David Hendon posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

If you remote mount the Music Store drive can you then see the files inside the Music Store or not ?

Interesting question. My Windows 7 laptop is always reluctant to look at stuff on the network and I found that typing the IP address into Windows explorer, as the Core support info tells you, just takes me to a black empty screen in my browser. I can't browse the Music and Doenloads folders as Naim describes as being possible.

However it was possible to map the downloads folder in the Core as a drive once I had realised that Uniti Core 12345 has the network name UnitiCore12345 ie no spaces.

Browsing this folder is really slow, compared with the Unitiserve for example. For example to go down one level takes about a minute in the Core and fractions of a second in the Unitiserve. I edited the name of artwork for one album and told the Core to rebuild its database, which took a while,  but it didn't pick up the artwork which it should have now recognised, so I suspect I am going to need to delete the relevant album in downloads and import it again. This is not a consumer-friendly product.

i have no idea whether you can browse the MQ folder. I don't need to do that, so I am not mapping that drive, but you can do that on a Unitiserve so I suspect that you can on a Core too.

best

David

Further to the above, the edits I made earlier this evening to two coverart filenames in the Downloads folder have been picked up by the Core now and the right album covers appear in the app. So since I got the Core to rebuild its database, it has susequently realised that these edits have happened and handled them correctly. It would be helpful to understand better how it does this. But the message may be that you shouldn't rush it and it may get round to doing what you want in an hour or so if left alone to itself...

best

David

As well as being able to stream music files to players on a network, the Uniti Core also has an internal renderer and can feed a DAC directly, with the significant advantage of avoiding streaming across  network, which does cause some people problems. I am less clear about the Unitiserve in this regard. The Core is still very new and information about its sound quality in this mode is still sketchy, however it has the benefit of being more modern, which in the fast-changing digital world could well mean significant improvement, and is said to have other benefits such as a very refined power supply.

Hungryhalibut posted:

But unless you use it direct to a Dac, or have thousands of CDs to rip, it seems a totally pointless thing. It baffles me why people are buying them, especially as nearly every post seems to be about something that doesn't work properly. But if people want to waste their money it's their business. And Naim can use the proceeds to invest in developing something genuinely useful. 

Maybe a bit harsh HH, but fair enough.

I replaced my UnitiServe with a Core serving an NDS. The big advantage of both in my setup is they can amalgamate a 16TB Synology Nas and a 6TB ReadyNas, plus a 5TB LaCie USB drive into one large music library.

A Naim streamer can only read and play from one Nas at a time, and can't have a large USB drive slung off the back. None of that matters of course if your entire music collection is on a single Nas.

As far as sonics go...to my listening the Core as a network server is a step up from the UnitiServe used the same way. In my system the Core brings greater dynamics and clarity.

I'm sure many will disagree that a Naim network server feeding a streamer can influence the sound, and that playing direct from a Nas with whatever UPnP server spins your wheels will be equal or better sounding, but I know my system and room very very well and that's how I'm hearing' it.

Cheers

Rick.

Wow, that's 27 TB of music. Or about 35,000 CDs. Give or take a 1,000. 

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

My suggestion would be not to go for it unless you are looking for an easy to use dedicated ripping solution (which it does really great !!!) with good back up facility and flexibility (and convenience) to manage your disks. I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

As a meta data manager, it has way to go to be closer to something like Roon or JRiver. I'm keeping my finger crossed for the firmware release due in mid March. But not expecting anything big.

As a UPnP player, it is good from SQ wise compared to a UPnP server running on NAS/Mac Mini (NAS/Mac Mini are not fully optimized for just playing music, neither they have the linear PS). But my experience of using Uniti Core so far with other UPnP streamer using 3rd party controller like MConnect, Connect 5 etc is not that great from stability and music search/exploration perspective. Unfortunately the Naim App does not support (neither they plan to) playing music from Uniti Core to non-Naim UPnP based streamer.

The SQ is great when you directly use SPDIF output of Uniti Core to any DAC supporting SPDIF.

Support for DSD is supposed to be a differentiating feature of Uniti Core which is not there in Uniti Serve. But in my opinion it is not properly implemented. Uniti Core converts DSD to PCM (not DoP or DSD over PCM) before sending DSD to its SPDIF output. Even for playing DSD through UPnP it does not support DoP, which, in my understanding, is the only way to play DSD through UPnP. Naim neither has a  plan right now implement DoP in future (based on the inputs I got from Naim's technical support).

