Nait2 upgrade to Supernait1?
Posted by: Yetizone on 15 February 2016
WTCRP posted:Power has nothing to do with musicality.
I don't doubt that musicality can be found with any level of gear, but power can enhance the experience. For rock listening (amplified music) I find that - all else being equal - additional power brings increased musicality via grip on the bass. Better control of bass guitar and separation of kick drum help define and drive the musicality for me. Entry level Naits are fun in their own regard, but there are reasons folks pay more to move beyond them. Greater musical involvement for one.
Yeti,
I am not completely sure in fact I want to change.
Anyway, in my living room, the SN1 is just a little too bodily sometimes, lacking some 'air'. But I have been struggling with my room acoustics for years. I need fast, clear sounding gear to meet the needs of my analytical and ageing ears... But judging from what I have heard so far, I wouldn't buy another integrated than a SN1. I have owned a Nait, a Nait3, a Nait5, a 5i, two NaitXS, two SN1s, one SuperUniti. I don't know the Nait2. The only Nait I liked more than the others on pure sonic grounds was the lovely Nait5, but it lacks power in a largish living room. As MarkJ said so well, there is no substitute for power.
The SN1 is very good, and if you add a HCDR it becomes all you need. A HCDR adds some refinement to the boldness, some grace to the masculinity: better, to my ears, than a SN2. But, of course, that makes it a two-box, very expensive integrated. Found 2nd hand, this becomes one great solution. That said, I plan to change because, for a series of reasons so silly that I find them silly even related to myself, I now have a credit with a dealer and he has nothing of my interest safe a 202 and a 282...
Best
Max
joerand posted:WTCRP posted:Power has nothing to do with musicality.I don't doubt that musicality can be found with any level of gear, but power can enhance the experience. For rock listening (amplified music) I find that - all else being equal - additional power brings increased musicality via grip on the bass. Better control of bass guitar and separation of kick drum help define and drive the musicality for me. Entry level Naits are fun in their own regard, but there are reasons folks pay more to move beyond them. Greater musical involvement for one.
If bass defines "musicality" for you - awesome! Some folks do. Others like me - not. It's not all about the bass (sorry Meghan Trainor). It's the overall presentation as a whole. One of my good friend always require bass pounding in his chest as a musical requirement. I can't figure that one out. Grip on bass is fantastic with my Nait2 and my 91dB transducers. Honestly what's musical is subjective to different people's ears. Some people older in age have hearing loss and hence need more sparkle from their setup. Some may need a little physical vibration for stimulation. Some need cigars and slippers as a requirement. I've long stopped listening with my eyes that spending more is better - not true at all. It's about system synergy to listening area to music genre. "GAS" is a term in photography about guys with 'gear acquisition syndrome'. Perhaps that may be the symptom in this hobby as well for some people who constantly are on the upgrade path ---> the merry-go-round that never stops.
".....All the gear but no idea.."
WTCRP posted:joerand posted:WTCRP posted:Power has nothing to do with musicality.I don't doubt that musicality can be found with any level of gear, but power can enhance the experience. For rock listening (amplified music) I find that - all else being equal - additional power brings increased musicality via grip on the bass. Better control of bass guitar and separation of kick drum help define and drive the musicality for me. Entry level Naits are fun in their own regard, but there are reasons folks pay more to move beyond them. Greater musical involvement for one.
If bass defines "musicality" for you - awesome! Some folks do. Others like me - not. It's not all about the bass (sorry Meghan Trainor). It's the overall presentation as a whole. One of my good friend always require bass pounding in his chest as a musical requirement. I can't figure that one out. Grip on bass is fantastic with my Nait2 and my 91dB transducers. Honestly what's musical is subjective to different people's ears. Some people older in age have hearing loss and hence need more sparkle from their setup. Some may need a little physical vibration for stimulation. Some need cigars and slippers as a requirement. I've long stopped listening with my eyes that spending more is better - not true at all. It's about system synergy to listening area to music genre. "GAS" is a term in photography about guys with 'gear acquisition syndrome'. Perhaps that may be the symptom in this hobby as well for some people who constantly are on the upgrade path ---> the merry-go-round that never stops.
