Supercap DR losing vs Hi Cap DR

I'd leave the Supercap in the system for a few days and then replace it with the Hicap and do the same rather than swapping between the two. At the end of the day though, it's all about the system synergy and whilst the Supercap should be better, you may just prefer the sound of the Hicap in your system. 

I agree with James and I am not a big fan of short A:B comparisons through swapping.

Plug it in and listen to your music for a week or so  then revert back. If you miss it then it is

better for you if you don't miss it then don't bother with it.

Richard

You are using two snaics, aren't you?

Thanks all. Sound advice. And, of course some albums sound better with one than the other. Simple Minds' 'Glittering Prize' is screeching agony on the HC and just about under control with the SC. The 250DR is new so that will hopefully soften a bit as it burns in, too. Yep, 2 snaics, HH. 

eagle3333 posted:

What is wrong with my system?! NDX/282/250/Spendor SB2/3.

What's wrong? There's no XPS on the NDX.

C.

Christopher_M posted:

eagle3333 posted:

What is wrong with my system?! NDX/282/250/Spendor SB2/3.

What's wrong? There's no XPS on the NDX.

C.

Good point Chris - transforms the NDX. A much better place to start. 

I'm in exactly the same place now - burning in a new 250 DR, with used 282 + new SuperCap DR, driven by NDX without an XPS.

I'd say - test for many days, before you swap to HiCap. You need to get accustomed to how the system sounds.

I chose to go for a SuperCap - it simply sounded 'more' to me. But HiCap is also a fine power supply and makes a lot of sense with 282.

Thanks Both - I'd considered this but thought the SC would give me more difference for the one box I can afford right now. Some say the XPS on the NDX makes the SQ bright? It's already bright enough on the HC thank you very much! Can't afford SC and XPS and am thinking to just live with the HC while the 250 breaks in as others have suggested. (Unfortunately, I can't live with each of them for much longer as one has to go back to the dealer.) If the XPS took away the brightness with the HC I'd be very happy. The SC is warmer but the vocals become too recessed. I could stick with it and get used to it but would be plagued by the nagging thought that the vocals aren't coming through as well as I know they can. 

Hey Adam - I hold you responsible for all this! The SC is 'more' - but not in the vocals. If I live with the SC I'll have to buy it to do it and live knowing that for that bigger sound I'm losing some pace and detail. P'raps the XPS would put it back; or maybe a Hi Line would put it back?

Tough call. Despite being a strong advocate of 'source first' my advice this time would be opposite - leave the system as it is for 6 months (having decided on either HiCap or SuperCap). This way it will settle down, cables will burn in. Only then will you be able to tell what each upgrade does.

The places, where most benefit should be gained are (in no particular order)

• 4-pin DIN to XLR for NAP 250
• DIN-DIN interconnect from NDX to 282
• XPS on NDX
• Power supply cables on all components

Most forum users will recommend XPS as the next logical upgrade. I will be testing it, this weekend (I have another system with nDAC being powered by XPS).

eagle3333 posted:

Hey Adam - I hold you responsible for all this! The SC is 'more' - but not in the vocals. If I live with the SC I'll have to buy it to do it and live knowing that for that bigger sound I'm losing some pace and detail. P'raps the XPS would put it back; or maybe a Hi Line would put it back?

Noooooo - I don't want that responsibility

My advice? Buy a piece that sounds best to you now. If HiCap sounds better to you go for it.
The system is for you and has to work for you - more does not mean better here.

Better power supplies on sources and better interconnects tend to 'open' the sound and make more of it available. So you will simply be enjoying your Naim even more when the time comes to adding XPS or HiLine (as an alternative have a look at TelluriumQ Black Diamond).

If it were me, I'd forget the Supercap, stick with a Hicap DR and get an XPSDR. The Hicap is great on the 282. Incidentally, when testing power supplies you should leave them in place for a few days and just listen to music. Then replace the previous one: if the sound gets worse then you know that the new one is better. Don't think about bass, treble, and all that nonsense, just think about whether you enjoy it more, or not. There is all sorts of gubbins in a preamp that needs to settle down when the power supply is changed, and if you swap back and forth every few minutes you won't have the first clue as to what is going on. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

If it were me, I'd forget the Supercap, stick with a Hicap DR and get an XPSDR. The Hicap is great on the 282.

Is it for financial reasons or sound quality reasons?

Sound - NDX/XPS with 282/Hicap will be better than NDX with 282/Supercap. 

And if we take a long-term perspective?

NDX / XPS with 282/HiCap vs NDX/XPS with 282/SuperCap....

