Upgrade - dealer demo day

No stand at all? What will the boxes sit on? While I am no fan of the aesthetics of the Fraim, there are other makes available that are very effective (e.g. Isoblue, Quadraspire) and arguably less visually intrusive.

A good stand will make a lot more difference than the fanciest Ethernet cables in the world, and very likely more than a Powerline or Super Lumina cables. That's what needs sorting out first. The cables are the jelly diamonds and smarties on the cake. If the icing isn't properly supported then the smarties will slide off. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

A good stand will make a lot more difference than the fanciest Ethernet cables in the world, and very likely more than a Powerline or Super Lumina cables. That's what needs sorting out first. The cables are the jelly diamonds and smarties on the cake. If the icing isn't properly supported then the smarties will slide off. 

Sorry, I meant no Fraim!! I've gone for basic Isoblue, which sounds terrific!

That's ok then! You'd be well advised to get an extra shelf to get the 272 away from the power supply, as it will otherwise be very close. The Isoblue is really good : you had me worried....

I was also worried.  I've always been very happy with Isoblue. It appears your wife has good taste!

I look forward to your review after a home demo. It's a s ystem I'm seriously contemplating for my living room, to simplify the current setup.

Well, as a relative newcomer to the world of Naim, I 'm now beginning to appreciate just how good this equipment really is. After having my proposed purchases on home demo fot the last 2 weeks, my dealer arrived this morning to take them away ! Another prospective customer wants to listen to the 272/555PS/252DR combo, and ProAc want their K6s back.

I'm now sitting listening to my reinstated SuperUniti and ProAc D20rs, and really can't believe how what sounded so good a couple of weeks ago can now sound so small, thin and two dimensional!

Dont get me wrong, there's nothing wrong with the equipment or setup, it's just that it's been totally ruined for me by what I've been listening to for at least 5 hours a day for the past two weeks. I now understand the warnings given by the old sweats of not to listen unless you're prepared to buy!!

Still, the good news is that ProAc have scheduled in the build of my new speakers, and my dealer is about to place my order with Naim (to include Classic finish to my 555PS, as I don't intend ever parting with it, and even if I do I'm guessing there'll be more prospective 272 owning purchasers out there on the second hand market than 5 series owners). Happy Days will soon be here again!

Tim

Good to hear you have settled on the 555dr and 250dr,I am in week two of my home demo of the Xpsdr to go with my 272/250 dr.it sounds really terrific,but because of this thread,and a few others lately,I can't seem to get the 555 off my mind,I still use the din to xlr that came with my 250,did you order the Superlumina too?,and did you happen to compare it to the stock cable?I think I am leaning towards giving the Xps back,and ordering a 555dr,and a core.

No quarter posted:

Good to hear you have settled on the 555dr and 250dr,I am in week two of my home demo of the Xpsdr to go with my 272/250 dr.it sounds really terrific,but because of this thread,and a few others lately,I can't seem to get the 555 off my mind,I still use the din to xlr that came with my 250,did you order the Superlumina too?,and did you happen to compare it to the stock cable?I think I am leaning towards giving the Xps back,and ordering a 555dr,and a core.

Hi

Yes, Superlumina din/xlr has been stipulated! Compared to both stock I/c and Sarum Super ARAY, for me the SL was a clear winner. I honestly don't think you'll be disappointed with the 555 - it really does lift the 272 to another level. Good luck!

Tim

Tim - your point about the SU was interesting. It's a super machine, but like you, once I plugged it back in after using the 272/250 I found the difference was amazing, and that was without a separate power supply. 

Two things that are maybe worth mentioning, as you are getting the SL din to XLR: firstly it will sound very odd for the first few weeks, and secondly that it's important that it doesn't touch the floor or anything else. The same applies to the burndy lead. As you have the Isoblue, which is very low, this may be an issue. It's doubtless something your dealer has brought to your attention already and I'm sure you have plans to ensure that you get the best from the lead.