The point you might be missing is that as amplification increases, bass quality increases while the relative bass quantity likely decreases due to better definition (grip) of the bass. This is what plays into the musicality - a more refined, less colored sound on the bottom end that enhances the overall sound quality. Quite contrary to your suggestion that more amplification merely brings more "thump" - (my word). It's probably something you'll either 'get' if/when you hear it or not, and a part of the reason folks move to better amps and apply PSU's. Important to some, not so much to others. As you say, each listener has their own unique ear to satisfy. Sounds like you've found a good synergy with your Nait2 and efficient speakers, and that's all that matters in the end. Enjoy the music!
joerand posted:WTCRP posted:joerand posted:WTCRP posted:Power has nothing to do with musicality.I don't doubt that musicality can be found with any level of gear, but power can enhance the experience. For rock listening (amplified music) I find that - all else being equal - additional power brings increased musicality via grip on the bass. Better control of bass guitar and separation of kick drum help define and drive the musicality for me. Entry level Naits are fun in their own regard, but there are reasons folks pay more to move beyond them. Greater musical involvement for one.
If bass defines "musicality" for you - awesome! Some folks do. Others like me - not. It's not all about the bass (sorry Meghan Trainor). It's the overall presentation as a whole. One of my good friend always require bass pounding in his chest as a musical requirement. I can't figure that one out. Grip on bass is fantastic with my Nait2 and my 91dB transducers. Honestly what's musical is subjective to different people's ears. Some people older in age have hearing loss and hence need more sparkle from their setup. Some may need a little physical vibration for stimulation. Some need cigars and slippers as a requirement. I've long stopped listening with my eyes that spending more is better - not true at all. It's about system synergy to listening area to music genre. "GAS" is a term in photography about guys with 'gear acquisition syndrome'. Perhaps that may be the symptom in this hobby as well for some people who constantly are on the upgrade path ---> the merry-go-round that never stops.
The point you might be missing is that as amplification increases, bass quality increases while the relative bass quantity likely decreases due to better definition (grip) of the bass. This is what plays into the musicality - a more refined, less colored sound on the bottom end that enhances the overall sound quality. Quite contrary to your suggestion that more amplification merely brings more "thump" - (my word). It's probably something you'll either 'get' if/when you hear it or not, and a part of the reason folks move to better amps and apply PSU's. Important to some, not so much to others. As you say, each listener has their own unique ear to satisfy. Sounds like you've found a good synergy with your Nait2 and efficient speakers, and that's all that matters in the end. Enjoy the music!
Well noted. You need to remember that SET's which put out 1-5 watts/channel give out excellent grip, detail and quality on bass as well ----> matched to 100dB transducers. Again, it's not just about power that can give quality bass, but as I mentioned earlier system synergy of matching equipment. Would you not agree? And yes, I totally agree ---> enjoy the music! Search out new genres instead of new gear - life's too short. Don't listen with the eyes but with the heart.
After reading through the thread again it seems that the differences between Supernait 1 & 2 are quite marked, so I think I’m going to chase down a demonstration of the SN 2 just to cure my curiosity, using my Nait 2 as a reference point. Plus, seek out alternatives to compare against the SN2 at the same time - just to reinforce that Naim is the direction I still want to go in. Probably be the usual suspects that I have listened to before, Linn, Roksan, Exposure, Creek etc. Plus some of the new boxes gaining attention - specifically Hegel spring to mind as the top contender.
Ok. Are you going to stick with the wall-mounted MAs?
C.
Not necessarily, rear ported speakers can work very well in all sorts of rooms. True to say they might well need a bit more trial and error with placement though.
C.
if possible do an audition of the Sonneteer Alabaster