Would I regret a NAP200 upgrade

This people think you should be looking at replacing the NAC 202 with a NAC 282 .. though, as you suspected, there will be a range of suggestions following this one.

Hi,

The normal route to upgrade is the pre-amp first which would say NAC 282.   I think if you took that route you'd retain the balance of your system but really open the door on the music and enhance the soundstage. 

But as with many things in life there is more than one way to skin the cat so I'd get into a good Naim dealer to talk through options. 

Good luck. 

Lindsay

I didn't take the usually advised route from 202/200 as I plonked a 250.2 in place of the 200. It worked ok with my IBLs but to be honest the 282 was the game changer. I didn't get the chance to hear 282/200 but I can easily believe that it would outperform 202/250, the 282 is that much better than the 202 (not that the 202 is bad)

With out question jump in for a 282 it's a peach of a pre amp ( In my option better than a 252 as a 252 is technically better but sonically lacks the toe tapping aspect of a 282 or 552 ) the 200 will be more than capable to show you the improvements all the way up source chain. I used my 200 with my 552DR as my 250 would overheat and switch off when I was running S600's it's a true powerhouse of a amplifier and keeps to the naim sound. 

A 282 and 200 has always been my favourite combination and when you put a supercap on the 282 you will really struggle to justify your following amplifier upgrade. 

Dingding posted:

In my option [a 282 is ] better than a 252 as a 252 is technically better but sonically lacks the toe tapping aspect of a 282 or 552.....

....

I used my 200 with my 552DR as my 250 would overheat and switch off when I was running S600's it's a true powerhouse of a amplifier and keeps to the naim sound.

Were your sources pukka with the NAC252?

You are very flattering about the NAP200, which like the NAC202 doesn't seem to get much love hearabouts.

Chris

Source is LP12 and NDS with 555DR, honesty other naim power amplifiers are technically superior more detail larger scale etc etc the 300 is voiced the same and simply stunning. However a 200 is so versatile and can be plonked in any system and just work. Only my opinion of course. ��

NJB posted:

I am using a Naim 202/200 combination with a Third Party PSU.  My source is a Bluesound Node 2 through a Chord Mojo, my speakers are Dynaudio Focus 160s.  It sounds balanced and the recent addition of the Mojo has given it something special.

However, I don't want to stand still and am looking at the next move.  I am expecting a range of suggestions but the next due change, based on the fact that it's the oldest unit, is the NAP200.  I have read comments that the Classic NAPs are voiced differently.  Moving up the range should add control but might upset the balance.  As a home audition is hard to arrange, what do people think?

I think you should keep and eventually get your Nap serviced.

I strongly advice you to get an Hicap DR.

At that point you would have sensibly improved your preamp (which is already very good) to even think of improving the streamer or else.

Buy the 250 only if you're planning to go either 282 or a much better streaming solution and new speakers.

How old is your 200? If you can squeeze another few years out of it, I would consider a 282 first, and second (or maybe first in terms of affordability) a Hicap. On the other hand, if the 200 needs a service, that will compromise everything, so either get it serviced, or break the rules, and upgrade it now.

Yeah it is not clear what you mean when you talk about the age of the 200. Why not try this:

• Get the 200 recapped and DRd to current spec.
• Test the DR power rails on the refurbished 200 against your 3rd party PSU. If the 200DR does a better job sling the third party PSU (or partner it with a Headline) and add a NAPSC to max out the 202's potential.

Finally enjoy for another 12 months and think about it after the changes have settled in the then decide whether you want to go to a 282. The above upgrades won't set you back much money and should provide some solid benefit (regardless of whether you keep the 3rd party PSU or not). In another 12 months you will have saved more to be able to make a more dramatic change if you want one and if that change is a 282, you will have a current 200 ready to show off the benefit of it (Naim sell 282 without NAPSC in case you already have one).

Also not clear whether a rack would be a suitable upgrade for your or not.

FZ, you can't have a DR upgrade on a 200, you'd need to sell it and buy a new one.

ChrisSU posted:

FZ, you can't have a DR upgrade on a 200, you'd need to sell it and buy a new one.

I did not know that. That is a real shame.

It all depends how far you'd like to go

Please remember that the key to any system's voicing comes from a pre-amp. This is where the actual sound is 'shaped'.

282 may be a good move.

Adam Zielinski posted:

It all depends how far you'd like to go

Please remember that the key to any system's voicing comes from a pre-amp. This is where the actual sound is 'shaped'.

282 may be a good move.

Some interesting answers, so here is something else to just confuse matters further. I have an old CB NAC62 from around 1992. It worked when I last powered it up, and I recall comments that Pre-Amps do not have serious issues with components ageing. I have never used the 62 with the NAP200. I understand that mixing CB and Black boxes is not an issue. So, is the 202 better than the 62?  I bet that question will polarise opinions!

You're in a better position than most to give an answer on that.

C.

Christopher_M posted:

You're in a better position than most to give an answer on that.

C.

True. But need to get the courage to power it up. Two things will assist my decision. Is there any risk of a capacitor letting go? If the 62 has no chance of besting the 202 then why risk it?

Hopefully a techie will emerge...

C.

NJB posted:

But need to get the courage to power it up. Two things will assist my decision. Is there any risk of a capacitor letting go? If the 62 has no chance of besting the 202 then why risk it?