Thanks for that HH. Are you able to describe the effect upon the sound output of the cables you mentioned touching the floor or back wall? Space will be at a premium behind my system, and I'm not sure total isolation of the leads will be possible. I appreciate comparing myself is the only real way forward, but just how much of a compromise have you found it to be when the leads are less than ideally dressed? I do understand the search for perfection/ultimate optimisation, but are we talking about accepting perhaps just a 1% or 2% reduction in sound quality, or can it be a total auditory car crash?

If the cables - and I'm only referring to the Burndy and the SL wire here - do touch the wall or floor, you get a more muddled and confused sound, which is less relaxing to listen to. My take on all this tweakery is that if you are spending a lot of money on your boxes and speakers then it's totally logicical to eke the best from it. In my experience a smaller cheaper system set up to within an inch of its life can knock spots off a big flash setup that's slung together with no care and attention. To some people none of this matters, which is perfectly fine of course. You go as far as you feel comfortable - I'd never use cable risers for speaker leads - in fact my speaker cable runs through a conduit behind the fireplace, which I'm sure is not ideal. 

Is the Superlumina din to xlr the same length as the stock cable?The reason i ask,i have 4 levels of Fraim,which gives me 5 spaces for gear.On top is the 272,two spaces down is the 250 dr,and two spaces down from there is the xpsdr.In this configuration the Burndy hangs free,and does not touch anything,the din to xlr also hangs free,although it kind of grazes the back of the rack a bit.I just want to keep the same length  as the stock cable,if that is possible...if i end up getting the Superlumina.I guess the next question would be,am i better to get the din to xlr before Superlumina speaker cables,i use Naca5 right now,with the stock din to xlr?

My din to xlr is 1m long. 

No quarter posted:

Is the Superlumina din to xlr the same length as the stock cable?The reason i ask,i have 4 levels of Fraim,which gives me 5 spaces for gear.On top is the 272,two spaces down is the 250 dr,and two spaces down from there is the xpsdr.In this configuration the Burndy hangs free,and does not touch anything,the din to xlr also hangs free,although it kind of grazes the back of the rack a bit.I just want to keep the same length  as the stock cable,if that is possible...if i end up getting the Superlumina.I guess the next question would be,am i better to get the din to xlr before Superlumina speaker cables,i use Naca5 right now,with the stock din to xlr?

As per HH's reply, 1m long. I don't know length of the stock cable. Given the difference the SL interconnect made, I would personally go for that before replacing what is, for many, perfectably acceptable (some say preferable to SL) speaker cable. If I had to choose, in my own system, I would keep my Epic Twin speaker cable and buy the SL interconnect rather than buy the Epic Reference I have chosen and keep the stock i/c. Hope that makes sense?!

Err..., I beg to differ. SL speaker cables knocks the socks off NACA5 IMO and that is from a NACA5 user for many, many years. You are right to point out that opinion here differs which means the only sensible advice is to carry out a home demo of the cables you are considering in your system, in your listening environment. Most, if not all Naim dealers will accommodate this with SL cables.

Thanks guys,that is the same length as the stock cable then,I am scared to ask the price...I think I will stick with the Naca5 speaker cables for a while.

Timmo1341 posted:

No quarter posted:

Is the Superlumina din to xlr the same length as the stock cable?The reason i ask,i have 4 levels of Fraim,which gives me 5 spaces for gear.On top is the 272,two spaces down is the 250 dr,and two spaces down from there is the xpsdr.In this configuration the Burndy hangs free,and does not touch anything,the din to xlr also hangs free,although it kind of grazes the back of the rack a bit.I just want to keep the same length  as the stock cable,if that is possible...if i end up getting the Superlumina.I guess the next question would be,am i better to get the din to xlr before Superlumina speaker cables,i use Naca5 right now,with the stock din to xlr?

As per HH's reply, 1m long. I don't know length of the stock cable. Given the difference the SL interconnect made, I would personally go for that before replacing what is, for many, perfectably acceptable (some say preferable to SL) speaker cable. If I had to choose, in my own system, I would keep my Epic Twin speaker cable and buy the SL interconnect rather than buy the Epic Reference I have chosen and keep the stock i/c. Hope that makes sense?!

