Dedicated "spur/ring main/radial circuit(?)" questions.........

Ideally the incoming mains tails and earth would be split and another board fitted for your Naim gear only. From there 10mm radials to your sockets. 

I had installed and use a simple extra ring circuit to its own fuse on the same mains box as everything else.
It is just standard 6mm mains wiring in a ring-circuit to a set of non-switched wall sockets near the HiFi.
I also put in a radial to try but preferred the ring in performance terms.

Whatever way you go, have a normal ring for the other electrical items in the HiFi room and just use the 'HiFi mains' for the HiFi equipments.

I tried more elaborate mains and found in the end keep it simple and dedicated works best - for me.

DB.

Thanks finkfan and DB. 

DB - with your set-up is the "dedicated" hifi ring still not susceptible to mains borne interference from the rest of the house, being off the same mains box? But then again at the end of the day everything in one manner or another is connected to the incoming supply so surely still in a way all connected to the same circuit? This is where it gets confusing for me.

I have just had a dedicated supply installed - on its own consumer unit with a separate tail to the meter. My amps still get transformer buzz when my wife's hairdryer is switched on!!

Another simple advice: make sure each of the 6 sockets you need are 'star-wired' to the main cable.

This means each socket has the same 'priority', rather than being connected in a sequence.

theres too many talk alot of rubbish  10mm for audio is tripe. and not required . Its not running a shower  2.5 or 4mm is the correct application

i am installing to my new apartment  3 wattgate duplex with 3 separate connection with their own hifi fuses and 2,5mm copper wires. 

Snake oil or not we will see.... or hear... 

I recently added a separate CU whilst extending the house . Tails split after the meter - one to feed main CU and one for the hifi 

32 amp fuses and 6mm cable. One radial spur to the lounge and one to the kitchen. Can't comment on any improvements as the work is ongoing and gear still boxed up ��

However did the same on a previous property and there was a notable improvement 

Ive actually tried 2.5, 6 and 10mm radials. 10mm was by far the best in terms of lifting the performance of my system. Its probably one of the best upgrades you will ever make. 

[@mention:50422349809511500] has had 10mm radials fitted and I felt it sounded better than the 6mm in his last place.  

6mm was a subtle improvement, but the 10mm radials,  was a Wow moment,  very very impressive 

So it's true 'size does matter'

Alan Willby posted:

I have just had a dedicated supply installed - on its own consumer unit with a separate tail to the meter. My amps still get transformer buzz when my wife's hairdryer is switched on!!

The hum notwithstanding, has it made any difference to the SQ?

I've yet to get my dedicated supply installed but having discussed it with my excellent but cynical old sparky, he says he doubts it will make any difference whatsoever, either to the hum or anything else, though he'll happily take my money and see if he's proved wrong.  For what it's going to cost I'll do it anyway....just in case.

markah posted:

Thanks finkfan and DB. 

DB - with your set-up is the "dedicated" hifi ring still not susceptible to mains borne interference from the rest of the house, being off the same mains box? But then again at the end of the day everything in one manner or another is connected to the incoming supply so surely still in a way all connected to the same circuit? This is where it gets confusing for me.

There has been a lot posted here on this topic and people have entrenched absolute views of what does and does not 'work'.

I came from the position of experiment and trial. I used to use my standard house mains and when I put in a separate ring circuit and a few radials to try, I preferred the musical performance from the ring  and found the radials a bit too lean and over-impressive in the bass and losing in cohesion compared to the ring. The 'HiFi ring' was far better than the house mains ring that had all sorts of stuff on it too - the noise floor noticeably dropped and there was a smoother more involving presentation that I liked.

I'd also avoid having all the boxes each running on their own long mains leads individually back to the house mains input box - it superficially seems a good idea, but I don't think it is. Keep the HiFi connections short between each box and the RF cross-section for pick-up is very small and I think it sounds better IMO.

