NDS vs Squeezebox touch; the devil is in the firmware, or how to listen to track 1 of all your albums.

Posted by: Ron Toolsie on 04 July 2016

Lately I have had access to both and SBT and an NDS. The latter is juiced up with my XPS-CR (cough). I had been preferentially using the SBT for the last couple of weeks due to its greatly better interface. The NDS did get some use for the more critical listening, although to be honest there wasn't as large as a gap between the SBT (using its analog outputs) and the NDS as I had hoped. 

The NDS did sound more 'grippy' and dynamic, with the SBT sounding a little bloomy at the bottom and dark at the top. But not the sort of OMFG differences that the price differential would allow you to expect. 

The NDS came pre-installed with the (very) old ver 3.3 firmware, in spite of the dealers assurance that it had the latest updates. I was a bit hesitant to do the updates as they sounded quite a bit more involved than the 'plug in and auto everything' ease of the nDAC update. 

First I had to order a USB to data mini USB plug. That took a week to get here. 

Install Naim updater package-check. 

Skin my fingers and wrists getting out the NDS and XPS-CR and lugging them over to my desktop PC. Plug NDS into it via the above cable and start reading...

'Requires wired internet connection'.......My desktop is on the other side of the house from the router etc. So I unplug all the wires and move the two boxes across to the other room that houses both a router and another PC. 

Download both Naim streamer update software and the required drivers for the mini USB cable. 

Wait...this PC hasn't got any unzip software. 

Download a trial version of the latest WInzip. Unpack the Naim software. 

Follow the onscreen instructions, which turn out to be quite explicit. 

Powering off and on brings up the internet radio station that was last used. So time to cart the units back to the bookshelf housing the gear (my Fraim stack is in the garage supporting toolboxes BTW). 

Reskin fingers and wrists getting units back into their slots and hooking up the Burndy, power cable and interconnects. 

Power on......'No Network'. 

Have to enter password to Wifi, making several miskeys that apparently cannot be edited and the process has to be restarted. Three times. Is there a back-arrow button on either the remote or on the main fascia??

Wifi connected!!

Cue up the 'Audiophile' Baroque station at 320 kb/s. 

Is this even the same piece of gear that I had playing just an hour or so ago? The sound is quite unrecognizable from its previous guise. Bigger, fuller, richer, more involving....and for the first time actual spatial information with stuff happening between the speakers. I flip through radio stations....stuff at 128 kb/s is now sounding better than the 320 material did with the earlier firmware. 

Time to try a few albums.....start flipping through. The Naim app only 'sees' the first track in every album. So I play a few first tracks. 

Beautiful clarity and vocal inflections that were simply absent before.  Much better than 320 radio. So good, I almost did not miss tracks 2,3,4.....n-1, n on all of the albums. This is the most 'hair-shirt' upgrade I have ever done. 

Read forum. It says to reboot the NDS. Reboot the NDS....recheck the albums. Still only the first track shows up. But...DAMN, do they sound fine. 

I may end up just taking the digital out of the SBT and putting it into the NDS, and use the much less buggy Squeezer app. 

BTW, the analog outputs of the SBT.....they now sound fairly toxic by comparison. But at least I can move on to the second album track!

Maybe firmware ver 5.0 will play all the tracks...backwards. Great of LZ maybe, or the chiral works of JSB.

Any one has an idea how I can get 4.4 to recover the missing parts of my album collection?

Did I say the sound was very much better than the earlier software. I liken the differences to those of moving from a Hi- to a Supercap-something I have done on many pieces of gear. 

 

 

 

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by DrMark

Ooh, this has the potential to be good...

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by MarkMcK79

Sounds like more of an issue with your NAS and your media server software than the NDS.  Have you restarted the server?

Where's your dealer in all this?  They should have been able to update the firmware for you and tested to ensure no issues.

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by Mike-B

What is the NAS & its UPnP media server software ??

If its Synology or QNAP, I would run a reindex in the NAS & clear both Naim app UPnP & Image cache's.  (try that & see if its fixed)  

Reboot (power cycle) all the LAN components.  It needs to be done systematically to correctly establish LAN & wireless links. 
Shut down everything that is connected to the network
Restart the system in the following order
1. Wireless router - let it complete its start process & wait 5 minutes to be sure the ISP knows its back online.
2. LAN switch (if fitted) 
3. NAS - let it complete its full start process
4. Network player …. the Network player should find the network automatically but may need some manual help with the front panel buttons.
5. Control Device – good idea to reset or even delete & re-install the app as part of this process.

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by Ron Toolsie

Thanks for ths suggestions. I am using my desktop as a sort of musical server with the albums either in folders on the internal hard drive or on a 2 TB external HD linked via a USB 3.0 port. 

I restarted the wifi router/PC/NDS slowly in that order and still have the problem remain. I am using Asset on the PC as a UPnP controller. 

It looks like the albums that are affected are the ones I ripped to a single FLAC file using EAC, although they also have the .cue and .log files in the same folder. Reading the individual tracks within the single FLAC file is not a problem with the VLC player I have on the PC-but maybe it is with Asset, or the NDS. 

Maybe I have to rerip the hundreds of albums into individual .wav or .flac files?

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by Bart

I'm pretty sure that Asset server does not support the single file / cue sheet format.  J River does, however; you could try that server.  OR, re-rip to individual files.

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by Ron Toolsie

Yes, its defo an Asset/NDS problem reading the tracks from the .cue file. So for now, I am using the SBT digital out into the NDS, and using the Squeezer app which DOES split the amalgamated file into individual tracks. For now I have only got it hooked up with a generic RCA phono cable. 

Thanks Bart for the info....I will look into J River!

Posted on: 04 July 2016 by Bart
Ron Toolsie posted:

Yes, its defo an Asset/NDS problem reading the tracks from the .cue file. So for now, I am using the SBT digital out into the NDS, and using the Squeezer app which DOES split the amalgamated file into individual tracks. For now I have only got it hooked up with a generic RCA phono cable. 

Thanks Bart for the info....I will look into J River!

It's nothing to do with the NDS; Asset server cannot pick apart the files so it cannot send them.  My local hi fi shop prefers J River, but they set people up with pc's not nas boxes.

Posted on: 05 July 2016 by DrPo

if you have Foobar installed you can quickly split (and save) the single FLAC file into individual ones (use the Foobar 'convert' functionality) - your streamer should then see them as such

Posted on: 05 July 2016 by Bart

XLD for OS X will also split a flac/cue; I don't know why I even said "re-rip!"