UnitiServe downloads folder backup

Richard Morris posted:

Having setup a US backup on a Synology - following the Naim instructions, including the creation of a downloads folder - I belatedly realised that downloads are not being backed up.

I find it quite incredible that neither the setup instructions or the US manual think this is worth mentioning - but this is not, as I'm also belatedly realising, untypical of Naim customer service.

Anyway - two questions.

Firstly I've seen the software backup recommendations (CCC and freefilesync) on other (closed) threads. Are there any others?

Secondly the Synology setup instructions tell me to setup the Downloads folder as a 'shared folder' using n-Serve. I've tried to do this but the path is not recognised and I get an incomprehensible message about Host name, IP address and Share. So, is there any point in doing this? And any advice about what the path should be? I've tried ip address/server name/folder name.

Naim take the view that you don't need to backup the downloads folder as these are all already backed up elsewhere. Many have complained about this, to no effect.  I rather think the new Core is the same.

Anyway to be more helpful, I suggest you give Naim customer support a ring after the public holiday. Phil is an expert on Unitiserve and Synology, amongst lots of other things.

best

David

When I had a UnitiServe with a Synology backup, I simply put the download into the Serve's downloads folder, and a second copy into a folder on the Synology. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

When I had a UnitiServe with a Synology backup, I simply put the download into the Serve's downloads folder, and a second copy into a folder on the Synology. 

Exactly what I do. Simple. Some mention of the need for this in the manual would have been sensible, but I guess it's a bit late for that now!

Don't forget to keep a separate off-line copy for all the music, especially downloads.

A good quality external USB drive will be ideal for that.

Adam Zielinski posted:

Don't forget to keep a separate off-line copy for all the music, especially downloads.

A good quality external USB drive will be ideal for that.

Why are you so pessimistic, Adam? 

Richard Morris posted:

 

Secondly the Synology setup instructions tell me to setup the Downloads folder as a 'shared folder' using n-Serve. I've tried to do this but the path is not recognised and I get an incomprehensible message about Host name, IP address and Share. So, is there any point in doing this? And any advice about what the path should be? I've tried ip address/server name/folder name.

This part confuses me.  "Downloads" is a folder on the UnitiServe's hard drive and is created/set up there by the UnitiServe's operating system.  You need, can and should do nothing to it, other than add music to it and copy it to back it up.

Sorry - not clear. Naim advise you to set up a folder called NaimDownloads on your NAS and make it shared. A not unreasonable assumption would be that downloads are backed up to it using n-Serve - but no.

Any backup of downloads has to be done manually, using different software.

ChrisSU posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

Don't forget to keep a separate off-line copy for all the music, especially downloads.

A good quality external USB drive will be ideal for that.

Why are you so pessimistic, Adam? 

More 'realistic' - each hard drive will fail and I have too many downloaded album to loose. I still keep my CDs so that's relatively easy to restore. With downloads there is no physical copy.... 

Richard Morris posted:

Sorry - not clear. Naim advise you to set up a folder called NaimDownloads on your NAS and make it shared. A not unreasonable assumption would be that downloads are backed up to it using n-Serve - but no.

Any backup of downloads has to be done manually, using different software.

Correct!

Do you have the UnitiServe set up to do automatic backups of its rips to the Synology?  That is a challenge as well, but once it is set up right, it works well! (But not for the Downloads folder as we all know.)

Bart posted:

Richard Morris posted:

Sorry - not clear. Naim advise you to set up a folder called NaimDownloads on your NAS and make it shared. A not unreasonable assumption would be that downloads are backed up to it using n-Serve - but no.

Any backup of downloads has to be done manually, using different software.

Correct!

Do you have the UnitiServe set up to do automatic backups of its rips to the Synology?  That is a challenge as well, but once it is set up right, it works well! (But not for the Downloads folder as we all know.)

Yes, I do but as I haven't bought a cd in about three years, there's nothing new to back up.

A shame that Naim haven't responded to the increasing popularity of downloads by adding this obvious functionality.

Further to this I've backed up all my downloads to the NaimDownloads folder on my NAS, using Carbon Copy Cloner.

