Size matters? (Fun is the one thing that money can buy?)

Morning Max,

Your thread will generate a lot of words. A Rega Planar3, Nait 2 and Linn Kans (or your n-Sats) playing one of your Firehouse Five Plus Two records will provide a succinct reply!

Best, C.

Ciao Chris,

thanks for your reply. I replay my FF+2 LPs on Pioneer PL112D, Pioneer SA-7300 and AR4x (one of which has a slightly defective tweeter) – more or less the system I had in 1975. It provides a partial reply, indeed! As I have told you, there has never been a single bad day that some FF+2 couldn't somehow turn into a smile and lighter heart; but that has to do with nostalgia, and the fact that the music is great, and my current low expectations about that system's qualities.

So, if you're right, are we all wasting our time, mental energy and money on a lot of useless, overpowered, overpriced electronics? Or is it only my problem?

;-)

M

It's my problem too. And quite possibly for several others. It's complicated. I look forward to seeing how others resolve it...

Chris

BTW, when I left the home where I had the aforementioned system, it had slightly (?) changed: Thorens TD147, SA-7300 and Linn Kan Is. In the next home – which was my first single's apartment – I had rega Planar 3, Nait, Linn Kan Is... And the 'fun' had already begun to leave place to something else. Today that something else has reached a very different status – and has taken much of my money, mental energy and peace of mind – and here I am, asking all you guys what your idea of fun is: partly trying to explain while some have it, some have not.

In 1990 we had a home demo of Naim amplification to use between my Linn  Sondek and Celestion Ditton speakers . It was the Nait 2 vs the Naim 62/140. Frankly the Nait 2 sounded better than the 62/140. It was not until the Hicap was added that the 62/140 sounded better than the Nait 2. I think the Nait 2 and Sondek is a wonderful combination and a great "man cave" system. The Nait 2 is a supreme example of the Naim sound. Just match it with appropriate speakers and you are in audio nirvana.

Kiwi,

thanks. This tells more on the Nait2 than is a reply to my basic question: What is fun?, but seems to confirm what many think of the Nait2. Your remark that the HiCap made 62/140 sound better than the Nait (this shifts the topic from 'what is fun' to 'what is better, though) seems to reinforce the idea of a bigger amp outperforming the smaller one..

The fun is first choosing the path and then walking the path; choosing the music, then listening to the music; then choosing the next upgrade... ad infinitum.

As the Beatles sang 'Fun is the one thing that money can't buy'. (She's Leaving Home, Sgt. Pepper's Lonely Hearts Club Band).

Loki,

thanks, you've forgotten to add that it was Side One, Track Six...

Joking. Mine was a reference to that song, of course. And it was meant to wonder if fun can be bought by money after all, since it appears that a Nait 1 (1983, 13W) is enough to provide it.

Best

Max

Ultimately it us about having the confidence not to trust in the " bigger is better"  view of Naim amplifiers. My ultimate second system would  be a Rega 3 turntable with Linn Kans and a Nait 2 for " fun". It encapsulates musical enjoyment and it short circuits the bigger is better point of view.

As soon as you get away from the minimal system that "will do the job", whether it be it hi-fi, cars, SLR cameras or whatever, then it's mostly "willy waving" by middle-aged overweight balding men.........

As a balding middle aged man I completely agree!

Suzy,

Outraged!  I resemble that remark!

Photoshop my head on that body and you'd get someone I see when I look in the mirror 

Thank God he's not waving his willy!

Really good question. I hope I understand what it is you are specifically asking, if I am not, I apologize for my post. 

Ask yourself this question. If I  wasn't fortunate enough to be able to afford a Naim system, would that change how meaningful listening to music is?  I'll try to answer the best I can. I guess, no, actually I know, that at least in my case, I don't need to spend thousands of dollars on equipment to enjoy music, or the need of a powerful amp. To be completely honest, I can listen to a very poorly recorded Springsteen bootleg on a Sony portable CD player and be completely immersed in the music.

Then again, I will listen to an excellent recording on a Naim system and enjoy it just as much as the portable system.

Both are fun to me, both make me tap my feet,  I guess I'm lucky enough to be able to experience the difference between the two systems. And both are able to bring me to a place that only music has the magic to do.

Honestly, one is not better than the other in the really big scheme of things, one can technically be better or more advanced, but that really has nothing to do with how much you can enjoy music, because that's what it's all about really, just enjoying the way music makes us feel, don't be concerned with what system does what, just sit back and let music do to you what it does like nothing else can.

