Pre Amp?

Yes Stu you are making sense but the answer isn't that simple.  Whilst I am clearly of the view that the 282/HC is a "better" pre than the 272 the latter is still an excellent music maker and I wouldn't worry about it to be honest.  And if you added a separate pre the 272 would then just be doing streaming duties which makes it a bit redundant.  Just buy more records.

Incidentally what spec is your LP12 and what phonostage are you using?

Regards,

Lindsay

That's what I am thinking too.  Push the funds toward a Radikal PSU for my deck and buy more records. 

Just wondering if I was missing anything. 

Stu. 

I am using a Black Cube phono. The new one with separate power supply. 

If you want to know what you're missing, ask your dealer to set up a demo of an NDX/202 or NDX/282, and compare them to the 272/XPS. As a digital source, I preferred  both of the NDX systems above (without XPS) to the 272 (with XPS) although they were all good. Obviously you will want to do the demo with your LP12 as well as the streamers. Then you'll know exactly what you're missing.

By the way, what is your phono stage? Is there any scope for improving this, or your LP12 setup in general?

Edit - just seen your post about the phono stage. Not heard it, but maybe worth looking at this too??

I don't know much about Linn, but isn't there a built in phono stage that goes with the power supply, a Urika or something. Maybe you should look at that. 

Thanks and yes I am also looking at improving my LP12 spec. Hercules to Radikal and I had considered Urika but I would need to hear it first.   

I have a very similar system and use a HiCAP DR and Superline on my Rega P9.  My vinyl is, by far, the best sounding music that comes out of the box (be it radio, streaming, etc..).   I would love to add a Supercap, but that is somewhere down the road.

Problem with either stages (superline or Urika) will mean a cart change too ... I think (dyn 10x5). 

Stu. 

It's moving coil, correct?  Shouldn't be an issue, if so....though a better cart never hurts.

I would recommend Radikal and a Urika for your LP12 - not much holds this combo back....

Upgrading from the DYNA 20X2 to the Apheta was like taking the cap off the pen!  Then from the Apheta to the Apheta 2 was like putting ink in said pen.....

Wm. posted:

Upgrading from the DYNA 20X2 to the Apheta was like taking the cap off the pen!  Then from the Apheta to the Apheta 2 was like putting ink in said pen.....

And Aphelion is like actually using that pen.

But silly money through a 272, he need a better preamp (and a separate streamer for that kind of stuff)

If you're well into your vinyl the 272 will be the weak link. You'd be better off with a separate preamp. I had my deck running through a SU and 300DR and putting a 252 i place of the SU brought huge gains. I know the 272 is better than the SU but you get the idea.

I had a similar set up (N272+XPDR+Linn LP12 with a Hercules PS) - over time I have upgraded to the current setup of LP12 + EKOS + Tramp2 + Khan Top plate (From Tiger Paw)  + Lingo + Kore + DYNA X20X2 + DYNA P75

In my set up, my feeling is that the limiting items are now the DYNA 20X2 and DYNA P75 combo.

STU22 - I think in your case the limiting items are the Hercules PS, moving to a Radikal will give you a major improvement. But also upgrading the Black Cube and your cartridge will also add improvement...

By as one poster highlighted ... at some point you need to consider if it's the N272 that is the limiting factor - I think my set up is nearing that limit - although I did hear a Radikal LP12 through a N272 is the improvement were still there to clearly hear...with your setup I think you still have some potential improvement you could do to you LP12 that is still worth while with your existing N272  

There is a sort of obvious option - I think. Add a Naim Stageline (N) - which you would need if you later go to a 282 - to replace you exiting Phono stage. 

https://www.naimaudio.com/product/stageline

The MM or 'N' Stageline will work just fine with your DV10X5.

fernar posted:

I had a similar set up (N272+XPDR+Linn LP12 with a Hercules PS) - over time I have upgraded to the current setup of LP12 + EKOS + Tramp2 + Khan Top plate (From Tiger Paw)  + Lingo + Kore + DYNA X20X2 + DYNA P75

In my set up, my feeling is that the limiting items are now the DYNA 20X2 and DYNA P75 combo.

STU22 - I think in your case the limiting items are the Hercules PS, moving to a Radikal will give you a major improvement. But also upgrading the Black Cube and your cartridge will also add improvement...

By as one poster highlighted ... at some point you need to consider if it's the N272 that is the limiting factor - I think my set up is nearing that limit - although I did hear a Radikal LP12 through a N272 is the improvement were still there to clearly hear...with your setup I think you still have some potential improvement you could do to you LP12 that is still worth while with your existing N272  

Yes, agree. My sense is that I still have a littke bit to play with in relation to the LP12 but at some point I will probably have to speprate the pre amp from the streamer. The trade of is more boxes which is the joy of the 272. 

One cant have everything eh!!

Stu. 

b_lund posted:

But silly money through a 272, he need a better preamp (and a separate streamer for that kind of stuff)

 

Yes and that would be my worry. If I moved to Radikal and Urika I will be running a 10k source through the 272. Not sure the 272 could handle that? 

With a 10K LP12 - I would suggest that you are looking at N252 and above territory and the associated power amp + speaker upgrades...

...and if you going that route you also need to consider the Keel for your LP12... 

I have sort of decided to stay at the level of hifi I have at the moment and rather get more music...... and a new OLED TV since I believe that this technology has come of age...

Stu22 posted:

b_lund posted:

But silly money through a 272, he need a better preamp (and a separate streamer for that kind of stuff)

 

Yes and that would be my worry. If I moved to Radikal and Urika I will be running a 10k source through the 272. Not sure the 272 could handle that? 

Of course the 272 could 'handle' the Radikal/Urika combination. However, it might not let you hear the full benefit of that upgrade (although I am sure you will hear much of it). But if you accept the source first logic, then it will always make sense to upgrade the LP12. An obvious advantage of the Urika is that you don't need an extra shelf for the phono stage, nor another power supply. 

Stu22 posted:

b_lund posted:

But silly money through a 272, he need a better preamp (and a separate streamer for that kind of stuff)

 

Yes and that would be my worry. If I moved to Radikal and Urika I will be running a 10k source through the 272. Not sure the 272 could handle that? 

The 272 could handle it perfectly well. TBH as much as I prefer the 282 over the 272 if I had the latter I doubt I'd change until I could afford a 252 or 552 ��

And that's the crossroads I am at Strat.  

My ambition is 252, SC to match my 250dr but that's some way off.  But I am trying by my best to resist the urge to make intermediate jumps. Hence why perhaps a move to Radikal and possibly a Urika could be a good option for now (source first and all that). This route however means me changing carts too .... my cart is mc but needs a mm phono I think? 

Hicap DR'd 202 at least if you re into that game for vinyl. in this case much better and advisable  282 since you have 250DR

Especially with vinyl 272 is not advisable.

Good for streaming duties though, a but redundant especially the xps.  d say sell both and get 282 hicapDR but at a price. A cheaper solution for streaming would be ok if you re short of funds i think.

Ps - is the XPSDR redundant when playing vinyl? Does the external PSU not also improve the pre amp on the 272??? 

Stu. 

In the event of selling the 272 ,psu is redundant. I think you may source a good recent exdem 282 and hicapDR with No loss and some change you could direct towards streaming.

it was me I d move them asap to make both happy ie. someone may be into streaming more than you do, as you re a 282 guy not 272.