One stack of Fraimlite or two stacks of...?

Posted by: AI17 on 13 February 2017

This is my first post so please be gentle! 

I have followed the forum for a long time as I have gradually upgraded my Naim system and have learnt a lot from you all about how to set things up. I currently have my components on a single stack of Fraimlite. I noticed an improvement moving from an older glass and steel AV stand. Following advice from the forum I have also experimented with stacking order which has also improved things. Now I would like to optimise my system further and moving to two stacks separating brain and brawn seems to be the way to go.

The simplest thing would be to buy another Fraimlite base and move two shelves on to that but it would mean my interconnect would be on the floor if I had NDX & 252 on brain side.  Two stacks of full Fraim is too much right now. This has got me wondering about other options... 

I'd be very grateful for opinions on: 

1. A new base and moving to two low stacks of Fraimlite (would this be an improvement despite the I/C touching the floor?) 

2. Moving to two cheaper stands with bigger gaps between the shelves (Quadraspire? Isoblue?). I can't demo these where I live. If anyone has compared I would be grateful for opinions on whether this would likely be better or worse than one stack of Fraimlite with standard spacing.

3. Stick with one stack and add some full Fraim e.g. under the NDX/252. 

4. Something else?

System is: NDX, XPS-DR, 252, SC-DR, 250-DR, NACA5, ATC SCM19, powerlines, SL I/C

 

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by Allante93

1st off,  Welcome to the Forum.

2nd off, Nice System.

3rd off, do you have an end game.

The Forum will be more than happy to persuade you to 500 territory, 552/500.

Or, the 250DR, is nice but the 2 box 300, is miles ahead!

It's fun spending the OP's hard earned Cash!!!

I can see, you've been tuning in, Brains/Brawns.

It appears that you have 4-5 Black Boxes!

One rack should be sufficient, but that's the beauty of Naims Reference Rack (Fraim)!!!

Straight off the website:

"For entry-level Naim Audio systems, our FraimLite features the same tripod-style configuration, carefully optimised shelf spacing and high-quality material construction of our reference-quality Fraim.

It retains the cup-and-cone interface system used by its bigger brother too, but omits the dual layer base and ball-bearing decoupled glass shelf. Reference Fraim levels can be incorporated into the same system as FraimLite so that you can upgrade to our top of the range equipment support on a level-by-level basis.""

Just add some cups and balls!

So Start with one Rack, and if you do decide, add another later.

The important thing is spacing, standard, or two other heights.

With the Fraim Lite, being less expensive, Two wouldn't be a bad idea!

Who knows, down the road, Ndac, Cdx2, Maybe a TT!

As for the members, for the most part, a nice bunch!

Feed them my favorite line:

If you like it, I love it!

Or better yet, just ignore them.

In the meantime, enjoy your Music, the Why.

The how will, take care off itself, as long as you have the cash.

Oh, the exclamation is my trademark!

Allante93!           

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by hungryhalibut

It will depend to some extent on what your interconnect is. If it's a hiline it's not good to have it touching the floor. If it's a standard grey interconnect it's not so important, especially if you have a nice think carpet. You can always find a way of holding the wire up using thin thread. 

Using two racks is definitely a good idea. You can keep the burndies off the floor but adjusting the separation - ideally have the brawn on the right. This keeps the mains leads neat and tidy and makes sorting out the burndies easier. When I had Fraim I had a base plus four levels - that ensures the hiline that I then used did not touch the floor. 

Another option is to get medium length columns for your existing shelves. 

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by AI17

Thanks for the replies.

@hungryhalibut I have actually got an SL interconnect that I picked up ex demo which is why I am particularly concerned about it touching the floor (wood). I guess my questions boil down to a) whether I lose the advantage of two stacks if the interconnect ends up on the floor and b) if it is worth moving to two stacks if it's not Fraim/Fraimlite but with greater separation between levels. But perhaps I could find some way to lift the interconnect as you suggest - thanks for the advice.

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by hungryhalibut

For what it's worth I use Quadraspire SVT, which is a super rack. I'd take it over the Fraim Lite any day. Full Fraim is another matter. 

To me, a base plus two standard Fraim shelves looks far too low. But splitting the racks does make a very worthwhile difference. 

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by AI17

[@mention:4804681823084713] Thanks for your advice. The SVT was on my list of possibilities - good to hear it performs well. Could I ask one more question, which is how much difference the bronze upgrade spikes make? I see from the photos on the forum you added those. 

Posted on: 13 February 2017 by hungryhalibut

I've not tried it without them. I just bought them to keep the wires off the floor. And they are rather lovely. 

Posted on: 14 February 2017 by yeti42

The individual fraim components are available separately so a Friam Base and a spare set of balls and cups plus another glass will give you 2 full fat fraim shelves to play with using your existing uprights and you can also double the base shelf to give it some decoupling thus only wasting one Lite shelf. It also gives you a second set of floor spikes if you want to try 2 stacks.

Can't advise on the SL except to say I found it messed up the timing when touching the carpet though impressive otherwise but that was with CDX2/555ps and 282/sc/250-2, I haven't tried it since the 552/500 and my digital source is currently undecided pending auditions/developments.

Posted on: 14 February 2017 by AI17

[@mention:1566878603909035] Thanks for your ideas. I did wonder if 'fraiming' parts of my existing single stack would be a start. I've been experimenting a bit tonight with having the interconnect loosely tied in a loop which I would need to do to keep it off the floor if I moved to two lower stacks. I think it is better hanging loose but it's not a big difference. 

Posted on: 14 February 2017 by yeti42

I tried a loose loop when I tried the SL interconnect as it was,longer and limper than a Hiline, it was no improvement to trailing it on the floor. It did give me the idea once I had the hiline back in place to try looping the DIN/Canon lead between supercap and 250 to lift it off the floor. The loop disturbed the timing very slightly but enough to deminish the musical sense.

Posted on: 15 February 2017 by AI17

@yeti42 having listened again for a couple of hours this evening, I agree that looping/loosely tying the interconnect itself is clearly worse than hanging free. However, I experimented a bit more and a figure of eight arrangement with a cable tie in the middle to hold it seems to work well. A potential solution if I switch to two lower racks anyway.