Unitiserve - this is really really unfair

antmast posted:

Mike-B posted:

I think you might need to reconsider,  the US & HDX as good as they were in their day are the ones that are no longer relevant.  As CD ripper/players they did the job, but better more flexible ripping solutions are now available & downloading in the various HD formats is now the norm for new music. The Naim server units have not been developed, probably because of this, & my guess is they will get dropped from the product range at some time. Streamers in all their forms from NDS to Muso are so much more capable & user friendly with both local & network streaming,  they are also more format flexible considering all the PCM 24-bit variations & DSD,   & even with 16/44 CD rips they are sonically superior.     I don't understand your point about the irrelevance of ND players with external DAC,  why is everyone with a Naim source (or Linn, Cyrus, sony) using network streaming players & not server units & why so many of those with all manner of DAC's.       

Ugh!  Can one of you guys please architect it out what you are saying.  A person has a field of NASes that go into a router, the router into the UnitiServe and that into the DAC and the DAC into the amplifier, etc. What added functionality are you getting from the players. I am only asking here not challenging anybody. My UnitiServe plays all the HD downloads from Qobuz or any other site. Are you saying I should buy the NDX and dispose of everything. More importantly, if I did, would it sound better? 

I changed from using my uServe as player into Naim Dac / XPS2, set up as you use it, to using it as a network server into NDS/555PS.

We certainly prefer the later.  But Dac/XPS2 vs. NDS/555PS is obviously different hardware and more money.

Using the uServe as a server allowed me to remove it from my hi fi rack and move it to where the rest of my 'computer stuff' (like router, Time Capsule, switch, and nas) is all located.  It also allowed me to get a second system (Qute2) and share all of my uServe music with both systems, even at the same time if I want.

Hope this helps!

Bart posted:

antmast posted:

Mike-B posted:

I think you might need to reconsider,  the US & HDX as good as they were in their day are the ones that are no longer relevant.  As CD ripper/players they did the job, but better more flexible ripping solutions are now available & downloading in the various HD formats is now the norm for new music. The Naim server units have not been developed, probably because of this, & my guess is they will get dropped from the product range at some time. Streamers in all their forms from NDS to Muso are so much more capable & user friendly with both local & network streaming,  they are also more format flexible considering all the PCM 24-bit variations & DSD,   & even with 16/44 CD rips they are sonically superior.     I don't understand your point about the irrelevance of ND players with external DAC,  why is everyone with a Naim source (or Linn, Cyrus, sony) using network streaming players & not server units & why so many of those with all manner of DAC's.       

Ugh!  Can one of you guys please architect it out what you are saying.  A person has a field of NASes that go into a router, the router into the UnitiServe and that into the DAC and the DAC into the amplifier, etc. What added functionality are you getting from the players. I am only asking here not challenging anybody. My UnitiServe plays all the HD downloads from Qobuz or any other site. Are you saying I should buy the NDX and dispose of everything. More importantly, if I did, would it sound better? 

I changed from using my uServe as player into Naim Dac / XPS2, set up as you use it, to using it as a network server into NDS/555PS.

We certainly prefer the later.  But Dac/XPS2 vs. NDS/555PS is obviously different hardware and more money.

Using the uServe as a server allowed me to remove it from my hi fi rack and move it to where the rest of my 'computer stuff' (like router, Time Capsule, switch, and nas) is all located.  It also allowed me to get a second system (Qute2) and share all of my uServe music with both systems, even at the same time if I want.

Hope this helps!

Wow a lot of quotes. Anyhow, if you had any ripped cds, is it necessary to rerip them to get the best sound from them with the unitiserve to NDS/555PS. I am not worried about hires files, of course.

antmast posted:

Wow a lot of quotes. Anyhow, if you had any ripped cds, is it necessary to rerip them to get the best sound from them with the unitiserve to NDS/555PS. I am not worried about hires files, of course.

No -- once a cd has been ripped to lossess, you're done as far as I'm concerned!  My same UnitiServe library was used first with the Dac, and later with the NDS.  

Bart posted:

antmast posted:

Wow a lot of quotes. Anyhow, if you had any ripped cds, is it necessary to rerip them to get the best sound from them with the unitiserve to NDS/555PS. I am not worried about hires files, of course.

