OS X Software Players (Audirvana, iTunes, JRiver, Pure Music, etc)

I am also using Audirvana into my Hugo.  I don't have iTunes involved at all and I don't have any problem sending bit perfect files to my dac via USB from Audirvana. I tried a number of different pieces of software on Mac and PC before settling on Audirvana which to me sound better than the alternatives. 

dayjay posted:

I am also using Audirvana into my Hugo.  I don't have iTunes involved at all and I don't have any problem sending bit perfect files to my dac via USB from Audirvana. I tried a number of different pieces of software on Mac and PC before settling on Audirvana which to me sound better than the alternatives. 

Same here, tried different software packages before finally settling down on Audirvana+.

DayJay, have you got Hugo connected to HD USB input? If so, do you only get a single option in Audio Midi Settings for 32 bit? If so then you cannot send a 16 bit file bit perfect to Hugo as Audirvana will always convert to 32 bit before sending to Hugo. How are you connecting to Hugo?

Like others have said, I too have tried other Mac software players and extremely happy with A+ since v1.4. I also use iTunes mode when I want to listen internet radio.

Not sure whether the Midi setting on the Mac means that upsampling takes place.

 The way to check is either in A+ on the Mac itself or the A+ remote app (assuming that you haven't already).  

Below the playback controls in the app and in the top strip of the A+ window - the bit-depth and sample rate that the DAC is receiving and of the file being played are shown. If theses values are different, there is either upsampling (or down sampling) going on between the Mac and what the DAC receives.

Some DACs upsample by design. Not sure about the Hugo family as I don't use it.

A+ can be set to upsample from the Audio Filters 'tab' in Preferences and/or choose between Apple's Core Audio (same as iTunes would use) or Izotope for experimenting.

Regarding bitperfect, the Naim V1 and Audiphilleo USB to SPDIF converters are able to do bitperfect tests.  

HTH

Jude

Thanks Jude, yes the dac and file are different as you describe. Dac is 32 bit, file is 16 bit so Audirvana is converting and not sending bit perfect due to Hugo tt driver/audio midi settings.

how do Audirvana users like mode 1 vs mode 2 soundwise.

still experimenting Halloween Man, based on your comment above I'll give mode 2 an extended trial this weekend

Halloween Man posted:

Thanks Jude, yes the dac and file are different as you describe. Dac is 32 bit, file is 16 bit so Audirvana is converting and not sending bit perfect due to Hugo tt driver/audio midi settings.

how do Audirvana users like mode 1 vs mode 2 soundwise.

Puzzling that it's the TT's driver. Presumably this is a known issue to Chord? Is it the same for SPDIF ?

I've tried mode 1 and 2 and settled with 1.  I find that updates to A+ have a bigger influence on sound.

I don't think chord are aware of the issue. I did try explaining to rob watts, the designer of Hugo,  in another form but he's not familiar with OS X and didn't seem to understand the issue.

Halloween Man posted:

I don't think chord are aware of the issue. I did try explaining to rob watts, the designer of Hugo,  in another form but he's not familiar with OS X and didn't seem to understand the issue.

...and if he didn't understand it, imagine how I feel. I understood not one thing above...As a TT user what (if anything) am I missing I now wonder...

G

In prefered audio device I have one option which is 'Hugo'.  Based on the coloured lights on my Hugo I get what I send as far as I can see.  Am I missing something, or is this a TT problem?  I use integer mode 1 but will try 2 based on what you have said.

Halloween Man posted:

I don't think chord are aware of the issue. I did try explaining to rob watts, the designer of Hugo,  in another form but he's not familiar with OS X and didn't seem to understand the issue.

I would try looking or posting in the A+ threads in the computeraudiophile forum, where the developer of A+ responds.

In using the Naim V1, although OS X Audio Midi is set to 24 bit, A+ sees files that  are 16 bit as 16 bit and sends them through to the DAC as 16 bit (same for 24 bit files).  

No additional drivers are needed to be installed on OS X. (like for the TT).

Out of interest which version of OS X are you using?

Jude 

I'm using El Capitan. Yes, the V1 does not have this problem.

The TT in OS X is driverless but OS X only recognises the device as 32 bit only. If you look in Applications > Utilities > Audio Midi Setup you'll see it there. I did ask the developer of Audirvana in another forum and he confirmed 16 bit files will be converted to 32 bit before hitting the DAC due to TTs Audio Midi Setup.

GraemeH posted:

Halloween Man posted:

I don't think chord are aware of the issue. I did try explaining to rob watts, the designer of Hugo,  in another form but he's not familiar with OS X and didn't seem to understand the issue.

...and if he didn't understand it, imagine how I feel. I understood not one thing above...As a TT user what (if anything) am I missing I now wonder...

G

 

 

Don't worry because in theory converting a 16 bit file to a 32 bit file is trivial and should have no effect whatsoever on sound quality. However, you are putting your trust in software such as Audirvana to do this correctly.

If you want complete peace of mind then Rob Watts uses Windows 10 with JRiver and recommends this over OS X due to the dedicated Windows driver Chord makes available. You can install Windows on an Apple computer using Bootcamp.

dayjay posted:

In prefered audio device I have one option which is 'Hugo'.  Based on the coloured lights on my Hugo I get what I send as far as I can see.  Am I missing something, or is this a TT problem?  I use integer mode 1 but will try 2 based on what you have said.

What is the bit depth? 32 bit or 16 bit? Are you connecting using the HD USD port?

Halloween Man posted:

I'm using El Capitan. Yes, the V1 does not have this problem.

The TT in OS X is driverless but OS X only recognises the device as 32 bit only. If you look in Applications > Utilities > Audio Midi Setup you'll see it there. I did ask the developer of Audirvana in another forum and he confirmed 16 bit files will be converted to 32 bit before hitting the DAC due to TTs Audio Midi Setup.

Very intersting.   As long you are happy with the SQ.  

Halloween Man posted:

dayjay posted:

In prefered audio device I have one option which is 'Hugo'.  Based on the coloured lights on my Hugo I get what I send as far as I can see.  Am I missing something, or is this a TT problem?  I use integer mode 1 but will try 2 based on what you have said.

What is the bit depth? 32 bit or 16 bit? Are you connecting using the HD USD port?

Yes, I'm connecting through the HD USB port.  Where does A+ report bit depth?  On the now playing on the app and on the IPad it shows 16 bit

If you look in Applications > Utilities > Audio Midi Setup you'll see Hugo bit depth capabilities listed there.

You can see DAC and file bit depth on the A+ remote playing display.

If you run Audirvana in iTunes integrated mode technical information is given at the bottom of the LCD screen:

-  On the left: Playing track file type, and native bit depth and sample rate

-  On the right: The DAC current bit depth and sample rate

I don't run in Ituns integrated mode.  To be honest I don't really care too much.  It sounds good and that's all that matters to me really.  Just ask out of interest really

I've just been subjectively comparing Integer Modes 1 & 2 for an hour or two

On 2 most tracks seem a little more integrated or coherent musically and un-fatiguing , with 1 things are a little brighter and each instrument seems a little more distinct

depends what you prefer I suppose

that was pretty much my conclusion, both actually sound very good. in blind testing i did pick out the right mode four out of five times if that means anything. my wife got bored after the fifth time 

i'll probably stick to mode 2.

Has anyone compared latest version of JRiver to Audirvana on OS X?

I also checked Audirvana+ and Audio Midi Settings, but only see 2ch 24bit integer. There is no option to make it 32bit.

What DAC are you using, the setting is DAC dependant

I am just playing around with the Mac Mini & Gustard U12.