Sort of.... I'd be wary of mixing SL and Chord. The SL cables seem to build on each other, though I don't use the interconnect, just the din to XLR and speaker wires. 

Hungryhalibut posted:

Timmo1341 posted:

No quarter posted:

Is the Superlumina din to xlr the same length as the stock cable?The reason i ask,i have 4 levels of Fraim,which gives me 5 spaces for gear.On top is the 272,two spaces down is the 250 dr,and two spaces down from there is the xpsdr.In this configuration the Burndy hangs free,and does not touch anything,the din to xlr also hangs free,although it kind of grazes the back of the rack a bit.I just want to keep the same length  as the stock cable,if that is possible...if i end up getting the Superlumina.I guess the next question would be,am i better to get the din to xlr before Superlumina speaker cables,i use Naca5 right now,with the stock din to xlr?

As per HH's reply, 1m long. I don't know length of the stock cable. Given the difference the SL interconnect made, I would personally go for that before replacing what is, for many, perfectably acceptable (some say preferable to SL) speaker cable. If I had to choose, in my own system, I would keep my Epic Twin speaker cable and buy the SL interconnect rather than buy the Epic Reference I have chosen and keep the stock i/c. Hope that makes sense?!

Sort of.... I'd be wary of mixing SL and Chord. The SL cables seem to build on each other, though I don't use the interconnect, just the din to XLR and speaker wires. 

Indeed I have found that mixing Chord and SL cables did not work in my system. There is definitely a synergistic effect as you add more SL cables into a loom.

I would not mix two types of cables together,if anything it will be all Superlumina. If i recall,most people went with the speaker cables first,but that would be a much bigger cost i would think,i only need one din to xlr,and i would think that i would benefit most here,since i use the stock cable right now,a lot of these guys were coming from witch hat,or better cables.

As I use a separate source (NDS) and pre amp, I use a SL interconnect and have SL speaker cables (replacing NACA5) but retain my Witch Hat DIN/XLR as I can't justify further outlay at the moment on the SL DIN/XLR. As I only need 3m lengths of SL speaker cable, the cost was manageable. I do understand that this may be an issue in deciding which SL cable to go for if you need longer lengths of speaker cables.

Actually 3 meter lengths would work for me,I use 7 meter Naca5,simply because I got a good deal on it.Does the recommended 5 to 7 meters length not matter as much with Superlumina,or is it just a cost thing?

No quarter posted:

Actually 3 meter lengths would work for me,I use 7 meter Naca5,simply because I got a good deal on it.Does the recommended 5 to 7 meters length not matter as much with Superlumina,or is it just a cost thing?

No the minimum 3.5m and recommended 5m length only applies to NACA5. The SL speaker cable is supplied in a 3m length as a standard length which is what I use.

If 3m lengths of SL speaker cables would work for you than I would suggest to home demo both the SL speaker cables and the SL DIN/XLR and see what gives you a biggest bang for your buck.

If you do borrow SL cables for home demo make sure they are properly run in.

Good luck.

I'm truly confused! Surely a DIN to XLR lead is an 'interconnect'? 

As for not mixing leads and cables from seperate manufacturers, I beg to differ. The Superlumina DIN to XLR worked beautifully with Chord Epic Reference speaker cable in my lounge for my demo. When I replaced the Epic Reference with Superlumina the sound lost all its attack, and reminded me of a cup of silky smooth hot chocolate compared to a strong, powerful, edgy espresso. When the Epic Reference went back on and the SL interconnect was substituted by Chord Sarum Super ARAY, things took a turn for the worse - good, but not as good, to my ears which are all that matters when it comes to my system!

So, I'm sure that to others this quoted synergy between all things Naim surely exists, but I'll stick to my Naim and Chord mix.

I used to mix Chord and SuperLumina cables - it was OK, but not great. Order and happiness was restored once I completed the full SL loom on my main Naim rig. At that point I also moved from NACA5 to SL speaker cables.