Mixing CB and Black Naim

NJB posted:

 

Out of curiosity I put in my old CB 62, and the differences are surprisingly small.  

I'm not surpriced

I have tried both Nac 102 & 202 - the latter virtually a reboxed 102, both not much better than my Nac 62 or 72, the latter providing me high music pleasure, couldn't say the same of my Nac 102 which after a short period with less and less music played it finally had to go, music came back.

There are differences offcourse (102/202 vs 62/72) and a remote to differ, prices are another issue at least a 202 is very expensive new, for what you get I'd choose otherwise

If you have a 'good' 62, then i'm also not surprised. The older pre amps were a little more variable in their performance when new from the factory, but get a good one and they are superb. I once put up a 32.5 against my 282, both with a SC2, and there were certain aspects of the 32.5 i liked more. Overall the 282 was for sure, 'better', more detailed, refined and with greater dynamic ability, but the 32.5 made music in such a beautiful way, i could forgive it for any of its shortcomings…... 

Interesting comments, thanks.  I guess that modern components and build standards, plus being newer, means that you get a more reliable sound.  My 62 has never been touched, is over 25 years old, and has spent long periods out of use.  Using a wild assumption, it must be a good one if it still works well.

They were all extremely reliable, just some sounded better than others.  It's no different today, but sample variations are slightly less from experience.

I agree Alba.  The aims are the same and Naim with their minimalist designs always made me think that they got the basics right and thus could avoid extra circuitry to correct the aberrations.  However, as a fan for over 25 years I could be biased.  

I guess that modern IC techniques add to the designers toolbox but that does not translate into better.  I have a personal view that modern designers are a bit lazy because the technology saves their bacon.  Back in the day, JV had no such safety net.

There's very little difference in "musicality" from a 32.5/Hicap/250 (or, for that matter, an original Nait) to any of the newer gear (Statement excepted - I've not heard it).  A 552/500, while it leaves the 32.5/Hicap/250 in the dust as far as sonics, offers a surprisingly small increase in musicality.  Certainly audible, but the improvement comes at an enormous increase in price. 

The CB involved more hand build items whereas Olive implemented aut. maschinery, print layout etc..

That period of Electronics was surpricingly musically coloured vs. recent more "accurate" (read: not that exiting, more polished or polite)

I guess Naim changed strategy back then, it was late JV days and wide range of customers wanted RCA connectors and soundstage - not something they really cared for, in Salisbury before the Nait5/Nap 500 era.

NJB posted:

I have a personal view that modern designers are a bit lazy because the technology saves their bacon. 

Well you've given Naim's staffers something to laugh about at coffee time this morning

Chris

b_lund posted:

The CB involved more hand build items whereas Olive implemented aut. maschinery, print layout etc..

That period of Electronics was surpricingly musically coloured vs. recent more "accurate" (read: not that exiting, more polished or polite)

I guess Naim changed strategy back then, it was late JV days and wide range of customers wanted RCA connectors and soundstage - not something they really cared for, in Salisbury before the Nait5/Nap 500 era.

The "ROBIN" auto insertion machine, used for reliably and consistently populating PCBs with smaller through-hole componentry, was introduced in 1988, just at the end of the "chrome-bumper" era.  For sure, it enabled greater efficiency and as far as sonics were concerned the only change was for the good - progressively better consistency.  The latter is something that Naim have always worked hard to achieve - experience with other brands will show just how hard it is to achieve in hifi, particularly when you really push the performance envelope.

Arguably, a bigger sonic difference happened a number of years earlier when the old style hand-drawn "swirly" PCB tracks were changed to the more modern type halfway through the CB era. Some rather like the looser, slightly more romantic sound you got from the earlier PCBs.

RCA connectors were introduced after years of requests from export markets, particularly North America. Naim resisted until such time as revisions to the logic control of the pre-amps and CD players enabled RCA sockets to be installed while enabling them to be defeated and thus performance not compromised by their inclusion - a typical no-compromise Naim solution.

I have a "good" olive 62 and it has given me more pleasure than any Naim pre-amp before, 202/32.5/112. I think my 32.5 was certainly not a great example but this 62 is spectacularly good. 

Sister xx

I use the CB and some black Naim, and although not a pre-amp as you are currently using, I do run a 32.5 with Hi-Cap and Nap 140 (all CB) and the (black) UQ as my main source along with a Linn Sondek too.  I have tried 'black' amps in the past though and  personally I prefer the sound of the older amplification compared to the current range, it's more 'fun' and while perhaps not as sharp it's also less clinical in my opinion.  It looks great too.