Core and Naim App Updates ??

I just updated to iOS v5.6. It appears that I don't have the links to the Rovi content and/or to Amazon on tracks played from a USB stick anymore. Did I miss something? 

Chag -

After rebooting my Core and reinstalling the app and cursing quietly to myself a few times - it works!  I have been able to enter the track names and album art with ease.  Hallelujah. 

SC posted:

nbpf posted:

SC posted:

ChrisSU posted:

Richard Morris posted:

mikeyjfs posted:

…There are third party metadata editors out there.  I did try Metadatics (on Mac) for one or two items, before I got steered away by Naim on the basis of possible database corruption....

 

A worrying statement - I use Metadatics on a UnitiServe - any more details?

For CD rips, Naim's acvice is that you should only use N-Serve for metadata editing, and never make any changes to music files and folders by accessing them on a computer. For downloads, this does not apply, Metadatics is fine, and they are stored in a separate folder.

Richard – as ChrisSU correctly states,...

Providing you can gain access to the Naim rips, there is actually nothing stopping you embedding metadata in the files (inc WAV) with 3rd party software – however I think the advice not to stems from the fear that it could potentially corrupt the internal database, i.e that, with the external text info file still in place, it sees two sets of metadata and starts to get itself in a pickle......

But wouldn't it be possible to export the internal rips, do all the metadata editing on a platform/tool of one's choice and reimport the files to the downloads folder?

...

Absolutely correct. And actually the only way to do it (as far as I'm aware) as you are prevented from putting the files back into the internal store of the US and only have access to the 'user' Downloads folder.....This was all my grand plan – but I sort of hit a wall when it became apparent the US only really handles the few main 'top level' tag fields (Album, Artist, Title, Date etc) and besides, the App doesn't display and utilise all the additional extended metadata anyway......

...

This is one of the reasons why I have not bought a US and why I find the new uniti range so deeply depressing.

Naim pretends to be developing solutions for music enthusiasts. As a matter of fact, however, they are only developing for users that do not care about classical music, opera and, more generally, about how their music can be organized and browsed.

The latest announcement that  "Editing of Composers and Conductors will not be enabled and is not currently planned as a future update" on the Core says it all. What's wrong with editing the Composer and Conductor indexes?  Why is editing Artist enabled but editing Conductor is not? This is simply beyond belief ...

I have grown increasingly dissatisfied with the Core app on my ipad mini.  Artwork takes too long to load so that when I try to select an album the app is slowly adding photos and the titles move across the screen.  There does not seem to be a way to disable the artwork feature.  When I try to search by artist or genre I have the same problems but worse.  Today the app won't let me select at all by artist or genre.  I'm using my Core at my office for now and had planned to bring it home this Fall.  However, if the app isn't significantly improved and or functioning as it should I will be dumping it on the used market.  It seems to me Naim has bit off more than it can chew with the Core.  The sound is great, but if the search method barely works, what's the point?  

David Hendon posted:

nbpf posted:

SC posted:

Please Note:

- Editing of Composers and Conductors will not be enabled and is not currently planned as a future update.  
- The metadata editing functionality is based solely within the app, there is no desktop editing functionality.
- Only ripped CDs or CDs imported from a previous Naim server that have been ripped, can be edited.
- Music content in the Downloads Folder cannot be edited so the option will not be available.
- 'Artist Name' cannot be changed globally, only on a per CD basis.
- When a Uniti Core is updated to the firmware which includes the 'Edit Metadata' feature, if the database already includes music from a previously imported Naim collection any user edits applied on that collection will be reinstated automatically.

At least we know that Naim is joining Trump's pre-emptive strike on classical music. The "will not be enabled" in the first commandment is great: let's make sure that all these sick classical music intellectuals know that we could actually do it if we wanted so. Terrific. Great.

I think Naim mean "won't be enabled by this update" rather than "they are there but we aren't going to enable them".

best

David

If the message to be conveyed was that editing of Composers and Conductors is currently not supported and that support for future releases is not planned, I would have expected Naim to just say so.

I am not a native speaker but my understanding is that one enables or activates features that are present but disabled.

I very much suspect that this is actually the case for the Core: the Core's ripper is likely to store Composer and Conductor metadata into Naim's internal database. These could be edited in much the same way as Artist can be edited, but Naim has decided not to support doing so.

Why editing Artist is enabled but editing Composer and Conductor is disabled is a question that Naim does not appear to consider being worth to explain in the notes that accompany Firmware Update v1.4.

