The Law of Increasing Return

To the torches and pitchforks!

Nah, there are other options out there. Naim doesn't have the only good engineers on the planet, and I doubt they're among the best at every price point and device type. For me, it isn't about that, it's about picking a reliable supplier whose philosophy and sound seem right to me. If you go another way, great! Horses for courses and all that. It's a big, wide world.

Solid Air posted:

For me, it isn't about that, it's about picking a reliable supplier whose philosophy and sound seem right to me.

'Like'

C.

Hi Mogul,

Glad you're enjoying your knew setup. Like you I left the 'true path', but feel that having been here for donkey's years that this is more my home than anywhere else; and I still have a reasonable percentage of Naim, although mainly used for AV.

One of the main advantages for sticking with a manufacturer is that, hopefully, they have coped with a lot of issues, such as EMI/RFI, jitter, grounding loops et al. Having bought more disparate equipment you are far more 'on your own'. I say this in a very heartfelt way as having bought a microRendu, and initially loved the changes I became aware of elements I didn't enjoy and it took me two months to finally sort it.

In moving from Naim to another major manufacturer you will hopefully benefit from their attention to detail; although I suspect the camaraderie may be somewhat less? I find myself not posting much in the HiFi section as I don't feel my experiences bring much to the table for Naimites.  But, I do enjoy following some of the conversations.

I wonder if in praising the Esoteric system you have found that your own tastes may have subtly moved? As mine did with Class A; I enjoyed CB, which I still own, disliked Olive, enjoyed classic - but by then I had discovered Class A (SS and valve).

I do appreciate how much more liberal Naim is in allowing other makes to be discussed here; interesting contrast to most other manufacturer sites!

M

Mr Underhill posted:

Hi Mogul,

Glad you're enjoying your knew setup. Like you I left the 'true path', but feel that having been here for donkey's years that this is more my home than anywhere else; and I still have a reasonable percentage of Naim, although mainly used for AV.

One of the main advantages for sticking with a manufacturer is that, hopefully, they have coped with a lot of issues, such as EMI/RFI, jitter, grounding loops et al. Having bought more disparate equipment you are far more 'on your own'. I say this in a very heartfelt way as having bought a microRendu, and initially loved the changes I became aware of elements I didn't enjoy and it took me two months to finally sort it.

In moving from Naim to another major manufacturer you will hopefully benefit from their attention to detail; although I suspect the camaraderie may be somewhat less? I find myself not posting much in the HiFi section as I don't feel my experiences bring much to the table for Naimites.  But, I do enjoy following some of the conversations.

I wonder if in praising the Esoteric system you have found that your own tastes may have subtly moved? As mine did with Class A; I enjoyed CB, which I still own, disliked Olive, enjoyed classic - but by then I had discovered Class A (SS and valve).

I do appreciate how much more liberal Naim is in allowing other makes to be discussed here; interesting contrast to most other manufacturer sites!

M

 

When I first learnt about hifi and set up my first system, a primary benefit with "separates" was the ability to mix 'n' match, with a lot of effort at that time on standardised amp sensitivities etc. i have maintained that approach throughout - use the best source for the money, with the best amps for the money with the best speakers for the money ... the difficulty of course is deciding which is best, and what is the appropriate sum of money - and there is the undefined concept of synergy, where things work well together for no clearly defined reason.

I don't know,  but Naimites genuinely don't think they are better than others in a Hi-Fi possession sense.   All the chatter about less Hi-Fi and more music within this forum can exclude talk about Hi-Fi in general,   but it makes sense.    Talk about Hi-Fi in general is a bit lean - excluding the usual suspects...

some experience of other kit should really be welcomed. Different perspectives on the same goal. We should all rise above the parapet.

I think I have become more discerning which I suppose encourages tastes to move. But that's not in the sense of what type of electronics to use. It's more about the music. If it sounds better, it is (at least to me). 

I'm pretty sure that the set up that I was listening too before (555/552/300) would satisfy my tastes too!

mogul posted:

the Verity speakers were not optimized.

Quite a valid conclusion in general hi-fi speak, but here on the Naim forum the "source first" tenet has long reigned supreme. On the other hand why shouldn't quality speakers, the end of the listening chain, which ultimately reveal everything else upstream be considered a lesser consideration in building a system?

I've had a half dozen speakers home lately and each reveals a different character in my system. I'll readily admit that my system may be "source limited" on paper, yet I've found that the more revealing the speakers the better my system plays, providing the speakers deliver a high degree of musicality and "work" in my room.

A backward approach here I realize, but if you've found highly musical speakers that interact well in your room, why not optimize a system around them?

Mr Underhill posted:

Hi Mogul

In moving from Naim to another major manufacturer you will hopefully benefit from their attention to detail; although I suspect the camaraderie may be somewhat less? I find myself not posting much in the HiFi section as I don't feel my experiences bring much to the table for Naimites.  But, I do enjoy following some of the conversations

Concur with you Mr Underhill.

Just like you I rarely post in HIFI corner as most people here use Naim amps.

I have been running a Nagra PLL Preamp into a Dartzeel NHB 108 Poweramp into Quad 2805 electrostatics with a Nagra CDP and a  Naim NAT 01 as sources.The synergy with the amps is fantastic.Holographic imaging.Timbre of instruments .The only thing I ve changed are the valves in the PLL (ECC 83 & 81' s) with some Psvanes.

At the end of the day theres loads of great HiFi companies out there everyone has their own angle on design and sonic signature.I suppose it's about the synergy at the end of the day in your system to your ears.

Source first has worked well for me. It took many years to get to the 555 and now the Esoteric cdp/dac. The excellent dac in the Esoteric is doing a fine job with hi-def music from Tidal and my cd collection is alive.