Full circle....back to the Sonos
Posted by: Occean on 04 July 2011
Well, I finally re-took the plunge and purchased a Sonos again.
I originally bought one a few years back and was generally pleased with it but found I was always controlling it from my PC (which was plugged into my TV), and due to it's lack of highres support decided I might as well use my PC.
So setup my PC with a decent soundcard, Foobar etc etc. Sounded pretty fab. But then the motherboard went and in a mini fit of rage I replaced the whole PC with a mac mini. Which to be honest I haven't really got a long with in OSX or Win7 for audio at least.
So I was at a friends last weekend who gave me a demo of his Sonos ZP90/S5 and ipad (ironically I sold him the ZP90!) - together with Spotify, which is a music service I love. And they whole things was so slick, I had forgotten how nice it was to use and with Spotify, huge bonus and ipad added the perfect control point.
So I have purchased another ZP90 (digital to Supernait) and a S5 for the bedroom (I already have an ipad) - must say I am over the moon - for me the only drawback is the lack of hires support - which in all reality is >0.1% of my music collection.
So I have pretty much gone a full circle and I think I have found my perfect streaming platform albeit without highres support - now I am tempted to look into the audiocomm mods. Oh and the S5 isn't bad for a second room.
PS : Yes I have tried Unitiserve
> I mean how many hires tracks do people have as a proportion of their total music collection at this stage?
I have exactly none and I counted twice to be sure - OK I've got some SACDs, but only ever listen to CD layer on them except for an odd occasion when I heard them played through on a SACD player. which sounded very good. My ZP90 is now wired for sound and sounds quite amazing through the Naim DAC.
If I want higher resolution then I can just plonk an elpee on the LP12 
> I mean how many hires tracks do people have as a proportion of their total music collection at this stage?
I have exactly none and I counted twice to be sure - OK I've got some SACDs, but only ever listen to CD layer on them except for an odd occasion when I heard them played through on a SACD player. which sounded very good. My ZP90 is now wired for sound and sounds quite amazing through the Naim DAC.
If I want higher resolution then I can just plonk an elpee on the LP12
Guido, Did you get a chance to compare your ZP90 before and after the w4s modification - what sort of improvement did you hear?
I have an unmodified ZP90 and a Z90 W4S - the shipping costs didn't make it sensible to send mine over to Rick. So I got one he did earlier. I've found good use for the spare.
When I first got my UQ I used the optical output from a Mac to play through the UQ's DAC and the results were OK - when I went asynchronous USB to S/PDIF courtesy of the MF V-Link I noticed an enormous improvement in terms of clarity with whole layer of muddy distortion banished. You may have heard me bestow its virtues.
Well the ZP90 vs. ZP90 W4S is the same effect only more so, which is something else as the Sonus Coax out always sounded better than the Mac optical out. The feeling of well this is a ripped CD played over wireless and so we can't expect it to be at the level of a CDX2 goes out of the window. I'm bowled over by the improvement. Still the same rock solid Sonus network, still the same wonderful interface on my iPAD, but now a sound so good I can say I'm unlikely to resort to USB sticks in the rear port on my Naim DAC again. Don't get me wrong the stock ZP90 is great value and as a player is excellent, but W4S make it my dream streamer. Is the NDX even better - well it may be, but as Alice Cooper once said when trying to get Elected: personally, I don't care. I don't run a UPnP on my music server which I'd need to mess about with for the NDX - the Sonus just works thanks to the way it interacts with its own Sonus bridge (brilliant in its simplicity).
Why the improved sound? My theory is getting rid of the cheap as chips Cirrus chip in favour of a TI chip with an excellent clock makes the difference as this is what is fundamental to both the V-Link and W4S. Much lower jitter does seem to make a difference despite my intuition telling me it probably would not make any difference with the Naim DAC (however, I cannot prove it is just the result of lower jitter, it might be the crime of up-sampling). Beware the ZP90 W4S does up-sample 
and so if you are a firm believer in NOS then this is not acceptable, but I say irk the purists and enjoy the music.
So for me at least, ZP90 W4S is a winner - main digital system is now ZP90-W4S/Chord Coax/Naim DAC/555PS/hi-Line in to 282/200/Allaes. If I want true hi-res then I stick some plastic on the LP12, which is still unbeatable in my book. However, not everything is on vinyl and the digital system does very nicely - and the iPAD as a controller is addictive.
I'm sure somebody will be along to tell me if I used a UnitiServe with Rega DAC or L*DAC then it'll outperform my ZP90 W4S/Naim DAC - maybe it will: seriously doubt it though.