Regards,

Sourav

Jan-Erik Nordoen posted:

Wow, that's 27 TB of music. Or about 35,000 CDs. Give or take a 1,000. 

Each drive is by no means anywhere near capacity. I have a reasonable amount of HD content and that sucks a lot of storage space. I used to have 3 2TB USB drives connected to the UnitiServe then added the 6TB Nas. The 3 USB drives became a pain when loading more music so bought the second larger Nas and scaled back the USB drives to one for ease of music loading and the fact the Core only has one USB socket on it's rear.

I've prioritised the 3 drives for ease of storage and sound quality. The USB drive connected to the Core contains a collection of albums that sonically I think are the best I have. This USB drive with a non SMPS into the Core sounds better than music over the network via the Nas drives. The smaller Nas contains only classical and the larger one has everything else.

I use a Netstreams NS-SW208 8-port managed switch with an IsoTek EV03 Premier mains cable. The Nas drives and switch are all plugged into an IsoTek EV03 Polaris mains strip. Ethernet cables are only Chord C-Stream as I run quite long lengths from both the Core and NDS to the switch. Shorter runs are used between the Nas drives and the switch.

Rick.

Sourav Mazumder posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

...

I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

...

Sorry to hear that. The dealer's behavior is not acceptable and certainly not in the interest of Naim.

I believe that, if you wanted to return the device, Naim would be open to offer you a fair deal.

I am not going to buy a Core at the moment but I am very much interested in what the March system update will bring. What is most needed is some clarity: at this point, it is very difficult to say which limitations and deficiencies are due to design choices and which are caused by mere implementational errors.

Ricky Dasler posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

...

...

As far as sonics go...to my listening the Core as a network server is a step up from the UnitiServe used the same way. In my system the Core brings greater dynamics and clarity.

I'm sure many will disagree that a Naim network server feeding a streamer can influence the sound, and that playing direct from a Nas with whatever UPnP server spins your wheels will be equal or better sounding, but I know my system and room very very well and that's how I'm hearing' it.

Interesting findings but also a bit worrying in my view! I know that the Naim DAC is quite sensitive to the quality of its SPDIF feed. But I was under the impression that, in a reasonably well working LAN, the NDS would be fairly source agnostic. Your results suggest that this is not the case. Have you connected the Core to the power and to the network using exactly the same sockets that were used for the NAS? If not, a robust test would be to switch the connection points of NAS and Core. This would give you certainty that the differences that you hear are differences between devices and not between connection points. Best, nbpf 

nbpf posted:

Ricky Dasler posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

...

...

As far as sonics go...to my listening the Core as a network server is a step up from the UnitiServe used the same way. In my system the Core brings greater dynamics and clarity.

I'm sure many will disagree that a Naim network server feeding a streamer can influence the sound, and that playing direct from a Nas with whatever UPnP server spins your wheels will be equal or better sounding, but I know my system and room very very well and that's how I'm hearing' it.

Interesting findings but also a bit worrying in my view! I know that the Naim DAC is quite sensitive to the quality of its SPDIF feed. But I was under the impression that, in a reasonably well working LAN, the NDS would be fairly source agnostic. Your results suggest that this is not the case. Have you connected the Core to the power and to the network using exactly the same sockets that were used for the NAS? If not, a robust test would be to switch the connection points of NAS and Core. This would give you certainty that the differences that you hear are differences between devices and not between connection points. Best, nbpf 

The Core and the rest of the system is all plugged into an IsoTek EV03 Sigmas. The Nas's and network switch are plugged into an IsoTek EV03 Polaris. I've not got enough sockets to connect the switch and Nas's to the same power as the main system. And besides, the NDS can only read from one Nas at a time. Not practical in my situation.

A powered USB drive (with a regulated power supply, not a SMPS) has been regarded as the best storage source for Naim servers down under here for a number of years. Hence why I used to have 3 of them connected to my UnitiServe. In comparison, the Nas stored music via the UnitServe AND the Core sounds flatter in dynamics. Similar in sonics to comparing an iTunes rip to a Naim server rip.

