pre will have to be for a future life!

552 is astonishing (even after (14 ?)) years, and the NDS combination with 552 and 24 bit sources is quite exceptional. Only problem is trying to moderate spending on 24 bit albums!

I'm finding that on my CD555 with humble red-book 16 bit CDs, mastered in the great days before year 1999 (and before the noise-floor of everything seems to have become subsumed in a murky noise-floor from modern Computer mixing equipment) I'm achieving astonishingly great results. Many of my purchases are between £1 to £5 delivered to my house - it is a great time to amass a collection on the cheap!

But the first gain stage and volume control of the Pre seem to set the bounds of what you can achieve. A demo usually makes that starkly clear - I did home-demo a 252 against a 552 and the former was a solid performer - but the latter was an immediate and obvious 'yes' and confident purchase.

DB.