I do realise this a bit theoretical, but one should also look at a long term upgrade path.

Well, obviously the second is better, but if it's one or the other in the short to medium term the XPS will be the best move. As a long term proposition, the XPS based system will be musically more rewarding. 

I went from Hicap (non DR) to SupercapDR on my 282 (with a 250.2 at that time) so have never experienced a HicapDR at home. This upgrade to the power supply produced a significant uplift in SQ for me but was partly driven by a desire to DR my power supply and the thought I would eventually upgrade to a 252 (which I have). So it is worth thinking long, long term and save some dosh.

By the way my SupercarDR took a LONG time to fully run in.

Take your time deciding and as others have said have extended listening sessions with each new component when you are demoing at home.

Good luck.

NigelB wrote:

'By the way my SupercarDR took a LONG time to fully run in.'

OK, OK, before anyone notices, I do not possess a Supercar, D(rag) R(acer) or otherwise.

Nice thought though. Vroom, Vroom!

Thanks everyone. Very valuable comments and much appreciated. A home test of an XPS might be useful. Of course, this is all assuming nothing's broken on the SC, which is ex-demo'. I can't sit on the SC and HC for long enough to get used to one and then swap back. I have to return one to the dealer. Given the spend, perhaps it makes most sense to live with the currently bright HC set-up and let the 250 DR burn in for a few weeks. Then trial an XPS DR on the NDX. Also my 282 is 10yrs old and should have a service - though I'm told the £250 service won't affect SQ. 

nigelb posted:

NigelB wrote:

'By the way my SupercarDR took a LONG time to fully run in.'

OK, OK, before anyone notices, I do not possess a Supercar, D(rag) R(acer) or otherwise.

Nice thought though. Vroom, Vroom!

Supercar, you say??? ;-)

eagle3333 posted:

Thanks everyone. Very valuable comments and much appreciated. A home test of an XPS might be useful. Of course, this is all assuming nothing's broken on the SC, which is ex-demo'. I can't sit on the SC and HC for long enough to get used to one and then swap back. I have to return one to the dealer. Given the spend, perhaps it makes most sense to live with the currently bright HC set-up and let the 250 DR burn in for a few weeks. Then trial an XPS DR on the NDX. Also my 282 is 10yrs old and should have a service - though I'm told the £250 service won't affect SQ. 

Sounds like a sensible route with the HiCap.

One thing: wait with the demo of an XPS for a few months. This will give you time to get used to the new system and for it to settle down.
You will then have a good, known background vs which you can evaluate the upgrade performance of the XPS on your NDX.

 

Adam Zielinski posted:

Tough call. Despite being a strong advocate of 'source first' my advice this time would be opposite - leave the system as it is for 6 months (having decided on either HiCap or SuperCap). This way it will settle down, cables will burn in. Only then will you be able to tell what each upgrade does.............

Nice call Adam, Patience is the key!

1st month SCDR, 2nd month HCDR!

Repeat this listening process under normal conditions, don't add or take anything from the equation.

A four month period should be suffice. 

Many prefer this technique, as opposed to the A-B listening test. One thing for sure, the former allows the OP to save up for the next upgrade!!!!

Allante93 posted:

 

Adam Zielinski posted:

Tough call. Despite being a strong advocate of 'source first' my advice this time would be opposite - leave the system as it is for 6 months (having decided on either HiCap or SuperCap). This way it will settle down, cables will burn in. Only then will you be able to tell what each upgrade does.............

Nice call Adam, Patience is the key!

Many prefer this technique, as opposed to the A-B listening test. One thing for sure, the former allows the OP to save up for the next upgrade!!!!

 

 

That's the added benefit

Unless funds are unlimited (I wish....) we all follow the famed 'upgrade path'. It is there for a reason - step by step....

Not suprising at all. I went from hicap to hicapdr to supercap dr to dual hicap dr back to a single hicap dr in my NDS/282/250 system.

The SupcapDR added a little speed to the system, at the expense of the well balanced 282/HiCapDR/250 sound signature.

The XPS-DR won't really add much to the 282/250/HicapDR either I'm afraid. Well, it'll take some getting used to initially, and you'll hate the bare NDX when you remove the XPS-DR - but it will 'slow' the NDX's sound...

May I congratulate you for having a well balanced system already?

Next stop: NDS, followed by 552. Save up for it, and let the Supercap be - unless your plan is to go for a 252 or a Superline....

Given the substantial price difference, and the fact that you're still in two minds, it makes sense to go the cheaper route, no?