Grounding for dummies

I looked at your profile, and all you need to do is set your grounding switch on your DAC V1 to chassis.

I'm sure this is already done.

Enjoy the music, and don't worry about it. Those using Naim sources do not need think about this, other than making sure the switch is set properly.

If you live in UK, you have a 3pin plug, which connects to earth properly, so no need to give this another thought.

This is only a problem for those using non-naim sources which are not grounded.

But apparently sound quality does go down if for instance 2 Naim CD players are plugged into a Naim preamp at the same time, during demo.

Not sure why? Maybe an earth loop is created?

analogmusic posted:

I looked at your profile, and all you need to do is set your grounding switch on your DAC V1 to chassis.

I'm sure this is already done.

Enjoy the music, and don't worry about it. Those using Naim sources do not need think about this, other than making sure the switch is set properly.

If you live in UK, you have a 3pin plug, which connects to earth properly, so no need to give this another thought.

This is only a problem for those using non-naim sources which are not grounded.

 

But apparently sound quality does go down if for instance 2 Naim CD players are plugged into a Naim preamp at the same time, during demo.

Not sure why? Maybe an earth loop is created?

Thanks to Simon in Suffolk for the great advice as usual! 

analogmusic posted:

But apparently sound quality does go down if for instance 2 Naim CD players are plugged into a Naim preamp at the same time, during demo.

Not sure why? Maybe an earth loop is created?

Yes, it's an earth loop.  The reason is that Naim CD players (as well as some others from other brands such as the early Meridian 206 etc..) have their signal earth connected to electrical ground as they're used in a Naim system as the system signal earth reference.  Therefore, if you have two such players connected to a Naim pre-amp at the same time, you have a system earth loop and performance will be impaired.  Indeed, were you to be trying to do a comparison between the two players then many differences would be nullified - they would both sound pretty similar and overall, neither would sound as good as they would if they were connected one at a time.  Of course, you may want to have two such pieces of equipment connected at the same time.  In which case, one of them should have the signal earth connection lifted (this is NOT the same as lifting the mains earth, which should NEVER be done to Naim kit as doing so renders it unsafe and potentially lethal).  Realising that many owners may want to run a Naim CD player alongside a streamer or DAC, Naim have made this easier with the streamers and DACs by having a signal earth switch  fitted.

And that is exactly what I heard. In my friends 552/500 system, a bare Naim NDAC (but grounding switch on chassis) and a CD555 were compared, and we couldn't hear much difference between them (which seemed very strange to me at that time)

Have to go back to re-do this test now (one source connected at a time)....

Richard if I may ask what is a system signal earth reference, and what is the importance of this?

Why was it done this way in naim amplifiers?

My understanding is that the system signal earth reference is the 0V, and the amplifier is supposed to amplify between this 0V and the musical signal.

If there is no system signal earth reference, then the amplifier is amplifying the difference between the musical signal and a floating/arbritary voltage - but there is no 0V anymore.

So this does obviously affect the performance of the whole system.

Also, if say a CD555 is connected and an NDAC (for other than CD usage), with grounding switch set on floating, is the NDAC still performing as well as if it would be if CD555 would be disconnected and NDAC grounding on chassis?

ok ok so if I have a Teac cd connected to my N272 plus a phono pre amp also connecetd and I DO NOT have any other Naim source I should use 'chassis' setting. Yes?

i would connect the CD player digitally only ( no analog interconnect)

turntable you have to find out if it is not grounded. But if it is you might hear some hum if 272 set on chassis

Anyway speak to your dealer if in doubt

analogmusic posted:

Enjoy the music, and don't worry about it.

I think that is my only choice, as reading this thread beyond this wise piece of advice makes my brain hurt !

However I am thinking of changing my system to potentially use a non-Naim source so at least need to understand any impact of that on grounding (refer to-pre-amp-or-not-to-pre-amp). Another thread advised that I would need to run an additional wire to ground that non-Naim source, which to my uninitiated brain sounds like I could either kill myself or blow up my equipment. Of course if I followed the advice correctly I am sure it is safe, but I just like to understand these things.

No matter - I will indeed just enjoy the music.

It's not difficult, I was apprehensive about it but did it.

but it is just simpler to buy a 272 with an xps dr

or buy a 282 or 252 and keep the dac v1 as a grounded source. It is nice to have multiple sources 

When asking about grounding it's helpful if you list everything connected to the hiFi system and how they are connected, as well as what type of mains connection you have (2 pin or 3 pin).

However in your case, looking at the 'To pre-amp or not to pre-amp' thread, the answer given there is the simplest solution for you - use a NAC-N272, set the switch to 'Chassis', then just enjoy the music and don't worry about it.  Adding non-Naim sources will just complicate things further and make it more difficult for members of this forum to help you.

If you want to upgrade later add an XPSDR.

analogmusic posted:

i would connect the CD player digitally only ( no analog interconnect)

 

turntable you have to find out if it is not grounded. But if it is you might hear some hum if 272 set on chassis

Anyway speak to your dealer if in doubt

yes, I'm using dig out via rca - bnc. And my turntable has a separte grounding cable which then is attached to a ground connector at the back of my trilogy pre amp (which has 3 pins in its power socket). 

I'm not sure about UK but here in Poland it's illegal to talk to dealers