I'm not about to defend that claim on a technical level as I simply don't have the computer smarts to argue the toss on the level that other forumites here have the knowledge to do. I'm simply calling it as I hear it in my system. I've not compared an internal drive within the Core to the connected USB drive as yet.

Cheers

Rick.

To answer the OP question: "

What is the difference between unitserve and uniticore ?"

One is a product whose development path ceased in December 2014 and wont ever be restarted.

The other is a product whose development path is still happening. 

I haven't heard or used the Core yet and I won't consider buying one until it can allow users to edit metadata.

However, the impact it has on sound quality is interesting. I was told by Naim that the Core sounds better than the Unitiserve at the Bristol show last week. Also, my dealer has compared it to the Melco (not sure which one). Apparently, the Core was preferred as being more musical, although the Melco was more detailed. The differences were significant and were likened to the differences between cartridges.

Keith

nbpf posted:

Sourav Mazumder posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

...

I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

...

Sorry to hear that. The dealer's behavior is not acceptable and certainly not in the interest of Naim.

I believe that, if you wanted to return the device, Naim would be open to offer you a fair deal.

I am not going to buy a Core at the moment but I am very much interested in what the March system update will bring. What is most needed is some clarity: at this point, it is very difficult to say which limitations and deficiencies are due to design choices and which are caused by mere implementational errors.

Not sure I understand why you think the dealer's refusal to accept a return is unacceptable? Unless the Core is faulty, or unless the purchase contract stipulated a 'cooling off' period during which the item could be returned for a refund, surely it's a classic example of caveat emptor ? It also illustrates very neatly the dangers of being an early adopter - far safer, in my experience, to wait for first or second revision before parting with the cash.

There seem to be quite a few members of this forum who believe dealers have a duty to be philanthropic hand holders! They all, or nearly all, seek to offer a good service in anticipation of repeat custom, but first and foremost they're business men/women with a living to make.

Tim

Right so clearly it would be foolish to go for the unitiServe unless picked up a cheap second one, but doesn't sound like the UnitiCore is such a great idea either. I wouldn't want to purchase without fully understanding how it work but doesnt like it would be very easy to understand it without purchasing it !

The Core has only been available for a month or so and there are relatively few in the hands of forum members. Naim has a roadmap (or whatever they call it) of developments they intend to deliver, but we don't know the timetable.

i think it is a great product in the making but it's not there yet, especially if you listen to classical music because of the poor metadata handling. Only you can decide whether you believe Naim will sort it out and buy one now anyway or leave it for a few months to see what happens.

best

David

KRM posted:

However, the impact it has on sound quality is interesting. I was told by Naim that the Core sounds better than the Unitiserve at the Bristol show last week. Also, my dealer has compared it to the Melco (not sure which one). Apparently, the Core was preferred as being more musical, although the Melco was more detailed. The differences were significant and were likened to the differences between cartridges.

Interesting indeed. I am still hoping for if not expecting a lot from SSD in and/or through Core to outperform N1Z and Zenith on details just as well as on sheer musicality.

Chag -

Timmo1341 posted:

nbpf posted:

Sourav Mazumder posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

...

I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

...

Sorry to hear that. The dealer's behavior is not acceptable and certainly not in the interest of Naim.

I believe that, if you wanted to return the device, Naim would be open to offer you a fair deal.

I am not going to buy a Core at the moment but I am very much interested in what the March system update will bring. What is most needed is some clarity: at this point, it is very difficult to say which limitations and deficiencies are due to design choices and which are caused by mere implementational errors.

Not sure I understand why you think the dealer's refusal to accept a return is unacceptable? Unless the Core is faulty, or unless the purchase contract stipulated a 'cooling off' period during which the item could be returned for a refund, surely it's a classic example of caveat emptor ? It also illustrates very neatly the dangers of being an early adopter - far safer, in my experience, to wait for first or second revision before parting with the cash.

...