Ian Brown posted:

I have grown increasingly dissatisfied with the Core app on my ipad mini.  Artwork takes too long to load so that when I try to select an album the app is slowly adding photos and the titles move across the screen.  There does not seem to be a way to disable the artwork feature.  When I try to search by artist or genre I have the same problems but worse.  Today the app won't let me select at all by artist or genre.  I'm using my Core at my office for now and had planned to bring it home this Fall.  However, if the app isn't significantly improved and or functioning as it should I will be dumping it on the used market.  It seems to me Naim has bit off more than it can chew with the Core.  The sound is great, but if the search method barely works, what's the point?  

Hi,

There shouldn't be any issues with speed when loading artwork (except for possibly the first time - the app should cache from there on).

Can you take me a video showing what you are seeing? Also what is the issue that you are having with searching? Perhaps you could contact us at Naim Tech support - support@naimaudio.com and we'll try to assist?

Best

Phil Harris

nbpf posted:

If the message to be conveyed was that editing of Composers and Conductors is currently not supported and that support for future releases is not planned, I would have expected Naim to just say so.

I am not a native speaker but my understanding is that one enables or activates features that are present but disabled.

I very much suspect that this is actually the case for the Core: the Core's ripper is likely to store Composer and Conductor metadata into Naim's internal database. These could be edited in much the same way as Artist can be edited, but Naim has decided not to support doing so.

Why editing Artist is enabled but editing Composer and Conductor is disabled is a question that Naim does not appear to consider being worth to explain in the notes that accompany Firmware Update v1.4.

Hi,

Composer and conductor editing is not supported in 1.4 - that doesn't mean that it will never be added in the future but I believe that that decision is still to be made.

Best

Phil

Phil Harris posted:

nbpf posted:

If the message to be conveyed was that editing of Composers and Conductors is currently not supported and that support for future releases is not planned, I would have expected Naim to just say so.

I am not a native speaker but my understanding is that one enables or activates features that are present but disabled.

I very much suspect that this is actually the case for the Core: the Core's ripper is likely to store Composer and Conductor metadata into Naim's internal database. These could be edited in much the same way as Artist can be edited, but Naim has decided not to support doing so.

Why editing Artist is enabled but editing Composer and Conductor is disabled is a question that Naim does not appear to consider being worth to explain in the notes that accompany Firmware Update v1.4.

Hi,

Composer and conductor editing is not supported in 1.4 - that doesn't mean that it will never be added in the future but I believe that that decision is still to be made.

Best

Phil

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable but Composer or Conductor or, in fact, whatever other field should not. It is rather bizarre that the question of whether a field should be editable or not is raised at all. If a field can be populated with metadata, it should be editable. This is particularly true for fields for which different tagging schemes are typically used. Some people prefer to see composers in "firstname lastname" format. Others prefer "lastname, firstaname" or other formats. Same for Artist, Conductor, etc. Best, nbpf 

Phil Harris posted:

Ian Brown posted:

I have grown increasingly dissatisfied with the Core app on my ipad mini.  Artwork takes too long to load so that when I try to select an album the app is slowly adding photos and the titles move across the screen.  There does not seem to be a way to disable the artwork feature.  When I try to search by artist or genre I have the same problems but worse.  Today the app won't let me select at all by artist or genre.  I'm using my Core at my office for now and had planned to bring it home this Fall.  However, if the app isn't significantly improved and or functioning as it should I will be dumping it on the used market.  It seems to me Naim has bit off more than it can chew with the Core.  The sound is great, but if the search method barely works, what's the point?  

Hi,

There shouldn't be any issues with speed when loading artwork (except for possibly the first time - the app should cache from there on).

Can you take me a video showing what you are seeing? Also what is the issue that you are having with searching? Perhaps you could contact us at Naim Tech support - support@naimaudio.com and we'll try to assist?

Best

Phil Harris

Will do, thanks.

nbpf posted:

Phil Harris posted:

nbpf posted:

If the message to be conveyed was that editing of Composers and Conductors is currently not supported and that support for future releases is not planned, I would have expected Naim to just say so.

I am not a native speaker but my understanding is that one enables or activates features that are present but disabled.

I very much suspect that this is actually the case for the Core: the Core's ripper is likely to store Composer and Conductor metadata into Naim's internal database. These could be edited in much the same way as Artist can be edited, but Naim has decided not to support doing so.