No -- once a cd has been ripped to lossess, you're done as far as I'm concerned!  My same UnitiServe library was used first with the Dac, and later with the NDS.  

Quite - as long as the original rip was bit perfect, and it's never been stored in a lossy format, it's the only rip you'll ever need.

Just make sure you keep at least one backup.

antmast posted:

Ugh!  Can one of you guys please architect it out what you are saying.  A person has a field of NASes that go into a router, the router into the UnitiServe and that into the DAC and the DAC into the amplifier, etc. What added functionality are you getting from the players. I am only asking here not challenging anybody. My UnitiServe plays all the HD downloads from Qobuz or any other site. Are you saying I should buy the NDX and dispose of everything. More importantly, if I did, would it sound better? 

I do not have a US or any form of "ripping" box,  I ripped my CD collection 2 years ago with PC/Laptop using the very flexible (dare I say far more flexible than US)  dBpowerampr software from a desktop DVD read/write drive,  I format all rips as WAV & store & played from a (1) NAS.  I now rarely rip a CD these days as most new music are downloads & hopefully 24-bit,  I download (or convert) PCM files as WAV or if available DSD.    The NDX plays all PCM up to 24/192 & DSD64,  it can stream locally from NAS (or USB) or network stream services such as Spotify & Tidal, tens of thousands of iRadio stations from around the world,  link thru using iPad control point with TV audio & FM Tuner,   all from one box & one control point. 

I'm not that familiar with US other than use a friends once as a ripper,  so my questions are;  what is the UnitiServes sample rate limit with 24-bit PCM,  I believe its 24/88 ( ?? )  I know it doesn't handle DSD,  what's needed to set up a streaming service such as Tidal or Spotify & how do you set up internet Radio.

The US has internet radio, but can't do Spotify or Tidal. 

The US can play up to 24/192, and it does iRadio (vTuner).

ChrisSU posted:

The US can play up to 24/192, and it does iRadio (vTuner).

Thnks,  I'm tempted to ask about if it can rip to full fat WAV or is it still that stripped out version & can it play full fat WAV bought it from downloads.     But a serious question  ...........  does the US vTuner process the BBC HLS service,  I ask as the N series upgrade to HLS needed extra work on the upgrade with a revert to default  to implement it.  Naim was the first BBC HLS service available to streamers I believe as a friend with another make system that has vTuner did not get his HLS service enabled for numbers of weeks later,  not sure what the situation is with Sonos. 

Mike-B posted:

ChrisSU posted:

The US can play up to 24/192, and it does iRadio (vTuner).

Thnks,  I'm tempted to ask about if it can rip to full fat WAV or is it still that stripped out version & can it play full fat WAV bought it from downloads.     But a serious question  ...........  does the US vTuner process the BBC HLS service,  I ask as the N series upgrade to HLS needed extra work on the upgrade with a revert to default  to implement it.  Naim was the first BBC HLS service available to streamers I believe as a friend with another make system that has vTuner did not get his HLS service enabled for numbers of weeks later,  not sure what the situation is with Sonos. 

What is "full fat WAV?" I've never heard that term before. 

The uServe can rip to wav, or flac.

I dont know about the BBC HLS service, as such is not accessible from here in the States anyway.

The servers didn't get the HLS update. 

Bart posted:

What is "full fat WAV?" I've never heard that term before. 

The uServe can rip to wav, or flac.

I dont know about the BBC HLS service, as such is not accessible from here in the States anyway.

I understand that the US rips a "Naim" version of WAV that has tag stuff missing,  whereas if its set to rip FLAC it has it all.  

The HLS services are only available in UK so is an irrelevant question as the OP is USA,  

I was just asking to get a better understanding of US as I have a disabled friend with a US & it seems has a problem & he might be needing help move the files over to a NAS.

Mike - US rips the WAVs in a 'bare' format (still).

Mike-B posted:

Bart posted:

What is "full fat WAV?" I've never heard that term before. 

The uServe can rip to wav, or flac.

I dont know about the BBC HLS service, as such is not accessible from here in the States anyway.