I think that the dealer refusal is unacceptable because two reasons: first because I would expect all Naim dealers to offer the same free return period. In many countries this by law two weeks. Thus, I would expect a dealer to accept a return within at least two weeks from the date of purchase. Second, because the Core does indeed seem to be faulty in many respects. Some basic functionalities have not yet been implemented or have been implemented with major flaws. Even assuming that upcoming system upgrades will readily solve the most severe issues, given things as they are now, it would be rather phony for a Naim dealer to argue that the Core is working according to specifications. I agree that, having bought a new product with incomplete specifications, early adopters have consciously decided to take risks for which they bear some responsibility. Still, Naim is well known for their fair dealing and I do not think that the dealer's refusal to accept a return within two weeks of purchase is, generally speaking, a sensible behavior. Of course, I do not know the details of the deal and there might be good reasons for the dealer's behavior. Best, nbpf

Don't sweat over it. I am sure it is just a matter of contacting Steve. He will sort it out in a heartbeat list like he always does. This being posted, if I were you, I would still contact Customer Support but hang on the Core a little bit longer and wait for the next update. 

Chag -

Ricky Dasler posted:

Hungryhalibut posted:

But unless you use it direct to a Dac, or have thousands of CDs to rip, it seems a totally pointless thing. It baffles me why people are buying them, especially as nearly every post seems to be about something that doesn't work properly. But if people want to waste their money it's their business. And Naim can use the proceeds to invest in developing something genuinely useful. 

Maybe a bit harsh HH, but fair enough.

I replaced my UnitiServe with a Core serving an NDS. The big advantage of both in my setup is they can amalgamate a 16TB Synology Nas and a 6TB ReadyNas, plus a 5TB LaCie USB drive into one large music library.

A Naim streamer can only read and play from one Nas at a time, and can't have a large USB drive slung off the back. None of that matters of course if your entire music collection is on a single Nas.

As far as sonics go...to my listening the Core as a network server is a step up from the UnitiServe used the same way. In my system the Core brings greater dynamics and clarity.

I'm sure many will disagree that a Naim network server feeding a streamer can influence the sound, and that playing direct from a Nas with whatever UPnP server spins your wheels will be equal or better sounding, but I know my system and room very very well and that's how I'm hearing' it.

Cheers

Rick.

 

you found that the uniticore gives better clarity and dynamics vs unitserve. Perhaps it is true, but for now you are the only one to find that. The litttle problem is that you are a naim dealer: sorry, i don't want to offense you, but it is a fact. But perhaps you are right...

nbpf posted:

Timmo1341 posted:

nbpf posted:

Sourav Mazumder posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

...

I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

...

Sorry to hear that. The dealer's behavior is not acceptable and certainly not in the interest of Naim.

I believe that, if you wanted to return the device, Naim would be open to offer you a fair deal.

I am not going to buy a Core at the moment but I am very much interested in what the March system update will bring. What is most needed is some clarity: at this point, it is very difficult to say which limitations and deficiencies are due to design choices and which are caused by mere implementational errors.

Not sure I understand why you think the dealer's refusal to accept a return is unacceptable? Unless the Core is faulty, or unless the purchase contract stipulated a 'cooling off' period during which the item could be returned for a refund, surely it's a classic example of caveat emptor ? It also illustrates very neatly the dangers of being an early adopter - far safer, in my experience, to wait for first or second revision before parting with the cash.

...

I think that the dealer refusal is unacceptable because two reasons: first because I would expect all Naim dealers to offer the same free return period. In many countries this by law two weeks. Thus, I would expect a dealer to accept a return within at least two weeks from the date of purchase. Second, because the Core does indeed seem to be faulty in many respects. Some basic functionalities have not yet been implemented or have been implemented with major flaws. Even assuming that upcoming system upgrades will readily solve the most severe issues, given things as they are now, it would be rather phony for a Naim dealer to argue that the Core is working according to specifications. I agree that, having bought a new product with incomplete specifications, early adopters have consciously decided to take risks for which they bear some responsibility. Still, Naim is well known for their fair dealing and I do not think that the dealer's refusal to accept a return within two weeks of purchase is, generally speaking, a sensible behavior. Of course, I do not know the details of the deal and there might be good reasons for the dealer's behavior. Best, nbpf

Hi Nbpf,

Thanks a lot for empathizing with my situation.

However, I am not really complaining against the dealer that they are not accepting return. I knew that they don't accept return before buying this. Neither the dealer pushed me to buy this unit.