Courage? Risk? Are you serious? WTF?

Yeah, keep the 62 on ice with your nutsack.

NJB posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

It all depends how far you'd like to go

Please remember that the key to any system's voicing comes from a pre-amp. This is where the actual sound is 'shaped'.

282 may be a good move.

Some interesting answers, so here is something else to just confuse matters further. I have an old CB NAC62 from around 1992. It worked when I last powered it up, and I recall comments that Pre-Amps do not have serious issues with components ageing. I have never used the 62 with the NAP200. I understand that mixing CB and Black boxes is not an issue. So, is the 202 better than the 62?  I bet that question will polarise opinions!

As it happens I'm now sitting in my office, listening to a recently serviced Olive 72 / HiCap / NAP 250... unless my memory is failing, I don't think there was any work done on the NAC - I did send all three boxes last autumn to Naim for servicing (well my dealer did) and the repair job-sheet only mentions HiCap and NAP.
Anyhow - the Olive sets stacks up really nicely to my resident black-boxes I like its raw approach to music playback.

Adam Zielinski posted:

NJB posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

It all depends how far you'd like to go

Please remember that the key to any system's voicing comes from a pre-amp. This is where the actual sound is 'shaped'.

282 may be a good move.

Some interesting answers, so here is something else to just confuse matters further. I have an old CB NAC62 from around 1992. It worked when I last powered it up, and I recall comments that Pre-Amps do not have serious issues with components ageing. I have never used the 62 with the NAP200. I understand that mixing CB and Black boxes is not an issue. So, is the 202 better than the 62?  I bet that question will polarise opinions!

As it happens I'm now sitting in my office, listening to a recently serviced Olive 72 / HiCap / NAP 250... unless my memory is failing, I don't think there was any work done on the NAC - I did send all three boxes last autumn to Naim for servicing (well my dealer did) and the repair job-sheet only mentions HiCap and NAP.
Anyhow - the Olive sets stacks up really nicely to my resident black-boxes I like its raw approach to music playback.

CB was always a bit more unruly and I know that some regarded the sound of the Black range as too safe. And, Joerand, when experimenting with my cherished HiFi then I am careful to check before doing something that has the potential to go wrong. It is the downside of working with aircraft avionics for 30 years....

NJB posted:

Adam Zielinski posted:

 

CB was always a bit more unruly and I know that some regarded the sound of the Black range as too safe.

A good friend and a forum member, has a beautiful CB 32.5 / HiCap / Nap 250 paired with Linn Kans - visceral is probably the best way to describe it I love it.
The classic range is also be fun, but it seems the hooligan has grown up a bit

NJB posted:

Christopher_M posted:

You're in a better position than most to give an answer on that.

C.

True. But need to get the courage to power it up. Two things will assist my decision. Is there any risk of a capacitor letting go? If the 62 has no chance of besting the 202 then why risk it?

Old power amps i always test on a spare pair of crappy speakers, just incase of problems.

Pre-amps don't worry 

I have just upgraded from a unitilite to a 202/200dr and NAPsc and it sounds brilliant. IMO upgrade to DR and a service and buy a NAPsc (or sell the 200 and look for an ex-dem 200dr). The NAPsc does make a big difference for little money

well once you go outside a Naim PSU, it may be better, or different, but isn't really a Naim amplifier anymore, and you are not getting the Naim sound.

I suggest you try your 202/200 bare, and invest in NAPSC.

I'm not sure why 202 doesn't get much love around these parts, but it is a pretty good preamp (I own 202 and 282).

282 is the level of preamp personally where I agree with one forum member, it is really with HCDR and 250DR so good, that - I don't care if 252/300 is better or 552/500 is better, it is already very good for me and I really enjoy it.

Now 202/200 with NAPSC, and HicapDR is also extremely good. I own both Dynaudio X16 and focus 260 so I know why you enjoy your setup.

My advice : buy NAPSC and try removing the alternative PSU (not because it is inferior, but it is different, and you need to hear the real Naim sound to judge for yourself).

Also a power line is a worthy addition to NAP 200

last, invest in a very good interconnect for Mojo and NAC 202. Naim used make a 3.5mm to DIN cable, so ask you dealer to ask Naim if they can supply one.

I went the Classic (excuse the pun) route from 202/200/old NAPSC and added a Hicap (non DR) and then swapped the 202/old NAPSC for a 282/current NAPSC, retaining the Hicap. The 282 is a (shall I use the abused superlative, why not) game changer. Such a move on from the 202. However others have made the point that as your 200 is old (how old?) you might want to get that recapped and serviced first - it won't cost a fortune to have this done and it will show a 282 in a better light. Although I now have a 250 DR, and it is such a move up from the 200, I still feel going for the upgraded preamp first makes most sense.

The only thing that is holding me back from fully recommending this route is that I am unfamiliar with your source (I went from NDX to NDS) and speakers. I have always erred towards the source first approach (then pre amp second). Which leads me to give you the usual (and rather boring) advice of trying some options out in your sytem at home. To narrow it down I would try out a 282 first (ideally with a HIcap and preferably a Hicap DR) and then try a NDX. Find a dealer who will indulge you, as most (if not all) Naim dealers will. Maybe a couple of experiments at the dealer might help you narrow down your options for a home demo.

Take your time, enjoy the journey and try to keep to a sensible budget (that last one is the trickiest).