I understand that the US rips a "Naim" version of WAV that has tag stuff missing,  whereas if its set to rip FLAC it has it all.  

The HLS services are only available in UK so is an irrelevant question as the OP is USA,  

I was just asking to get a better understanding of US as I have a disabled friend with a US & it seems has a problem & he might be needing help move the files over to a NAS.

First of all there should be a backup on the nas already hopefully. The wav files are standard, it is just that the meta data are stored outside the wav file. Let the userve convert wav to flac and all meta data are there now inside the flac files.

So convert wav to flac on the server, then make a full backup to the nas. This will take a few days but is the simple way of doing it.

Claus

andarkian posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

It's good that Naim doesn't make turntables then... 

Exactly! Nor should they try and produce servers. 

10 years to late for that!

Development seems to be minimal, I am sure because the OS on the servers is embedded WindowsXP, and the streamers use different hardware so need different programming skills. Look at the job descriptions posted at Naim's website.

Claus

Thanks for the input Claus,  I was aware of the basics & the FLAC conversion, as is the US owner.   He was talking about it, but I'm not sure if he did get that done .  I will need to go take a look myself but it sounds like the US has gone kaput. ...........  we are hijacking this thread ...... over & out 

I sympathise with the OP. As far back as late 2014, I was at cross road & felt Naim let me down for not developing US. In the end, I gave up and sold my US/NDac/XPS2Dr combo for Auralic Aries+Vega. Eventually, sold 200/202 for Krell Integrated.

Unfortunately, 272 came a little for me otherwise I would have opted for it (& upgrade 200 to 250).

AKD posted:

I sympathise with the OP. As far back as late 2014, I was at cross road & felt Naim let me down for not developing US. In the end, I gave up and sold my US/NDac/XPS2Dr combo for Auralic Aries+Vega. Eventually, sold 200/202 for Krell Integrated.

But you still need a server . . . do you use a nas?  Aries and Vega seem to have little in common functionally with the UnitiServe.  The Aries seems to be a bridge between a server (you still need one...the uServe is a sever) and a dac (the uServe does not contain a dac.)  The Vega is a dac.  Seems apples vs. oranges if I understand.

You could have used US/NDX or NDS, for example.  Whether they would sound as good as Auralic, I have no idea!  And the Aries likely has many more networks at the ready (more than just Spotify and Tidal) so if that's important yes that's a plus.

I would have thought your criticism would be better placed with Naim not offering as much on their network players, as opposed to its "server/ripper."

Ok! The NDS  is a very expensive piece, which I am sure everyone knows. If, lets says, I wanted to come down on some of the peripherals, assuming I currently have no preamp, and the proper power supply, and keeping the NDS DAC for now, of course. Sticking to Naim, how low would you go?

Antmast? Which DAC do you have now? 

Good system matches, which give you additional upgrade (via a power supply) are:

ND5XS + nDAC into any XS amp - this gives you good visual appeal. Later upgrade: XP5XS

NDX + nDAC (improved sound quality due to a bette digital transport). Power supply upgrade: XPS or 555PS.  Minimum integrated amp for that setup: SuperNait. 

N272 + power amp. Power supply upgrade: XPS.

Bart posted:

AKD posted:

I sympathise with the OP. As far back as late 2014, I was at cross road & felt Naim let me down for not developing US. In the end, I gave up and sold my US/NDac/XPS2Dr combo for Auralic Aries+Vega. Eventually, sold 200/202 for Krell Integrated.

But you still need a server . . . do you use a nas?  Aries and Vega seem to have little in common functionally with the UnitiServe.  The Aries seems to be a bridge between a server (you still need one...the uServe is a sever) and a dac (the uServe does not contain a dac.)  The Vega is a dac.  Seems apples vs. oranges if I understand.

You could have used US/NDX or NDS, for example.  Whether they would sound as good as Auralic, I have no idea!  And the Aries likely has many more networks at the ready (more than just Spotify and Tidal) so if that's important yes that's a plus.

I would have thought your criticism would be better placed with Naim not offering as much on their network players, as opposed to its "server/ripper."

I've always have Synology NAS because my US is SSD model.