Something peculiar though - the 'Newest' screen on n-Serve and the Newest CDs screen on the app both show those backed up downloads. Why would this be?

Sounds like you have nominated the NAS downloads folder as a network share for the Unitiserve.

Good idea. I see that it is listed in the shares - although when I tried to add it - see above - the attempt was rejected.

I'm unclear about the benefits or otherwise of the NaimDownloads backup being a network share. What does it add? Can I change the setting to Active=No with no problems?

Yes - you can. Although if I recall a Backup folder should have a special designation. 

I will have a look in the white paper...

Richard - when configuring folders with a UnitiServe they should be set as:

* NaimRips = store

* NaimBackup = backup location

* NaimDownloads = shared folder

Adam

Thanks Adam , I've seen that in the Synology Setup document.

My question is  - why? What benefits do I get from having NaimDownloads as a shared folder?

Richard Morris posted:

Thanks Adam , I've seen that in the Synology Setup document.

My question is  - why? What benefits do I get from having NaimDownloads as a shared folder?

It's the folder that you can modify as you see fit by adding files manually. That is a feature of Shares.

But I can already do that with the Downloads folder on the US.

The backup folder is intended for the US automated backups, and you only want one of those on the NAS. The downloads backup is just another folder on the NAS. I don't know how Carbon Copy Cloner works, but I can't see any reason to give the downloads backup any sort of music store status on the US.

I also don't see the need for an automated backup of the downloads folder at all. When you put downloads (or any other music that's not a CD rip) on the US it's a manual copy process, and it's a simple matter to copy the music to two locations (US and backup NAS) instead of one. 

Richard Morris posted:

But I can already do that with the Downloads folder on the US.

True. The primary function in this case is when your internal US storage runs out, you simply create another SHARE folder on your NAS. UnitiServe will then automatically scan the network and if it detects another SHARE it will add it to its database.

The same goes for STORE - once the internal drive is full, you simply create a new RIP (STORE) folder on a NAS and 'direct' all future rips to that new STORE.

Thanks for the replies. Very helpful.

The naim downloads folder was created in the firmware when it was not possible to have a download folder on the internal disk drives in the servers. That came with the 2 tb version. For older hardware you need to  have a share to put downloaded music in,or use a usb stick.

At some time Naim decided to stick to a server like the core with minimal functions compared to the  old servers, and development on the old platform stopped. The servers came years before the streamers and the extra features like internet radio and access to music shares and backup was not in the firmware the first few years. As soon as the streamers was introduced I believe this way of thinking makes sense, but it makes an hdx a very very expensive server, but fortunately with the extra features. 

Claus

So it seems like the Synology set-up instructions have not been altered since the 2TB version was released.

I may be being naive but given that I already store my Downloads on my MAC as well as the Unitiserve, I see little to be gained in storing them on the NAS as well. If the Unitiserve fails I can simply restore them to the repaired Unitiserve from the MAC and if the MAC fails they are still on the Unitiserve. The NAS is there for the CD rips which I have no intention of doing again if I can help it. The only nightmare scenario I suppose would be a lightning strike but as this would likely take out the NAS as well then I have had it all ways.

What I have done is copied my Download files to Documents on the MAC which then automatically saves them to iCloud so in the event of an absolute disaster I will still have them. This costs £2.49 a month but is probably worth it for the piece of mind.

Camlan posted:

I may be being naive but given that I already store my Downloads on my MAC as well as the Unitiserve, I see little to be gained in storing them on the NAS as well. If the Unitiserve fails I can simply restore them to the repaired Unitiserve from the MAC and if the MAC fails they are still on the Unitiserve. The NAS is there for the CD rips which I have no intention of doing again if I can help it. The only nightmare scenario I suppose would be a lightning strike but as this would likely take out the NAS as well then I have had it all ways.

What I have done is copied my Download files to Documents on the MAC which then automatically saves them to iCloud so in the event of an absolute disaster I will still have them. This costs £2.49 a month but is probably worth it for the piece of mind.

I would still advocate a separate off-line copy for all your music, on a single USB drive (say, WD 2TB). Keep it unplugged and hidden away.