It was my decision to go for Uniti Core based on some of the key features (like support for DSD, support for any UPnP etc.) I found in Naim Website about Uniti Core. Probably it was my foolishness to believe some of those features as described in the Uniti Core website. I am a Naim customer for last 10 yrs and Naim never disappointed me before.

Also, as you rightly mentioned, as early adapter I did expect that there would be bugs/issues. My belief was that they would rectify/enhance them. I lost my hope when the Naim technical support said that they don't have any plan to enhance/rectify the features I am unsatisfied with.

Regards,

Sourav

Sourav Mazumder posted:

nbpf posted:

Timmo1341 posted:

nbpf posted:

Sourav Mazumder posted:

Peter Lambert posted:

Im looking for a solution that lets me store all my existing music on a harddrive, possibly rip new cd directly (although this is not so important)  and then stream over the network with upnp (is that right), I dont understand the difference between unitserve and unitcore ?

I'm using it (or trying to make use of it) for last 2 weeks.

...

I am stuck with it as my dealer does not accept return.

...

Sorry to hear that. The dealer's behavior is not acceptable and certainly not in the interest of Naim.

I believe that, if you wanted to return the device, Naim would be open to offer you a fair deal.

I am not going to buy a Core at the moment but I am very much interested in what the March system update will bring. What is most needed is some clarity: at this point, it is very difficult to say which limitations and deficiencies are due to design choices and which are caused by mere implementational errors.

Not sure I understand why you think the dealer's refusal to accept a return is unacceptable? Unless the Core is faulty, or unless the purchase contract stipulated a 'cooling off' period during which the item could be returned for a refund, surely it's a classic example of caveat emptor ? It also illustrates very neatly the dangers of being an early adopter - far safer, in my experience, to wait for first or second revision before parting with the cash.

...

I think that the dealer refusal is unacceptable because two reasons: first ... Best, nbpf

...

Also, as you rightly mentioned, as early adapter I did expect that there would be bugs/issues. My belief was that they would rectify/enhance them. I lost my hope when the Naim technical support said that they don't have any plan to enhance/rectify the features I am unsatisfied with.

Let me put it like this: when I read slogans like "reinventing your music collection" I tend to be a bit skeptical. When I do not find any detailed technical specifications about the device that is supposed to reinvent my music collection, I become suspicious. I find it difficult to understand why so many people have run to buy the Core. But then, there are so many things that I do not understand! Still, I believe that one of the responsibilities of a dealer (and, therefore, of a Naim dealer) is to provide customers with products that meet their expectations. For this to work, two conditions have to be met: 1) customers have to spell out their expectations clearly and 2) dealers have to know what they are selling. If I was a Naim dealer and given what I know about the Core, I would not feel very comfortable selling it to all but enthusiasts. I hope that Naim dealers know a little bit more about the Core than what has been revealed to potential customers so far.  

jon honeyball posted:

To answer the OP question: "

What is the difference between unitserve and uniticore ?"

 

One is a product whose development path ceased in December 2014 and wont ever be restarted.

The other is a product whose development path is still happening. 

Another difference is that when the US came out it was a very innovative product whereas the Core, at this point, seems to be just a US clone with some missing features.

I think that is a bit harsh. It has some problems but it is at the start of its development journey and there are some very attractive aspects compared with its predecessor. Pretty well the only thing I miss right now is metadata editing and that is promised for the end of the month.

best

David

Would you buy a car with the promise that maybe, one day, reverse gear would be added? Or that the variable wiper speed may, with a following wind, be introduced?

Maybe HH, as long at is runs forward. SQ is all what matters here. It doesn't seem to go backward yet.

Chag -

David Hendon posted:

I think that is a bit harsh. It has some problems but it is at the start of its development journey and there are some very attractive aspects compared with its predecessor. Pretty well the only thing I miss right now is metadata editing and that is promised for the end of the month.

best

David

I agree that it's harsh. But, at this point, it is not clear to me what are the advantages of the Core over the US apart from the linear power supply. The lack of support for internet radio, internet streaming services, advanced UPnP servers (MinimServer, Asset) and wireless connectivity is, for a "server" that comes out 7 years after the US, unacceptable in my view. I very much hope that the March system upgrade will fix the metadata editing issue (but I am not convinced that it is a good idea to add metadata editing capabilities to the Naim app) and that the Core will step by step evolve to something more interesting than what it is now. Best, nbpf