Whether 'tis nobler in the mind to... run a DAC with volume controllable line level output direct into a power amp, or to use in the conventional way through a preamp. (In this context, nobler of course means better sounding.)
On various threads people have mentioned running certain DACs direct into a power amp, without using a preamp - most notably Hugo, Hugo TT and Dave. If there are no analogue sources, the theoretical advantages of direct feed include simpler, less costly system and less electronics in the signal path potentially degrading the sound, vs those of using a preamp, which can vary from model to model but may include imposing a (presumably desired) sound character of the preamp (emphasis or shaping?), secondary (e.g. tape) outputs and possibly other controls like balance. I haven't included stability as these Chord DACs do include filtering of high frequencies (above something like 50 or 60 kHz IIRC), and have an output impedance and capability that is happy with all normal ranges of power amp.
So the question is, to use a preamp or not to use a preamp? Several people recently have described their preference after trying, but it would be interesting to have a wider indication of views, covering hopefully many different power (and pre) amps, and with different DACs, so I invite anyone who has done that, or is in a position just to rewire things for a little while and so test where they have not already done so, to record their findings.
For my part, for a couple of years I happily used Hugo direct into a Musical Fidelity P270 power amp, which was marginally better sounding than through a TagMcLaren PA10 preamp, though it it is too long ago to recall any details regarding differences the differences.
I am now using Dave direct to Bryston 4Bsst power amp, but to date I haven't compared with using a preamp - I shall do that some time in the next week or two and post
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by Innocent Bystander
The aforementioned TagMcLaren, though I could also try my old MF Preamp 2A, which now serves duty as a switchover preamp for analogue sources (for musical instrument use).
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by No quarter
IB,this is a slightly different scenario,but for a while I was using my N 272 digital out feeding directly into my Dynaudio xd 600's(active),which keep things all digital directly to The drivers.Very simple setup which sounded really good,yet I bought the xd's for my home theatre,so I moved them there after a couple of months enjoying them in 2 channel.I also have a Hugo,and wonder if it is possible to feed the Hugo from the 272 digital out,then from the Hugo into my 250 dr?Not really eliminating the pre-amp this way though,unfortunately I don't have an rca to xlr cable to try it.
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by ChrisSU
IB,this is a slightly different scenario,but for a while I was using my N 272 digital out feeding directly into my Dynaudio xd 600's(active),which keep things all digital directly to The drivers.Very simple setup which sounded really good,yet I bought the xd's for my home theatre,so I moved them there after a couple of months enjoying them in 2 channel.I also have a Hugo,and wonder if it is possible to feed the Hugo from the 272 digital out,then from the Hugo into my 250 dr?Not really eliminating the pre-amp this way though,unfortunately I don't have an rca to xlr cable to try it.
Seems like a bit of a waste of a 272, but as you already have it, there's no harm in trying. As the 272 has an SPDIF out, it should work, and who knows, you might like it.
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by Innocent Bystander
IB,this is a slightly different scenario,but for a while I was using my N 272 digital out feeding directly into my Dynaudio xd 600's(active),which keep things all digital directly to The drivers.Very simple setup which sounded really good,yet I bought the xd's for my home theatre,so I moved them there after a couple of months enjoying them in 2 channel.I also have a Hugo,and wonder if it is possible to feed the Hugo from the 272 digital out,then from the Hugo into my 250 dr?Not really eliminating the pre-amp this way though,unfortunately I don't have an rca to xlr cable to try it.
As Chrissu suggests that would seem to build in a lot of redundancy, however if you can borrow a cable or find an inexpensive one there would be no harm trying - and if you preferred the sound you could then look for a renderer to replace the 272 and move it on (Trade it for a Core possibly if you are also thinking of a new store and it lives up to some expectations, or something radical like microRendu if you're into a bit of fiddly setting up, though the latter is unlikely to be possible to compare before commitment so a lot to take on trust)
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by No quarter
Before I take the plunge on a power supply for my N 272,let's say a 555 dr,would I be better off trading the 272 in on a core,then getting a Dave to feed directly into the 250 dr...I think the cost would be similar?
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by Innocent Bystander
Before I take the plunge on a power supply for my N 272,let's say a 555 dr,would I be better off trading the 272 in on a core,then getting a Dave to feed directly into the 250 dr...I think the cost would be similar?
Dave is a phenominal DAC, with a real wow factor, literally: when I first went to audition, my cellist son came with me: we started with my own Hugo through the system for a while to aclimatise to the different speakers and room, then changed to HugoTT: definitely better, and enjoyable, convincing me it was a serious contender for upgrading especially having regard for other refinements over Hugo. Then came Dave, which I wasn't seriously considering, but as I said to the dealer, I'd always wish I'd heard it if I didn't. Just a few bars into the first piece of music, my son sitting next to me uttered one sound, under his breath but I heard it: "wow!" And it simply blew us both away with its clarity and presentation. After that I had to include it as well as TT in a home evaluation, and while I was changing back and forth at home over a couple of weeks trying to decide if I would be happy staying with TT after hearing Dave (and being able to afford Dave), my wife called to me from the adjoining room after a few swaps: "that's the better one, why do you keep swapping?"
obviously it is a matter of what suits your ears and your system, but if it is affordable I'd say wahy not try it - if you do so at home you could first try just on the 272's digital out, though if you are considering the Core then even better to try with that (maybe as well): there's nothing to lose and everything to gain, while if you decide it isn't what you want you will at least Not then have any niggling thoughts that you could have gone that route.
Posted on: 12 January 2017 by No quarter
The problem for me though is it is hard to get a demo of the Dave,ideally I would get a 555dr AND a Dave to demo at the same time,but I can't see that happening,so I have to rely on what I read,until I get real serious about one or the other.
Posted on: 13 January 2017 by Innocent Bystander
That's great! Does it pour direct into a power amp, or is it better poured into a pre?
(Is it really a fruity sparkling wine packaged like 'pop'? I bet it's sweet to appeal to kids...)
Posted on: 13 January 2017 by Ardbeg10y
IB, if its about Alcohol, I'm very selfish. My Amps won't enjoy it.
This forum helps me to see things in Supermarkts I never noticed before. I bought Cirio tomatoes and now Hugo Sparkling Wine.