AKD posted:

Bart posted:

AKD posted:

I sympathise with the OP. As far back as late 2014, I was at cross road & felt Naim let me down for not developing US. In the end, I gave up and sold my US/NDac/XPS2Dr combo for Auralic Aries+Vega. Eventually, sold 200/202 for Krell Integrated.

But you still need a server . . . do you use a nas?  Aries and Vega seem to have little in common functionally with the UnitiServe.  The Aries seems to be a bridge between a server (you still need one...the uServe is a sever) and a dac (the uServe does not contain a dac.)  The Vega is a dac.  Seems apples vs. oranges if I understand.

You could have used US/NDX or NDS, for example.  Whether they would sound as good as Auralic, I have no idea!  And the Aries likely has many more networks at the ready (more than just Spotify and Tidal) so if that's important yes that's a plus.

I would have thought your criticism would be better placed with Naim not offering as much on their network players, as opposed to its "server/ripper."

I've always have Synology NAS because my US is SSD model.

My initial thought is that a UnitiServe SSD, used as a 'local player' (meaning with a direct digital cable connection to a dac), indeed is not great value for money.  You're not using it as a storage device...you're not using it as a server...obviously you still need a dac...you're using it as a ripper and player.  Only.

Bart posted:

AKD posted:

Bart posted:

AKD posted:

I sympathise with the OP. As far back as late 2014, I was at cross road & felt Naim let me down for not developing US. In the end, I gave up and sold my US/NDac/XPS2Dr combo for Auralic Aries+Vega. Eventually, sold 200/202 for Krell Integrated.

But you still need a server . . . do you use a nas?  Aries and Vega seem to have little in common functionally with the UnitiServe.  The Aries seems to be a bridge between a server (you still need one...the uServe is a sever) and a dac (the uServe does not contain a dac.)  The Vega is a dac.  Seems apples vs. oranges if I understand.

You could have used US/NDX or NDS, for example.  Whether they would sound as good as Auralic, I have no idea!  And the Aries likely has many more networks at the ready (more than just Spotify and Tidal) so if that's important yes that's a plus.

I would have thought your criticism would be better placed with Naim not offering as much on their network players, as opposed to its "server/ripper."

I've always have Synology NAS because my US is SSD model.

My initial thought is that a UnitiServe SSD, used as a 'local player' (meaning with a direct digital cable connection to a dac), indeed is not great value for money.  You're not using it as a storage device...you're not using it as a server...obviously you still need a dac...you're using it as a ripper and player.  Only.

Bart,

Yes indeed (not value for money), it is the price one pays for been early adopter of new technology. Although, my first US was an HDD version but it kept on crashing and after 3rd attempt, Naim offer me a replacement which i changed to SSD version at no extra cost.

I was happy with US until Naim stopped development on it and i wanted to explore streaming (Tidal/Quboz) without spending another £2,000+.

I too was a bit of an early adopter, and went with the UnitiServe as I wanted to re-enter the hi fi world after many years, AND start in with home streaming, w/o having to 'fuss' with computer hardware.  The uServe (HDD) did just that.  I feel that Naim served me well (no pun intended) and that for some in the market, making it SIMPLE is the right approach.   Given what I know now, I am happier with the functionality of Minim and Asset; they display my music is a more logical way, not the least of which is allowing The Beatles and The Who to show up under B and W, respectively.  

Adam Zielinski posted:

Antmast? Which DAC do you have now? 

Good system matches, which give you additional upgrade (via a power supply) are:

ND5XS + nDAC into any XS amp - this gives you good visual appeal. Later upgrade: XP5XS

NDX + nDAC (improved sound quality due to a bette digital transport). Power supply upgrade: XPS or 555PS.  Minimum integrated amp for that setup: SuperNait. 

N272 + power amp. Power supply upgrade: XPS.

 

I do have the Musical Fidelity M6 PRX amplifier, and my DAC is the SimAudio Moon 380D with preamp option. I was told that the NDS has a better DAC. I would like to go with the NDS but I was also told that it was a good unit but old and there may be better units out there now. However if I do go with the NDS how low would u go for the power supply and the preamp.