It also happens to be a standard no-nonsense install for an engineer - just tell him you want a dedicated ring with its own trip of the highest rating and gauge of wire that will fit in a standard set of non-switched sockets - and only use the number only sockets you actually need: have them grouped together at the 'end' of the ring so that the links between the sockets are as short as possible. This keeps the mains interactions between the HiFi equipment supplies in a small circuit and does not open a big loop to RF ingress.  So the ring consists of equal runs to and from the cluster of wall sockets and run the out and return mains cable of the 'ring' side by side as it it were one radial circuit to keep the cross-section small. Some may say that is the same as a single radial with thicker gauge wire - essentially it is; it works for me with my Active system.

DB.

Thanks DB for the detailed reply - it gives me enough information to present to the electrician. Your solution seems rather simple compared to some others which is great and doesn't involve cutting live cables and splitting before the main CU as I have seen suggested on here before. As I mentioned in my opening post the fitting of new sockets is a requirement here not an upgrade so I would like to do the best job possible before I actually move into the house and I'm not too worried about any mess/upheaval (I'm lucky in that I have at least a couple of weeks once I get the keys to get all the jobs I want doing in the house before I physically move).

You will find that DB is in the minority here. Most people who have dedicated mains installed use a radial running from its own consumer unit, usually with 10mm square cable. That is what I have done and it works well. If I were you I would follow that approach. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

You will find that DB is in the minority here. Most people who have dedicated mains installed use a radial running from its own consumer unit, usually with 10mm square cable. That is what I have done and it works well. If I were you I would follow that approach. 

So is this where branching off before the main CU comes in?

It is. If you like I can send you a couple of pictures, but only if you want them!

Hungryhalibut posted:

It is. If you like I can send you a couple of pictures, but only if you want them!

Yes please, it may be helpful.

Adam Zielinski posted:

So it's true 'size does matter'

And diameter is more important than length!  

markah posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

You will find that DB is in the minority here. Most people who have dedicated mains installed use a radial running from its own consumer unit, usually with 10mm square cable. That is what I have done and it works well. If I were you I would follow that approach. 

So is this where branching off before the main CU comes in?

To your electrician splitting the main meter tails and adding a service connector block is an everyday job. Dont be put off by this.

A dedicated consumer unit for the hifi kit is the best option (ive tried both ways). If you have the opportunity to uprate the mains then I would "go the whole hog" for maximum musical improvement in my experience. Ive also installed the same mains upgrade for two friends systems and the same improvements were evident in their systems too. 

Mr Happy posted:

markah posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

You will find that DB is in the minority here. Most people who have dedicated mains installed use a radial running from its own consumer unit, usually with 10mm square cable. That is what I have done and it works well. If I were you I would follow that approach. 

So is this where branching off before the main CU comes in?

To your electrician splitting the main meter tails and adding a service connector block is an everyday job. Dont be put off by this.

A dedicated consumer unit for the hifi kit is the best option (ive tried both ways). If you have the opportunity to uprate the mains then I would "go the whole hog" for maximum musical improvement in my experience. Ive also installed the same mains upgrade for two friends systems and the same improvements were evident in their systems too. 

 

Thanks for your advice, Mr Happy.

So, briefly, "going the whole hog" would entail splitting the main meter tails, fitting a separate consumer unit for the 3 new hifi dedicated double sockets (MK unswitched?), and using 10mm square cable? What rating would the breaker be?

Mine are 32A, but some use 50A which 10mm can comfortably handle. The best consumer unit was the mem memera ad range, and I tried a couple of different makes to make sure. Its no longer called that now and im not sure what the equivalent is. 

When connecting the sockets to the individual radial circuits, join each of the earth terminals with a piece of earth cable to create star earthing. The MK logic unswitched sockets are best. Go for at least a 32mm deep pattress otherwise the 10mm wont fit behind the socket when its fitted to the pattress. 

Another consideration is the main service fuse. 100A is better than 60/80A. Often the supply company will upgrade this free of charge if your main meter tails are 25mm and their own incomming cable is sufficient. Your electrician may help advise you on this.

This may sound a bit mad to your electrician but it really is all worth it.

Mr Happy posted:

When connecting the sockets to the individual radial circuits,

Just to be clear, if I have 3 double unswitched sockets you are suggesting a separate radial circuit for each of them, it's not like you feed one socket and the other two "piggy-back" off it? Excuse my ignorance!

Thats correct, but I actually use a separate 10mm for each piece of kit. Overkill maybe, but it did sound noticeably better.