Before I upset anybody I'm sure UnitiServe over a wired LAN into NDX/555PS into Naim DAC/555PS sounds beyond reproach, but I'm happy enough with what I'm lucky enough to have.
All the best, Guy
> I mean how many hires tracks do people have as a proportion of their total music collection at this stage?
I have exactly none and I counted twice to be sure - OK I've got some SACDs, but only ever listen to CD layer on them except for an odd occasion when I heard them played through on a SACD player. which sounded very good. My ZP90 is now wired for sound and sounds quite amazing through the Naim DAC.
If I want higher resolution then I can just plonk an elpee on the LP12
You would probably have some if you could play them.
I have an unmodified ZP90 and a Z90 W4S - the shipping costs didn't make it sensible to send mine over to Rick. So I got one he did earlier. I've found good use for the spare.
When I first got my UQ I used the optical output from a Mac to play through the UQ's DAC and the results were OK - when I went asynchronous USB to S/PDIF courtesy of the MF V-Link I noticed an enormous improvement in terms of clarity with whole layer of muddy distortion banished. You may have heard me bestow its virtues.
Well the ZP90 vs. ZP90 W4S is the same effect only more so, which is something else as the Sonus Coax out always sounded better than the Mac optical out. The feeling of well this is a ripped CD played over wireless and so we can't expect it to be at the level of a CDX2 goes out of the window. I'm bowled over by the improvement. Still the same rock solid Sonus network, still the same wonderful interface on my iPAD, but now a sound so good I can say I'm unlikely to resort to USB sticks in the rear port on my Naim DAC again. Don't get me wrong the stock ZP90 is great value and as a player is excellent, but W4S make it my dream streamer. Is the NDX even better - well it may be, but as Alice Cooper once said when trying to get Elected: personally, I don't care. I don't run a UPnP on my music server which I'd need to mess about with for the NDX - the Sonus just works thanks to the way it interacts with its own Sonus bridge (brilliant in its simplicity).
Why the improved sound? My theory is getting rid of the cheap as chips Cirrus chip in favour of a TI chip with an excellent clock makes the difference as this is what is fundamental to both the V-Link and W4S. Much lower jitter does seem to make a difference despite my intuition telling me it probably would not make any difference with the Naim DAC (however, I cannot prove it is just the result of lower jitter, it might be the crime of up-sampling). Beware the ZP90 W4S does up-sample and so if you are a firm believer in NOS then this is not acceptable, but I say irk the purists and enjoy the music.
So for me at least, ZP90 W4S is a winner - main digital system is now ZP90-W4S/Chord Coax/Naim DAC/555PS/hi-Line in to 282/200/Allaes. If I want true hi-res then I stick some plastic on the LP12, which is still unbeatable in my book. However, not everything is on vinyl and the digital system does very nicely - and the iPAD as a controller is addictive.
I'm sure somebody will be along to tell me if I used a UnitiServe with Rega DAC or L*DAC then it'll outperform my ZP90 W4S/Naim DAC - maybe it will: seriously doubt it though.
Before I upset anybody I'm sure UnitiServe over a wired LAN into NDX/555PS into Naim DAC/555PS sounds beyond reproach, but I'm happy enough with what I'm lucky enough to have.
All the best, Guy
Great write up Guy, very interesting. I am glad it worked out so well! I mentioned earlier in this thread that I did not see the point of modifying my ZP90 but must admit I got curious after having looked at the W4S website. So today I spoke to the chaps at Item Audio in the UK to enquire about modifying my existing ZP90. Unfortunately it seems it needs to be sent to the US in order to get it done. So it's probably easier to just buy one and sell the existing one. This would be an option but not until later, too many expenses at the moment, taking delivery of my nDAC end of next week, so my standard ZP90 will have to do for a while yet.
Did you ever make any enquiries into the audiocom mod? Just wondering since these guys are based in the UK, it would have been much easier. Any particular reason you chose W4S over audiocom?
So what about your Qute now, are you using it?
Best
tp
> I mean how many hires tracks do people have as a proportion of their total music collection at this stage?
I have exactly none and I counted twice to be sure - OK I've got some SACDs, but only ever listen to CD layer on them except for an odd occasion when I heard them played through on a SACD player. which sounded very good. My ZP90 is now wired for sound and sounds quite amazing through the Naim DAC.
If I want higher resolution then I can just plonk an elpee on the LP12
You would probably have some if you could play them.
True 
Then again, I'm just beginning to get into digital audio and still have loads of CDs to rip before I even start thinking about buying hires tracks or albums, it's not really on my mind just yet. Maybe once I am more involved I will get curious...