Labour ?

Caughting the young, hip and happening vote has historically been very difficult for middle-aged politicians: remember William Hague's flume ride/baseball cap wearing escapades at Alto Towers, Cameron chillaxing or how Blair's cool Britannia back-fired over time.

It seems that Jezza has somehow managed to pull it off. I can't stand Glasto or Corbyn but then again the little charade was not intended for me.

Ray

Whilst on my work travels today, I was listening to lDS standing in for Jeremy Vine, just like Ed Miliband last week, they both remained unbiased to their credit... 

The Subject of the Conservatives finding a couple of billion down the back of the sofa for the UDP was somewhat amusing.... It compared extremely well with JC and his money tree...

You can't help but conclude, all the parties are equally as bad as each other ....

Well that's the point Wenger.   No fiscal responsibility at all - amongst any of them. 

At first blush it's completely unsurprising that the opposition parties have labelled this a grubby deal. The Conservatives would have lambasted it too, if they were in opposition.  But who can blame the DUP driving for more money for NI? And what was the alternative? Awaiting the Queen's Speech being voted down and then going for yet another election? I don't think TM really had much choice here but to pay the price set by the DUP and to try to form a workable government. Whether it will prove to be workable is another matter, of course. 

I am just in the process of checking my own sofa....i had previously checked my money tree, but nothing doing...

MDS posted:

At first blush it's completely unsurprising that the opposition parties have labelled this a grubby deal. The Conservatives would have lambasted it too, if they were in opposition.  But who can blame the DUP driving for more money for NI? And what was the alternative? Awaiting the Queen's Speech being voted down and then going for yet another election? I don't think TM really had much choice here but to pay the price set by the DUP and to try to form a workable government. Whether it will prove to be workable is another matter, of course. 

Labour would have done exactly the same, and of course they have attempted arrangements with DUP and SNP in the not to distant past...

I'm a bit confused by why this Con/DUP deal is being criticised.  Propositional Representation,   which most peeps agree is better/fairer than First Past the Post, will always have no one party with an overall majority & it will always require some form of cooperation agreement and/or coalition.   Its the way all of Europe with PR do it all the time.  

wenger2015 posted:

MDS posted:

At first blush it's completely unsurprising that the opposition parties have labelled this a grubby deal. The Conservatives would have lambasted it too, if they were in opposition.  But who can blame the DUP driving for more money for NI? And what was the alternative? Awaiting the Queen's Speech being voted down and then going for yet another election? I don't think TM really had much choice here but to pay the price set by the DUP and to try to form a workable government. Whether it will prove to be workable is another matter, of course. 

Labour would have done exactly the same, and of course they have attempted arrangements with DUP and SNP in the not to distant past...

Yep. Politics is essentially about being as flexible and pragmatic as is necessary to obtain/retain power. All the fine words about principles and policies are there simply to mask that. 

Mike-B posted:

I'm a bit confused by why this Con/DUP deal is being criticised.  Propositional Representation,   which most peeps agree is better/fairer than First Past the Post, will always have no one party with an overall majority & it will always require some form of cooperation agreement and/or coalition.   Its the way all of Europe with PR do it all the time.  

Personally i don't have any issue with the arrangement, if anything it works to keep the Tories in check, it may well lead to a little more loosening of the purse strings...

1bn bribe for the DUP, that’s the only thing that’s been costed in the Tory manifesto.

It’s actually cost more than 1bn, Theresa told Arlene she could take her pick of half a dozen handbags from her personal collection. That’s why finalising the deal took so long.

MDS posted:

wenger2015 posted:

MDS posted:

At first blush it's completely unsurprising that the opposition parties have labelled this a grubby deal. The Conservatives would have lambasted it too, if they were in opposition.  But who can blame the DUP driving for more money for NI? And what was the alternative? Awaiting the Queen's Speech being voted down and then going for yet another election? I don't think TM really had much choice here but to pay the price set by the DUP and to try to form a workable government. Whether it will prove to be workable is another matter, of course. 