I'm all about having "fun" with my gear . Usually, during the winter months I mess around with different combinations of amps- it gives me great pleasure while the cold, dark , snowy weather passes in my part of the world. I have quite a few boxes which can be mixed and matched endlessly and several runs of Naca to make things a bit easier. It is great fun and I really enjoy it. The smaller amps can certainly entertain and stimulate some foot tapping. Naim made it easy back in the early days.

However, when serious playback is in order I always fall back to my main system. Size does matter. The bigger amps are at a different level imo. They are still "fun "  but offer much more insight into the music, you become part of the show not just a bystander. Thats how I feel about it anyway.

I could certainly live with a Nait 1/2 and some Kans and have a great time with it. The music provides the joy. I just get more of it with the bigger amps  .

ATB,

Mark

I discribe a music system as fun when it is lively and engaging but coloured, it probably needs to be relatively low cost to qualify too. The colouration is part of the price.

The NAP300 doesn't qualify on grounds of cost though the music played through it can be fun a system containing one is decidedly serious, unless you allow for the existance of "serious fun". 

"Fun" for me exists when you are immersed in what the music brings - not what it is being replayed on. This can be achieved from cheap systems through to the most expensive but neither end of the spectrum guarantees it.

Last week I posted about the unexpected joy and fun I'd had from my Muso Qb on a Friday evening with friends and family. On considering why in the context of your question, I would note the following as being contributing factors:

- as the volume went up the music did not become unlistenable by over bright tweeters, indeed the opposite happened - the treble became better!

- as the volume went up the bass really started to drive the music with emphasis, but more importantly had the power to provide the beat needed to compel dance. I would say that I think it was better than my main system in this respect, as clearly every part of the system was designed with intimate knowledge of the combined capability of the whole.

- I had no expectations of that level of performance being possible, so it was fun in that everyone was in awe of what it was capable of. Will this be repeated in the future? Probably not as the surprise element has gone, but the rest of the capability remains. A bit like driving a car which is faster than anything you've ever driven before - the fun is in readjusting expectations and performance parameters. When you've readjusted then you can only rediscover that initial thrill by going faster again. I think HiFi is a bit like that - hence some disillusionment setting in once you've grown accustomed to the amazing things your system can do.

- I had no concerns about the main system being damaged by volume or flailing arms and legs, so was relaxed about the volume and motion in the room. I was also relaxed about the Muso being damaged by volume as it was not going to cause too much heartbreak if it happened. This enabled the pleasure of great company all enjoying the same moment to be the paramount emotion

So those are my views on 'fun' in the context of music. Everyone's triggers for fun are different, but I'd guess for most people a lot of it revolves around power and surprise coupled with the unquantifiable reasons why certain pieces of music move us more than others.

Fun is one element I might look for from my system but it is not the only element.  I can get fun from a transistor radio, some of my most memorable music nights as a youngster with with a little radio and it was certainly fun, and so was my Qute but if it's only fun, for me, it isn't giving everything I want from my music.  I want accuracy too, and emotion, and I want to hear as much of what the musicians played as possible including the low and high notes and the interplay between musicians.  All of those things in balance, including fun, to the limit of my budget is what I am looking for.  Just fun is a little one dimensional even for a fat middle aged man oon his way to balding.  

A Nait1 or 2 is not just 'fun'. It is highly engaging, extremely emotive, and has the ability to retain the essence of a performance in a way that leaves little to be desired. 

Sometimes i miss my 122/150. the 252/300 which i now have is miles better, but the former was more fun because (?) it was not perfect. And for me it has also to do with getting older. In the âge of 18 or 20 i listend to music in another way, hard to describe, much deeper, with more intense. No hifi in the world can give me back this feeling . Christoph (by the way: i had a nait 2 this time )

gary yeowell posted:

A Nait1 or 2 is not just 'fun'. It is highly engaging, extremely emotive, and has the ability to capture the essence of a performance in a way that leaves little to be desired. 

What he said, musical, engaging, emotive.  That's what I want from a HiFi.

Massimo Bertola posted:

 

... ''Is the audio myth according to which smaller, less powerful amps frequently sound better than bigger, more powerful ones, true?'' 

 

In some ways I do believe that myth. Less components, less taxing of the power supply and easier implementation. I believe that things changed when the hifi industry started following the trend toward smaller and less efficient loudspeakers. People wanted smaller loudspeakers that can do bass and as a consequence the need for more powerful amplifiers.

What a waste in the name of a more friendly decor!

Fun In any sense lacks depth.  Frothy - although could mean that point when music has that lightness of flavour underpinned by something ephemeral 

gary yeowell posted:

"the ability to retain the essence of a performance in a way that leaves little to be desired."  And yet almost everyone on here who had one and raves about them desired something more and moved on to bigger and better things?  One can only assume that they are all waving their willies around