Why editing Artist is enabled but editing Composer and Conductor is disabled is a question that Naim does not appear to consider being worth to explain in the notes that accompany Firmware Update v1.4.

Hi,

Composer and conductor editing is not supported in 1.4 - that doesn't mean that it will never be added in the future but I believe that that decision is still to be made.

Best

Phil

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable but Composer or Conductor or, in fact, whatever other field should not. It is rather bizarre that the question of whether a field should be editable or not is raised at all. If a field can be populated with metadata, it should be editable. This is particularly true for fields for which different tagging schemes are typically used. Some people prefer to see composers in "firstname lastname" format. Others prefer "lastname, firstaname" or other formats. Same for Artist, Conductor, etc. Best, nbpf 

I think it's quite simply that most of our Naim friends at Salisbury don't listen to classical music and so didn't understand why anyone would ever care about composer or conductor. This is also probably why they thought launching the Core without metadata editing was a good short cut to adopt.

Anyway no doubt it will all get fixed and hopefully the lesson will not be lost for future product launches.

best

David

David Hendon posted:

nbpf posted:

Phil Harris posted:

nbpf posted:

If the message to be conveyed was that editing of Composers and Conductors is currently not supported and that support for future releases is not planned, I would have expected Naim to just say so.

I am not a native speaker but my understanding is that one enables or activates features that are present but disabled.

I very much suspect that this is actually the case for the Core: the Core's ripper is likely to store Composer and Conductor metadata into Naim's internal database. These could be edited in much the same way as Artist can be edited, but Naim has decided not to support doing so.

Why editing Artist is enabled but editing Composer and Conductor is disabled is a question that Naim does not appear to consider being worth to explain in the notes that accompany Firmware Update v1.4.

Hi,

Composer and conductor editing is not supported in 1.4 - that doesn't mean that it will never be added in the future but I believe that that decision is still to be made.

Best

Phil

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable but Composer or Conductor or, in fact, whatever other field should not. It is rather bizarre that the question of whether a field should be editable or not is raised at all. If a field can be populated with metadata, it should be editable. This is particularly true for fields for which different tagging schemes are typically used. Some people prefer to see composers in "firstname lastname" format. Others prefer "lastname, firstaname" or other formats. Same for Artist, Conductor, etc. Best, nbpf 

I think it's quite simply that most of our Naim friends at Salisbury don't listen to classical music and so didn't understand why anyone would ever care about composer or conductor. This is also probably why they thought launching the Core without metadata editing was a good short cut to adopt.

Anyway no doubt it will all get fixed and hopefully the lesson will not be lost for future product launches.

best

David

I do not think that product managers have to listen to (or care about) classical music to understand why customers might care about composers or conductors. I also do not expect a line of products built around a new platform to be fully functional at shipping time. But I do expect a company like Naim to know where they are and where they want to be. The note issued together with Firmware Update v1.4 suggests that this is not the case. It is an awkward sequel of caveats written in an arrogant and dismissing tone. It demonstates no understanding of what users actually need and expect. Best, nbpf 

nbpf posted:

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable

Given the random selection of genres you find when downloading or ripping a CD, this is a field I would want to edit for virtually all albums, otherwise you end up with a meaningless selection of genres to search.

I do find it a little odd that Naim are reluctant to offer a wider range of editable metadata fields. Is there a technical reason why this is difficult? Surely if you can make some fields editable, you can make all of them editable? 

ChrisSU posted:

nbpf posted:

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable

Given the random selection of genres you find when downloading or ripping a CD, this is a field I would want to edit for virtually all albums, otherwise you end up with a meaningless selection of genres to search.

...

Absolutely, every field that is served should be editable! My full remark was "From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable but Composer or Conductor or, in fact, whatever other field should not.", I believe.

ChrisSU posted:

nbpf posted:

From a user's perspective, there is no reason why Artist or Genre should be editable

...

I do find it a little odd that Naim are reluctant to offer a wider range of editable metadata fields. Is there a technical reason why this is difficult? Surely if you can make some fields editable, you can make all of them editable? 

One would indeed expect that if one field can be edited, all fields can be edited. Metadata editing is about adding fields, removing fields and editing field values. If some of these operations are not supported or are only partially supported, there could be technical reasons, of course. But these could only be explained with a poor software design because we know that most metadata editing tools support these operations flawlessly.

By the way: Naim could easily have avoided all the problems with metadata by simply implementing a functionality that makes it possible for users to export the files of the music folder with their metadata in .flac format.