Labour would have done exactly the same, and of course they have attempted arrangements with DUP and SNP in the not to distant past...

Yep. Politics is essentially about being as flexible and pragmatic as is necessary to obtain/retain power. All the fine words about principles and policies are there simply to mask that. 

 yes..nicely summarised

fatcat posted:

1bn bribe for the DUP, that’s the only thing that’s been costed in the Tory manifesto.

It’s actually cost more than 1bn, Theresa told Arlene she could take her pick of half a dozen handbags from her personal collection. That’s why finalising the deal took so long.

 

 

i assumed it was a couple of pairs of shoes as well..

What about the leather trousers?

The Strat (Fender) posted:

What about the leather trousers?

No way, it's handbags !

Just wait until Nicola Sturgeon and Ruth Davidson find out that Arlene has a new handbag, it'll be .......

....handbags at dawn !!

Don Atkinson posted:

The Strat (Fender) posted:

What about the leather trousers?

No way, it's handbags !

Just wait until Nicola Sturgeon and Ruth Davidson find out that Arlene has a new handbag, it'll be .......

....handbags at dawn !!

Which one will be on QVC first ???

Admiring her new watch.

Another of my D'oh moments  ... 'Propositional Representation'  ...  where is the spill chekkor when you need it.    But wait !!   A propositional function in logic, is a sentence expressed in a way that would assume the value of true or false, except that within the sentence is a variable (x) that is not defined or specified, which leaves the statement undetermined.    Sounds just perfect for politics.  

Lurve the big woman bag Arlene,  no girly designer May bag for you eh girl?    Shame the Swatch has busted, an omen perhaps.   

fatcat posted:

Admiring her new watch.

The very latest in digital time pieces the little hand is on 10 the big hand is on 1.5 billion !!!

bribary surely is a crime , not so in the commons

Resignations and Sackings, I thought that was all in the past for JC .....? 

wenger2015 posted:

Resignations and Sackings, I thought that was all in the past for JC .....? 

Surely its correct that the front bench represents and votes for party policy?

Eloise posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Resignations and Sackings, I thought that was all in the past for JC .....? 

Surely its correct that the front bench represents and votes for party policy?

I agree, it can't be that difficult to back party policy, so why rock the boat.

wenger2015 posted:

Eloise posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Resignations and Sackings, I thought that was all in the past for JC .....? 

Surely its correct that the front bench represents and votes for party policy?

I agree, it can't be that difficult to back party policy, so why rock the boat.

For some I believe them that it was a matter of conscious when presented with the amendment ... but I'm pretty such Chuka Umunna was deliberately trying to undermine JC and cause division.

Eloise posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Eloise posted:

wenger2015 posted:

Resignations and Sackings, I thought that was all in the past for JC .....? 

Surely its correct that the front bench represents and votes for party policy?

I agree, it can't be that difficult to back party policy, so why rock the boat.

For some I believe them that it was a matter of conscious when presented with the amendment ... but I'm pretty such Chuka Umunna was deliberately trying to undermine JC and cause division.

Let's hope.

After JC's surprising rise in popularity, reflected in his Nuremberg like appearance and posturing at Glasto, I feel he needs to be reigned in somewhat. He's starting to show he believes too firmly in his Messiah like properties and it's still the people behind and rising with him that worry me. Lots.

Mike-B posted:

I'm a bit confused by why this Con/DUP deal is being criticised.  Propositional Representation,   which most peeps agree is better/fairer than First Past the Post, will always have no one party with an overall majority & it will always require some form of cooperation agreement and/or coalition.   Its the way all of Europe with PR do it all the time.  

Because the job of opposition seems to be to oppose. And in Parliament this is often carried out through criticism.

I have long thought it better to do away with the 'Opposition' tag. It implies the other parties are there to fight whoever is in power on all counts, and while there is clearly a large amount of truth there, perhaps just referring to all as 'Parliamentarians' would be more appropriate. Who knows, this may lead to a calmer, less childlike approach within politics.